To think children shouldn't be taken out of school for holidays?

[MidiMitch]

Just that really. An article today says four million school days a year are being lost by parents removing children for holidays. I am a teacher so probably rather biased on this but I think it's dreadful that children are taken out of school because of a cheap holiday. I definitely think that more needs to be done to stop the hiking up of prices in holiday time but I don't think the answer is to disrupt a child's education.

McDougall I don't think either of us have the stats on that, but I was telling you my personal experience. I missed a LOT of school and did fine, based on that, I don't think missing a week or two each year is the end of the world.

I think education is highly important and I’ve always stressed to my kids that they need to work hard. I’ll sit with them and help them when they struggle and teach them that a good education gives you choices in life.

However, education is not just about school. A child’s whole life is an education. I think going away on holiday is educational. Even if it is a week on a beach resort. Just experiencing an airport, flying, seeing signs in a different language, hearing the language spoken.
It’s all educational and I think it should be up to the parent whether or not they take a child out of school for a holiday.

Why are people assuming that all of these holidays are two weeks all inclusive in Benidorm? Mine certainly aren’t. But even so, even a week in a caravan in Cleethorpes broadens the mind if it’s outside the normal scope of experience. Going to different places, doing different things, spending quality time with loved ones - you don’t have to trek in the himalayas for holidays to be worthwhile. I do agree that it’s harsh that a teacher’s performance is measured on the success of pupils who might have been absent, but that’s another issue.

I will be taking DS out of school for 2 days in December this year for a trip to Lapland. He will be in Year One.

This will be the only time I do this as I can afford to take him away in the school holidays, this is a one off.

I don't feel guilty about it. It will be a once in a lifetime experience for him and he'll be 5 years old so he's hardly going to miss anything important.

I personally wouldn't do it with older children though and don't intend to do it again.

Four million school days per year is about one per child on average.

How many are lost to school inset days, or bank holidays, or sickness?

Well I have done it a few times in the many many years' of my kids' education but it was never for the "cheap holidays". Reasons I can think of are: 1 - Having children at different schools which meant half terms were different most of the year, and I was only able to take set amount of holiday. 2 - Having one very poorly parent in a different country and not being able to go without the children as DH away with work.

I can't say my children's education was affected in any way shape of form to be honest. But then it's not been every year, twice a year, more like once every 2 or 3 years and never anywhere near any important exams.

fwiw I don't think teachers strike 'incessantly' and believe if they do so it's with good reason. And no, I don't think a few days of striking will destroy my dc's academic career either.

Depends what age and when/ for how long. I don't think it impacts a great deal at primary age and ime the last few days of term are usually wind down time, so how much are the children actually going to miss of proper education if they miss a few days at the end of term? I think it also depends on how much time they've missed already and whether their progress is satisfactory generally.

I understand though that it's hard for teachers when children take two weeks in the middle of term time. But then the onus should be on parents, not teachers, to ensure their children are brought up to date with what everyone else has learned in the two weeks they've been off. Since that's impossible due to varying levels of parental engagement, it seems difficult to see a situation in which a lengthy absence during term time is acceptable.

I agree that taking a child out of school for two weeks during GCSE year is disruptive. However I took my 10 and 7 year old out of school for 1 day so we could fly to NYC on the cheapest day (the rest of the holiday was in half term) I think the benefits of the holiday outweighed the day off, especially as most of a Friday is taken up with PE and Golden Time. Like all things it's not black and white but many shades of grey.

I think I'm going to name change in case anyone confuses me with newyearnewme18 and I'm viewed as a numpty evermore.

Yes, no school days are lost to bank holidays or inset days, the statutory number of school days is calculated on top of these.

