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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Gideon Bibles in school

109 replies

BusyBeez99 · 06/02/2018 21:29

DS12 came home with a bible today presented by the Gideons. It's New Testament and Psalms. Why are school children getting free bibles and who is paying for them?

My AIBU is why aren't they giving out other faith books .... or, from an atheist viewpoint (me) , why are they giving them out at all?

OP posts:

Snacktimonious · 07/02/2018 08:38

I read a lot of my Gideon's when I was given it in the 60s. It didn't make me religious but it really helped my reading skills - being able to read archaic language rather than the Beano and the Dandy. It made me curious as to the meaning of some words and basic understanding of what the bible was about. I didn't read all of it but what I did read added to my vocabulary and general understanding of religion. I don't understand why anyone would burn it, and I'm an atheist.

needtogiveitablow · 07/02/2018 08:43

I’m also shocked at the tales of book burning and destruction that some of you seem so proud of. If my children wilfully ripped up any book I’d be furious, we are so lucky to have access to the written word and so cheaply and in this case free. Whether you like the sentiment or not it’s still a book that has the power to educate in some form, if you dislike it so much just give it back to the school, I’m sure they’ll have some use for it!

thegreylady · 07/02/2018 08:45

Burning books? How very authoritarian: brings Fahrenheit 451 to mind.
Don’t read it...corruption lurks between the pages.
It’s a book folks, charity shop if you can’t bear it in the house but please don’t let you children burn or bin it. It isn’t pornography.

DGRossetti · 07/02/2018 08:57

Maybe other religions do not visit schools handing out copies of their religious texts, as they do not have an organisation equivalent to that of the Gideons?

It's often puzzled me that evangelical proselytizing seems to be the sole preserve of Christians. Compared to all the other religions it seems a tad insecure

I wonder, if a scientific charity were to write and publish a "Gideon" version of Darwin (for example), and offer to distribute in schools, what the response would be ? Not equal, I suspect .....

2beesornot2beesthatisthehoney · 07/02/2018 09:03

Tistheseason17 there is an organisation already that promotes science in school particularly evolution and is actively tries to prevent creationism being presented as a science in any lesson in schools. It is called British Centre for Science Education ( BCSE) . It has a sister organisation in the US called NCSE ( national) . Look them up! We have had some successes but it’s an uphill struggle.

MargaretCavendish · 07/02/2018 09:08

It's a historical book

Only like The Brothers Grimm, and Hans "Christian" grin Anderson are...

I mean talking snakes....

Of course fairy tales are also historical texts and artefacts. It's pretty hilarious how ignorant you are for someone who seems so convinced of your intellectual superiority to Christians...

DGRossetti · 07/02/2018 09:12

Of course fairy tales are also historical texts and artefacts. It's pretty hilarious how ignorant you are for someone who seems so convinced of your intellectual superiority to Christians...

some Christians .... and that's just by statistics.

Judashascomeintosomemoney · 07/02/2018 09:24

It's often puzzled me that evangelical proselytizing seems to be the sole preserve of Christians. Compared to all the other religions it seems a tad insecure
As an atheist, I’d rather a bit of gentle proselytising than the forced conversion that they used to, and other religions still do, practice . Anyway, I was happy to receive my Gideon 35 Years ago, got myself an Old Testament, Qur’an, Torah and a Philippino ‘Catholic’ version of the bible cos I don’t think I should criticise unless I know something about them. I’m not about to go all Richard Dawkins though

noeffingidea · 07/02/2018 09:29

My kids never received a gideon bible, if they had done they wouldn't have read it.If they don't want it I'd just return it to the school, OP, or you can put it in recycling if your council recycles books (mine does).

CaptainKirkssparetupee · 07/02/2018 09:31

I love mine

TonTonMacoute · 07/02/2018 09:48

I’ve still got mine from the 1970s, and I’ve still got the bible the school gave me, courtesy of the local council.

Luckily though, the possession and handling of these dangerous volumes haven’t had serious side effects.

DGRossetti · 07/02/2018 09:54

My kids never received a gideon bible, if they had done they wouldn't have read it

Moving into middle school (local state school), I was "required" to have a Bible ... have no idea if that was because our form teachers was a paid-up church goer, or because it was a school thing. I did read it, because it's full of stories.

DGRossetti · 07/02/2018 09:54

Luckily though, the possession and handling of these dangerous volumes haven’t had serious side effects.

You didn't catch God then ?

flucoughcold · 07/02/2018 10:01

I don't get the terror at kids being given a bible. I'm sure many would freak out if it was a Quran too or other religious text but the idea of taking these texts "literally" is a fairly modern concept within the last few hundred years which always makes me laugh when people use "talking snakes" as an example of how ludicrous it is to pay any attention to it. It's not even one book, it's many books, by many authors collated and used as religious scripture.

