Is this illegal exclusion?

[ClaryFray]

I need some advice, my son is currently being flexible schooled due to his SEN needs. He currently has no EHCP or diagnosis, both due end of the month. He's currently being taught in a small group of 8 pupils and 2 TA's.

There was an incident on Monday where he hit a teacher who prevented him from leaving the room (wrong I agree) however, he'd got himself so worked up he was asking for me. And the Senco refused to call me, later reasoning that he was misbehaving so she didn't want to reward him with what he wanted (ie me). He is very frustrated at school, he can't do the work, we've had issues of the work not being differentiated as per the EP report. And he feels stupid. Has school aniexty around the place, and has a mental and emotional age of around 5 when he is 8. (Think crawling round the floor, running around school, and making baby noises)

I was called in Monday after this incident and agreed to flexi school him. I was upset at the time at the end of my rope, and confused about where to go next. The senco kept talking about exclusion saying, we should exclude him for this incident but won't. Do you want to flexischool him? I was given no thinking time, no cool off period. And the contract was ready for me to sign in the meeting. So between hearing about it and signing paperwork took 30 minutes. I wish I'd been more proactive and asked for time to think but I was scared he'd be expelled and I'm still in probation at work so it's the last thing I wanted.

The senco also keeps mentioning special schools, despite my desire to keep him in mainstream. His EHCP should be agreed the end of the month and they don't want to be the named school. To me it seems obvious they wanted him gone.

Today I arrived to collect him at 1:30pm as per arrangement, to find him in a melt down state. Saying he didn’t want to come home. The reason transpired that they were doing a fun activity. Which he had seen the other children start, yet he was being sent home. This caused him to run off around he school, and get very upset.

I’m at the end end of my teacher but I can’t afford to homeschool completely, I'd lose my job, because I can’t afford childcare.

My questions are:

Is this illegal exclusion?
And AIBU to expect either the activity to be postponed until he had gone home? Or him to be removed to another room so he doesn't witness the fun he's missing out on?

BlueMirror
I mentioned a teacher because generally classes aren't taught by 2 TAs so either:
There is a teacher and 2 TAs (which makes the most sense for a class group. I teach similar groups at secondary and often there's no TA unless a chikd has allocated hours or by some miracle there's some float in TAs but that is rare. We don't have TAs like primary do).
Or the group of 8 isn't a class as such. It's just a group of children completing work with TAs/an intervention group who go out of some lessons to work with TAs. In which case there's 2 TAs workingunder the direction of a teacher so it's not a class.
I can't see a full SEND/nurture group class in a school being staffed by 2 TAs.

My point is we can't make assertions about if it is/isn't illegal nor can we say it's firefightinh either.

E.g. For the last few years i've taught similar groups at secondary. I've had 2 TAs. One because a child had allocated hours. Thr other was there to support the previous class teacher manage behaviour abd give some extra help. Once they saw i didn't need help managing behaviour, i lost thr TA because there were other students deemed ti need it more. A small group in our school isn't firefighting. It is part of curriculum deisgn.

Equally, during assembly time some if iur students go and di maths/english intervention with a TA. They are groups of 6-10. But they are not a class.

I've also seen TAs pull groups out of lessons to do some extra work with chikdren who are working much lower than the rest of thr class. Yes some of them are tricky but you do get children wherr there is a limit how much differentiation you can do. (E.g. one of my colleagues onve was expected to be able to teach a year 3 english curriculum to a year 7 child when the rest of the class were studying shakespeare. It was fundamentally unfair on thr child who would rarely be able to access the secondary curriculum)

Equally, we've pulled students out from classes where they have been disruptive (range of reasons) and made a new group with a teacher. That was a class because the responsibility for their progreas shifted to a new teacher.

The school has put things in place (i'm not saying things can't be improved because everywhere can improve). They have also made an exception in terms of behaviour in not excluding a child who has been violent to staff.
Maybe the child could manage in mainstream but it is also worth considering at what point do you say 'actually, another setting may actually offer better support for their needs' instead of being annoyed that a mainstream school has things in place, is doing more than they need ti for a child without a ECHP and has found a way to avoid an exclusion whilst they wait fir ECHP feedback.

I've been incredibly lucky with my ds school from the sounds of it. He is turning 8 this month, I'd say he is more the mental age of 5-6 year old. He is in mainstream but is permanently in the SN room. He doesn't have a diagnosis but we are working on it. He also hit a TA one day.

