Why can’t America ban automatic weapons?

[MaryPoppinsPenguins]

I don’t get it. I honestly don’t. After Sandy Hook that should have been enough... statistics speak for themselves.

Why? What don’t I get?

Re the border with Mexico: Canada shares a border with a country with a plentiful, varied supply of guns. Canada has tighter gun regs than the US. Canada has a much lower rate of gun crime (not zero). So tighter regs help.

bluepears check out a more up to date graph.

Canada has a different gun mentality too.
The regs will only get you so far.

There is something inherent in the nature of America that believes the way to prevent being shot at is the threat of shooting them back harder. That's carried over right into the very nature of the US - anybody who threatens us, will face even bigger retribution. The biggest military, the biggest weapons, the biggest idiot in charge!

bluepears check out a more up to date graph.

it wouldnt invallidate my point that the ban came in it had no effect yes i know its down now but you cant argue that because of a law passed 20 years ago. i think youve misunderstood my point or i have not explained my point well there is no evidence to say in the uk the gun law passed in 1999 had a direct effect on gun crime therefore if the us banned semi assault rifles that would have no effect on us gun crime

Here’s a more up to date graph

That's the point. Many countries, including ours, have semi automatic guns without the issues the US has.

There isn't even correlation there, let alone causation.

Julie8008

You use the word violent crime. This thread is about gun crime and gun related deaths. Yes, there is an overwhelming evidence that the US suffers massively more gun deaths than countries like the UK. Just read the links of this thread or google it. It isn't hard to research.

Oh please. I am interested in comparative rates of violent crime because there is a belief on this thread that the US is far more violent than the UK, yet that belief has been contradicted by the various people who have lived in both countries. Rates of violent crime clearly encompass gun crime, and are relevant to the claim (or disproving the claim) that gun ownership makes society safer. It's not a belief I share, but it should be perfectly possible to discuss it without being patronising. I am here reading this thread because I am genuinely interested in these issues. I do not own a gun, I do not have a hidden agenda.

In fact, here’s the whole report for you:

researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-7654/CBP-7654.pdf

Technology advances all the time too. What are the next gen guns going to look like? Even if it's not possible to remove all the guns already in circulation in the US, does anyone seriously think it is a good idea to allow even more efficient weapons of mass murder to enter the market?

And if that one limited graph from 2007 that shows an increase of 10 deaths in one year is the best you can back up your argument with, then all it proves is how weak your argument is bluepears

There is more violent crime per capita in the US than the UK - considerably more.
However, each country's method of logging and categorising such crimes can differ, so it's not always a perfect match / like for like.

The US murder rate is 5 times that of Europe (per capita). Murder is not the only form of violence of course, but it's just one example of such a large difference:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

For bluepears sake - the firearms offense in that report is a broad range where a firearm is present. It's not representative of an actual shooting.

It also covers things like improper storage and a licence holder breaching conditions on their licence. (Actually super easy to do if you aren't careful)

ok squishy aquirmy show me one country in the world that brought in gun controls which directly lead to a fall in gun crime

As biggreygoose says, automatic vs semi-automatic vs other refers to trigger function.

Automatic = squeeze trigger and bullets come out until you stop squeezing (or until the mazagine empties).

Semi-automatic = squeeze trigger, gun fires a bullet, squeeze again, gun fires a bullet.

Other: gun fires, and you e.g. have to use the bolt to discard the spent cartridge and move another into the firing chamber. Much slower to fire.

Lots of .22 hunting rifles (suitable only for hunting small game like rabbits) are semi-automatic.

the ban did not work its a simple fact news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1440764.stm

Bluepears.

Australia.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.theatlantic.com/amp/article/541710/

Next.

South Africa brought in gun control in 2004 and it fell by 21%
Australia introduced gun control in stages and saw a 20% drop (they actually implemented a 'buy back' incentive for people to hand in guns and got over 700,000 of them back)

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/mar/15/so-america-this-is-how-you-do-gun-control

bluepears

Here, let me correct that for you

Staggering

Gun murders are more relevant, as you would expect gun related offences to increase after gun control is brought in due to something previously legal becoming illegal.

Gun VIOLENCE in the UK has dropped over time since tighter regs were brought in. It was not an immediate drop (again as you would expect) but as more and more ammunition and guns have been brought off the streets, gun violence has steadily dropped.

Regulation by itself isn't enough- you need enforcement too.

Can't link on my phone.

www.abc.net.au/news/2016-04-28/fact-check-gun-homicides-and-suicides-john-howard-port-arthur/7254880 ' research argues the reforms did not significantly influence firearm homicide rates or already falling rates of firearm suicide.' next

TheBrilliantMistake

^There is more violent crime per capita in the US than the UK - considerably more.
However, each country's method of logging and categorising such crimes can differ, so it's not always a perfect match / like for like.^

Actually, I would have thought it was relatively easy to compare as, firstly, we are comparing violent crime, definitions of which are similar everywhere, particularly so when comparing between two common-law jurisdictions. I expect there is a comparison somewhere. Do you have one? If you don't, don't make the claim.

As for South Africa, gun ownership and crime is so poorly recorded that their statistics can't be relied on. The police routinely don't investigate crimes because they are under-resourced, disorganised and bribable. For historical reasons, there is a culture of suspicion of the government, and therefore gun control is routinely circumvented. And finally, there is corruption in the government too, so a 21% drop in (what exactly?) could simply be the government instructing their statisticians to release a good news story.

Rino - interesting article, but this :

"The aftermath of Hungerford brought to an end the right to own semi-automatic firearms in Britain; they were banned along with pump action weapons, and registration became mandatory for shotgun owners"

Is factually incorrect. Makes me wary of the rest of the article....

south africa youve got to be joking businesstech.co.za/news/government/91284/south-africa-is-the-second-worst-country-for-gun-deaths-in-the-world/

You said I am glad people at her schools have guns available nearby.

Did you take from that that I think randoms should be given guns and encouraged to wander round the school?

I can assure you, there is absolutely no way my child would be at a school where that was the case.