I don't object to children reading fairy tales or nursery rhymes, they're not particularly nice stories but if you look up where they came from I believe some of them began with pretty grim true stories!

To avoid religious violence, brainwashing, ignorance etc... religious education is very much needed in schools!

thisismychocolatebar · 07/02/2018 10:03

Is burning a book (privately) really any worse than binning or recycling it? Other than environmentally of course

Battleax · 07/02/2018 10:04

We have this thread every year, and every year there's competition to be the rudest about religion. It's dreary.

DGRossetti · 07/02/2018 10:06

It's often puzzled me that evangelical proselytizing seems to be the sole preserve of Christians.

Actually, I have to correct that, as I was given a copy of the Bhagavad Gita once by a nice Hindu gentleman who was handing them out at New Orleans airport many years ago. I have no idea why .....

FruitCider · 07/02/2018 13:18

We were given them at school 20 years ago too. As I recall we used them as rolling papers tiny thin pages they had!

That's what my patients do with the free Gideon bibles... they use the pages to wrap around spice and smoke them.

Julie8008 · 07/02/2018 13:56

I am not boasting, just stating a fact that if school sends home an offensive book like the bible, what I do with it in the privacy of my own home is my own business.

Yes I find it an offensive book, filled with lots of hateful things, I didn't make a fuss about it, just disposed of it in a way deserving of its contents.

My children are well educated, have no interest in reading the bible and having read it myself find there is little beneficial in it that very few people need to know. If anyone disagrees then perhaps you could enlighten me to the important historical knowledge that cant be learned from factual books.

CaptainKirkssparetupee · 07/02/2018 14:02

important historical knowledge that cant be learned from factual books

Nobody has said anything about important historical knowledge, only that it's an historic book.

MargaretCavendish · 07/02/2018 14:05

there is little beneficial in it that very few people need to know. If anyone disagrees then perhaps you could enlighten me to the important historical knowledge that cant be learned from factual books.

I assume you therefore think that people don't need to understand English literature? Because for most of its history (and even modern literature, to a lesser extent) it was soaked in the language, imagery and concepts of the bible. If you have no biblical knowledge then a huge amount of the material that has shaped modern culture remains almost entirely inaccessible to you.

DN4GeekinDerby · 07/02/2018 14:05

thegreylady While I'm not for book burning, The Bible is full of violence and sex and does get a bit close to the pornographic side particularly in Song of Songs with discussing perfect breasts and grabbing hold of them and the tasting of gardens and all that. Psalms itself includes poetically praising the bashing of infants heads against rocks. Not corrupting but not something I'd give to my kids unsupervised and think there will be any benefit.

I think The Bible and it's Influence by the Bible Literacy Society and similar books are better for discussing the Bible's social and cultural impacts and historical information within than just handing an ancient book and hoping they get something out of it beyond a list of out of context verses to argue with parents with (which is what I did with it as a teen in the Bible Belt -- apparently not what my parents were hoping for when they kept giving me Bibles was me to remember the ones to argue about not angering children, not judging people and about perfect boobs).

bridgetoc · 07/02/2018 14:11

As soon as I saw the thread title I knew that it would be full of competitive bible destroying stories, it's all so narrow minded.

I'm a non-believer, but I agree. It's pathetic, and moronic. Sad people.......

Julie8008 · 07/02/2018 14:12

If you have no biblical knowledge then a huge amount of the material that has shaped modern culture remains almost entirely inaccessible to you

I have heard that said but could you please give me 1 part of modern British culture that is entirely inaccessible to someone who hasn't read/studied the bible. Because I cant think of a single one.

manicinsomniac · 07/02/2018 14:16

It's often puzzled me that evangelical proselytizing seems to be the sole preserve of Christians. Compared to all the other religions it seems a tad insecure

It's not about insecurity. It's about the basics of the belief system.

Imagine you truly, 100% believe that:

Jesus is the son of God who died on the cross to bring grace and forgiveness to all humans
that the only thing humans have to do to have eternal life in Heaven is to believe number 1) But
Humans must believe number 1) or else they will spend eternity in Hell

If that is your belief system then of course you want as many of your family, friends and even total strangers as possible to become Christians too.

It's a very, very difficult thing to balance with the desire not to a) invade people's privacy, b) feel arrogant and annoying by saying your beliefs are more and valid and important than other people's, c) be offensive and d) be ridiculed. But if it's those things or believe people you care about are going to hell then evangelism makes total sense and is arguably absolutely the right thing to do.

I know there are Christians with many different beliefs and many different stands on evangelism (I'm a very unconventional Christian and am not even sure I believe in Hell at all) but, at it's heart, those points 1, 2 and 3 above are the core tenets of the religion and do make sense of evangelism.

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