To expect reassurance this man has not been near our DC?

[FreeFolk]

DC are in a local scout group. There is a Facebook group for parents, for checking times, places, lost property and so on.

Last night a scout parent posted a link to a local newspaper article about a scout leader in another local group being found guilty and sentenced for making and possessing images/films of children. They asked had this man been around our DC? There were quickly several other comments of outrage and concern. We did recognise the photo and have seen him at parades, competitions and camps.

There was one reply from a leader. Saying there should not be a witch hunt and for the group leader to decide if this post should stay on the page. It was shortly after deleted.

AIBU to think an email should have been sent to address this?

yes but that was just one individual's experience mustbemad...
Why are people so keen to dismiss this?

Even when countless teachers, nursery workers and scouting leaders have been convicted of crimes against children.

Why?

So have you pulled your kids out of school then Dull? Given that ' countless teachers & nursery workers' have also been convicted of offences against children?

no mustbe, I didn't. I just kept a very close eye.

Which is what parents are supposed to do is it not? You haven't blanketed all teachers as paedos then otherwise you would remove them...so why doesn't the same apply elsewhere??? I don't understand the logic

Jesus, Dull, you must never allow your kids near any adults with an attitude like that. You sure you're not a paedophile as well if all adults coming into contact with kids are???

Plenty of Teachers, nursery staff, sports coaches etc have been convicted of crimes against children. You don’t go pulling them out of school/football/gymnastics because someone in another group has been convicted!!!
It’s very close to home for the OP and she is entitled to seek reassurance from the leaders of her group. She should ask the exec committee (GSL, chair, treasurer and secretary plus some others) for a statement and details of the contact this man has had.

Scouts have a lot of safeguards in place and so the possibility of something happening is as reduced as it can be.

I do resent the implication that all scout leaders are Peados! My DH is a beaver leader, he only did it as they were desperate for leaders and if you helped your child got bumped to the top of the very long waiting list! We have more women leaders across the group then men, I am the treasurer and most of the leaders are parents of children in my kids school/classes. Everyone is regularly DBS checked, and no leader should ever be alone with a single child.

DBS checks don't mean anything.

Just because something isn't 'on record' doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

Not to mention all uniformed volunteers do extensive training, on many many different things, including mandatory ongoing learning of annual safety and safeguarding refreshers.

No it doesn’t but it is grossly unfair and outright ignorance to lump all scout leaders in with a few wrong uns. You don’t see the FA getting bashed constantly after the revelation of abuse in children’s coaching yet we constantly hear about scout leaders being dodgy. Leave scout leaders alone! They work hard and give up a lot of time for other people’s children- not for nefarious reasons but mostly because they really benefitted from scouting as a child and want to pay it forward.

It's ignorant attitudes like yours, Dull, that put people off volunteering with children and denies kids positive experiences and role models.

Another one dismayed by the ‘all scout leaders are paedos’ accusation.

I’m really sorry that some of you have had bad experiences. Genuinely, truly so. But my DH got involved because he wanted kids in our village to have the same fun he had as a child sewhere, when the group was low on leaders. He does at least 5 and often closer to 12 hours a week on scouting stuff, gives up annual leave, and has roped in the rest of us (‘yes of course I’ll buy pancake ingredients/write a quiz/cater for 30 people for a week in a field without running water whilst pregnant...’)

OP, you can ring Gilwell Park, the scout association hq, in the morning and they should be prepared to tell you everything. I agree your group Facebook page hasn’t handled it well, (I’d expect a prepared statement in nothing else, as well as reassurance and the offer of face to face meeting if you wanted), but no one is paid for this stuff, therefore it is sometimes handled badly.

I'd agree DBS is an imperfect system but we need something. Does anyone have any ideas for an alternative system to highlight offenders or potential offenders?
DBS in conjunction with procedures necessitating leaders not being alone with a child along with other safeguards are now used, though.

Everyone on mumsnet seems to love scouts/cubs/beavers.

I don’t.

From past experiences, and my children’s experiences, and a family member who was a scout leader for 15 years.

Someone who wants to get near children, why do a degree to become a teacher, when you can volunteer at scouts instead? CRB checks aren’t reliable if they’ve not committed a crime yet.

There’s lots of cases of abuse.

Doesn’t mean I tarnish every leader with the same brush, just as not all caretakers are Ian Huntley.

But, from my experiences, we’re not comfortable with our kids going, so they don’t. That’s all.