The headteacher actively encouraged me to keep him at the school as I was seriously considering flexi or homeschooling. She was adamant they could help him and six months on, he loves his school and has a very close bond with the same TA he hit. He is a happy boy again and beginning to learn academically to his abilities.

Whether your sounds school are doing things correctly, I really don't know. All I can say is it doesn't sound the right school for him regardless.

I considered a special needs school for my ds. However he falls into some sort of grey area. Not severe enough for a special needs school but struggled in mainstream. Where I am, there seems to be inadequate provisions for children in the middle range of sn.

The school would not be unreasonable if they permanently excluded him for hitting a teacher- this would not be illegal and I am surprised they haven’t. He doesn’t have an ehc plan (yet) and there are no guarantees this will be granted. I think the school are going over and above-if I was the teacher I wouldn’t want him in my class. I think you need to look into what his needs are and if this school can realistically meet them whilst also looking at alternative provision.

CollyWombles
I think the middle ground is difficult in most places.
Quite simply (call me a cynic) the policy seems to be reduce access to specialist support/provision to save money and then expect mainstream to deal with any and every issue other than very severe SEND needs without having the buildings, staffing, funding, or specialist staff. (See also - slash access to CAMHS services abd expect mainstream schools to somehow provide mental health support to all but the most serious cases).

The reality is that getting 80 teaching staff in school A and 80 in school B and and 60 in school C trained up to specialist level for every SEND need is simply not viable in terms of time or cost. It's not malice. It's logistics. I teach 4 students this year who would previously been in special ed. They are thriving in mainstream but that's because only some of us are trained up or because of our previous experience are deemed to be strong in that area. If we suddenly had 40 students all with a range of very strong middling send (i'm talking risk assessments around the child here, not middling MLD) then we wouldn't have the capacity to suppprt them. E.g. we have a send base and plans for the students in the event of a meltdown. But we don't have the capacity for 10 students all having meltdowns in thr same hour. At the end of thr day, we are a mainstream secondary.

I had most of the children who were violent to me back in after a period of time out of my class. One also made sexual comments and i refused to have him in my class ever again. Some may say that's wrong of me ultimately safeguarding goes 2 ways. Everyone has a line and I wasn't willing to put myself in that situation.

It's very hard to get 1-1 funding at the moment. Especially without a diagnosis. Unfortunately, without more clarification from OP it's impossible to say whether this decision was the right one for this child or not.

@MaisyPops I didn't mean my post to sound a criticism, I have absolute respect for anyone working with SEN children and feel for mainstream schools and the children that fall in that middle ground. As I say, I'm incredibly lucky to have such a wonderful school for my son.

It was when my son hit his teacher that I wanted to homeschool as I wanted the best for my son AND his school. I was gutted he hit his teacher as he had never done anything like that before. I don't believe anyone should be subjected to violence at work. I used to be a carer and on occasion had violence from some of the elderly.

I don't know what the answer is, or even if there is one with such limited funding, i do know that it's heartbreaking to have a sen child excluded (in general) because of behaviour they can't necessarily help.

I would suggest you look at a School that can meet his needs. If he is struggling in a mainstream environment he will be getting nothing out of it! Regardless of your desire for him to be mainstream schooled it should be about your son and what he requires. I personally feel that a lot of the special need schools have an amazing outlook on teaching and would be beneficial for a lot of children who need much more input and allowances than the mainstream schools can provide.

They haven't 'made an exception' not excluding him. They know an exclusion for a child with send who doesn't have adequate support in the school wouldn't be upheld!

CollyWombles
I didn't take it as a criticism at all. More giving examples in support of what you were saying.
Our school supports our children who may othetwise be in special ed very well but we also accutely aware that there is a limit on our capacity and we couldn't keep offering what we do if the numbers increased
Fairenuff
I agree. Without a diagnosis or the support/funding that comes with an ECHP the school are having to do their best
Most people agree that violence to staff would normally be an exclusion for any child in mainstream.
We can't say for certain in OP's situation whether a flexible timetable is an ok move or not.

Short term part time timetables are sometimes appropriate but if it is indefinite/for a long period it definitely isn't lawful.
Until the childs needs have been assessed and appropriate support is in place it's pointless speculating about whether mainstream is the appropriate environment for the ops son.
If children with send had their needs assessed before entering school (where there are concerns about send needs) rather than being set up to fail with a 'let's save money and see how they go in an environment they are very unlikely to be able to cope in' approach it would be much easier on all pupils and staff.