I preferred it when the head could grant 2 weeks. We took DS out for a week twice in infants. One was a week in a caravan at the seaside and the other self catering in Surrey visiting theme parks/attractions without massive queues. Huge savings over school holiday prices. In juniors we have been more reluctant mostly due to the fines and lack of permission although many parents I know have just took that into the cost of the holiday. Last year (y5) we took a couple of days at the end of easter and has 2 weeks abroad. By going Wed-Wed it was cheaper to have 2 wks AI than a week which fell inside the holiday dates (even with Monday as an inset day). Mostly we go in school holidays by shopping around and adjusting our expectations. I will be less inclined to take him out at secondary and certainly won’t as GCSEs approach.

In our school parents tend to tell the headmaster, (Usually in writing) that they are off to xxx on these dates. He says 'great, enjoy, you do realise it'll be unauthorised?', parents say 'of course'.

Why the face?

Just that really. An article today says four million school days a year are being lost by parents removing children for holidays. I am a teacher so probably rather biased on this but I think it's dreadful that children are taken out of school because of a cheap holiday. I definitely think that more needs to be done to stop the hiking up of prices in holiday time but I don't think the answer is to disrupt a child's education.

I think time spent with family relaxing when most parent s both work or enjoying another culture is worth twice what a school can give them during that time. The amount of learning time isvery small in reality and school times could be halved if children were getting one on one time. Parents can keep up with that easily in the holiday.

I've done it, I'd do it again.

Mumsnet is full of people saying how wrong it is to take dc out of school for holidays but in the real world LOTS of people do it - as the evidence shows.

I am one of the people who takes my dc out of school. I have two dc, one has autism and is 5 and one is 15. Admittedly we will not take them out of school this year or the next because of the eldest ones gcse work. But in previous years we always have- the youngest ones autism means he wouldn’t cope with the crowds and noise in peak holiday times. We have always applied for time off school for both under these reasons and never had any problems with the school agreeing.

Of course I understand every child is different but it hasn’t made any difference to the academic achievements of our eldest child who is in the top sets in all subjects.

We do keep repeating that inset days are taken from school holidays, not added to them, so no days are lost to them, or to bank holidays.

There have been suggestions over the years about changing school terms to give more flexibility and make it presumably less likely that travel companies would discount prices as much as they do out of current holiday times. The trouble is that, if every authority chose their own term and holiday times, it would create more flexibility, but also make it impossible to plan family holidays if children were in different schools and maybe even different authorities.

I do think some flexibility with the odd day for a family event, or tacked on to the beginning or end of an authorised holiday is a good idea, but A fortnight in the middle of a term is very difficult to catch up on.

Why the face?

Because unless you are the head’s conjoined twin, you have no way of knowing what conversations he has with parents about unauthorised absence.

I get that it’s a good way to present your school as cool and relaxed about attendance though.

I think it depends on the circumstances as in what year the child is in, up to year 5 is fine I think but secondary a big No due to the amount of subjects and work.

The time of year so it shouldn't be before exam time. But the last week of term would be ok. And of course the duration a week is 5 days is fine but over that is too much.

Think it also depends on the teacher and their reaction that is if they think it's ok or if they think it will be detrimental to the child and if they will give work.

Not all people can travel in the summer due to destination weather or prices.

I’m a teacher and break up earlier for Easter than my two DC. They won’t be going to school-we’ll be beating the Easter traffic on the way to Devon!!

They’re 3 and 7 though and it’s just one day but, hey!

If I wasn’t a teacher myself I wouldn’t hesitate to take them out at primary age because they do nothing in the last week of term. At secondary (my level) we have normal lessons until the last moment - videos and quizzes are banned so I wouldn’t do it then.

suburban Its exactly the response we get from our headmistress

Took the dcs to Australia when they were in Year one - we tagged 2 weeks on to the Easter holidays because it was the best time for us to travel. Feel entirely comfortable with dcs having a few extra days off at primary especially if they are usually excellent attenders but absolutely not at Secondary - kids don't even want to miss a class for a genuine medical reason.

We get that same response from the headteacher too.
She loves to travel herself and thinks it’s hugely beneficial.