Any system will be flawed. I think DBS is a decent system now it's all linked. But I don't like someone assuming that because a DBS check has happened it eliminates risk. I also don't like the stereotypes in this thread 😂

I would say your group probably doesn't know enough to comment on a leader from another group in the district. Like others have suggested contact the District Commissioner or HQ at Gilwell tomorrow. They will be able to tell you more. At no time should he have been alone with a youth member, I do find it weird in the press story it says that he had no safe guarding training since he was 16 ( 10 years ) As safeguarding training has to be renewed every 3 years.

DBS checks are just one small part of safe-guarding though. There are lots of rules about not being alone with individual children, sleeping arrangements on camp, disclosures and reporting as well.

No it's not perfect but its pretty good in scouting these days - certainly compared to some other childrens activities.

Children are much more aware nowadays of boundaries and what is right and wrong, years ago (like I am assuming the PP who listed various instances of abuse) things were more ignored/not seen as a big deal, same era as Jimmy Saville groping girls on live TV, Now a child would not agree to get changed in front of a leader /allow them to pull them into their lap. It would also be seen as a red flag to the other adults present whereas years ago hey would not have thought twice about it.

Of course any activity that deals with children will attract more peados than an activity teaching OAPs to use the internet for example. But that doesn’t mean that everyone who volunteers is.
Everyone in our group is a parent of a child in the group, apart from a young girl who’s just finished Uni, most are normally persuaded to join as a leader/helper when we are short of help. I’m not saying parents can’t be peadaphiles but it’s not weird old men with no connection volunteering in our experience. They would also probably undergo a more in depth entry interview by district to make sure their intentions are honourable.

My daughter also doesn’t gymnastics, there’s a lot of cases of abuse by coaches. I haven’t taken her out or accused anyone involved in gymnastics of being an abuser. It is however my job to teach her how to keep herself safe, and to make sure she is comfortable telling me anything and know that secrets don’t count with your mum or dad so she is allowed to tell us any secret (apart from what our birthday present is!)

I found out the other day that a friend of mine (only friends as adults but she actually went to my school in another area and was in the year above) had an affair while she was in 6th form with a teacher. Doesn’t mean all the teachers were having affairs with students and that only people that want to have sex with teenagers become teachers!

Wow, I am deeply offended at the implication that both my dh and myself must be paedophiles because we both volunteer as scout leaders.
We both work full time yet still volunteer many hours per week arranging camps, activities and guest speakers to ensure our scouts gain fantastic experiences.
We do not do this to 'get at' your children, we do this to help our local community but attitudes like some shown on here really make me question why we bother.
No wonder some districts have long waiting lists.

To return to the OPs question rather than a few people high jacking it with ignorant views.

You are not being unreasonable to expect reassurance @FreeFolk but I don't think Facebook is the right place for it as things often lose perspective on FB particularly with regard to such emotive subjects.

I don't really know anything about Scouts but I have been involved in other youth organisations and I would imagine that they have proper channels to deal with this and should be contacting you through formal methods rather than social media.

I would imagine you will hear something soon about it (probably next time the group meet) but you could contact their headquarters (contact details should be fairly easy to find online) to put your mind at rest.

Doing and then you get the parents moaning about said waiting lists. I can fully appreciate why people don't volunteer tbh

Some excellent posts on here - ScreamingInsideMe on P1, MustbeMad on P2, Anaiis on P3 and particularly CrochetBelle who has taken the trouble to find the facts rather than jumping hysterically on a bandwagon like one or two posters - well one especially - seem to have done. Good to see that the majority of posters have posted positively.
As NeedMySleep says - it is extremely unlikely that the Leaders of the OP's Groups know anymore than is available in the press. Safeguarding issues are not gossiped about in any reputable organisation. Of course the post should have been taken down. If any parents have any concerns, they can speak to the Leaders or Executive Committee directly, not fan flames of panic and hysteria. Clearly if the police / crown prosecuters had any concerns about any abuse of children on Scout events, then they would have investigated them at the time.

@DoingTheBestICan You and your DH should be proud of yourselves for the work you do. I was a St John Ambulance cadet and later a youth leader. I benefited from so many amazing experiences thanks to people like you and I know how hard a job it is!

The troop leaders should be able to explain the safeguarding procedures to all parents which should in turn reassure parents that their children were never alone with the individual in question.

Thank you, I have just got back from a planning meeting for next weekends Frosty Camp.
The saying in Scouts is 'it's only an hour a week' you can times that by 5/6 some weeks but we both feel it is very important to equip our young people with the all round skills for adolescence.
I just hope that nobody I know in real life think the same backwards thoughts displayed by some on here.