It sounds like you have not been given sufficient time to think about whether this arrangement works for you.

School ringing you up to say please take your ds home because he is playing up without a written letter and formalising it as a fixed term exclusion is illegal.

Fixed term exclusions are not illegal but if I remember correctly there is a limit on how many days in a school year a child can be put onto a fixed term exclusion.

Permanent exclusions are not illegal.

Reduced hours are not illegal but like fixed term exclusions it should be put into writing AND there should be a plan for reintegration into full time education within a finite timespan (weeks rather than months). They are not necessarily a bad thing, for example, it may help a child transition to a new placement. Whether or not the arrangement is beneficial would depend on if the school changes support at the same time. Whether or not you accept the arrangement might depend on whether you think there is a chance the placement would work if different support was given. If not then you might as well tell the school to permanently exclude and force the LA to provide a new placement. This, of course, is a gamble and might depend on how close the EHCP is near to being finalised. The risk is that without the EHCP he would be placed in another mainstream school with no more support only for the scenario to occur again (as happened to ds1).

The one plus of the arrangement, if done formally, at least is that it will give you more evidence to support your EHCP application.

Sorry I haven't been back on, Ive been poorly.

DS is suspected ASD, very young for his age, and doesn't hand awareness for personal space. His difficulties came on, out of no where in year 3, which is why I'm reluctant to move him to specialist provisions ever hopeful things will improve. Maybe an outdated view of special schools is causing a reluctance. However I have an appointment to view one in April.

We have the first appointment next month to start the diagnosis process which I'm aware could take a long time.

As far as I am aware no, multi agency meeting has taken place.

Also,

It really is 8 children to 2 TA's. One is a higher grade TA. They are in the room all the time.

How far along are you with the Ehcp process?
Have the school made this part time arrangement formal? How long is it for?

What year is he in now OP?

His EHCP - they refused to asses twice. We appealed the second time and they conceded and agreed to access. So we're waiting for them to access, which will be on 28th Feb. The school SENCO and ED Psych have said they'll be shocked if he doesn't get it.

With regards to flexi schooling, the only written notification I've got it the flexi schooling context I signed. And there is no end date, only a review date for the 23rd Feb.

Year 3. His issues only stated in term 2 of year 3.

So he showed no significant signs until about four months ago?

Then it is indefinite and not legal. I would get as much advice as you can - IPSEA, NAS education helpline and parent partnership and meet with the SENCO to discuss how your ds will be supported in the interim before he has his ehcp.

That's correct. He's always been young for his age. Has an attachment to a bear he's had for three years, this bear is ike his best friend. He has no friends at school more people he plays with. I suppose there were mild signs but I missed them. The school only picked them up when he became a problem.

Clary - whilst I can't accurately comment on your main question I can offer guidance as to special schools from a parental pov

DS2 has always been in a special school provision, he was offered a mainstream place but we declined it as we didn't feel it was the right setting. In a special school (as PP have pointed out), all staff are all specifically trained, have experience and the knowledge for SEND issues that as mainstream teachers we can not even to fathom. The setting is less pressurised, the focus is 100% on the child and their needs which with all the will in the world can not happen in mainstream for children with complex/difficult needs.

My PIL were initially shocked/embarrassed at the thought that their GC was attending a special school, but this was due to stigma that some in society place on the provision (before any posters jump on that they very quickly changed their attitude)

You need to be looking at the best place for your DS at this present moment in time - it is far easier to transfer back into mainstream (we have had a number who successfully have transferred into the secondary school I work at) than moving from mainstream into special, especially as they get older

And I'm not sure why 'we don't have the money' is only seen as a suitable excuse by some people for not making a full time education accessible for children when they are disabled. I'm sure if I was told my NT child could only attend school part time because they couldn't afford the staff necessary for her to attend full time I wouldn't be expected to accept it because government cuts and if they don't have the money they don't have it. How the school manages their budget is not the ops problem to solve!

Slightly off topic BlueMirror, but that is happening in Scotland right now and has just started in one primary in London.

Really? And people are up in arms I assume. Yet when a disabled child is denied a full time education it's all 'just give up your job and homeschool them'.

OP if your child has moved from no additional needs in Y3 T1 to an Ehcp a few weeks away in Y3T3 then provision has moved particularly fast to keep up with him. Many people wait years with these needs to be at the same point as you.