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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To stop writing/giving references for a friend I rarely see.

49 replies

WineIsTheAnswer · 31/01/2018 12:46

I have a friend, let's call her Jane. We know each other through DC's hobbies but now longer go to the same club/meet ups. Jane has had a difficult year or so but is getting back on her feet. This has included her moving to a different town.

I met with Jane just before Christmas and it felt very much like a last meeting. She's moving on and that's fine. She's made mistakes in the past and the meeting felt very much like she was making a fresh start, clean slate and all that. I left the door open saying I would always be here to support/offer advice and wished her well.

Since then the only real contact I have had with Jane is one email saying she had used me for a reference, it would be arriving that day and they needed it returning ASAP. Plus one text to say she got the job based on my reference.

The references are difficult to write due to her recent difficulties and I've had to spend time framing the responses positively but truthfully.

Since then more and more have arrived but the distance between us has grown. To the point where I only know she's moved as the address has changed on the forms and I only know she has gained a qualification as a employer phoned and mentioned it.

I feel like I can no longer give a truthful reference because I don't know what's going on in her life. Plus I'm starting to feel a bit used. She's not contacting me at all, even a little call to say "I'm going for this job/rental place, X will call on this day" there's no thanks for the reference or letting me know if she got the Job/place.

Another part of me knows shes had a difficult time, is trying to move on with little support (family/friends stopped contact due to her issues) and I'm likely the only person suitable to give a reference.

If I stop giving references I don't know she'll have anyone else to ask. Even if she does that person is going to have the same difficulty in writing them due to the past.

I've sent FB message a few days ago with no response asking her to call me. She's notoriously difficult to contact, something that got harder as her issues mounted last year, which has me worried for her and making me more uncomfortable writing these references not knowing if her issues are returning. Alternatively she could just be ignoring me in an effort to move on.

OP posts:
BlueMirror · 31/01/2018 12:52

Were you her employer? If so I would continue to give references. If you are just an ex friend and it is character references they want then I think you’d be well within your rights to tell her she needs to find someone else as you haven’t seen her for x years so can’t answer the questions honestly.

Trinity66 · 31/01/2018 12:53

Seems like the reason she has little support could be because she's burned her bridges by treating people the way she's been treating you, she sounds like an ungrateful user. i would stop giving the references if I were you

ReinettePompadour · 31/01/2018 12:54

Are you providing employment references or as a character reference?

I apply for roles that require references from my last 3 employers (Minstry of Justice/NHS type places) . That's 1 from 30 years ago, 1 from 25 years ago and 1 from 17 years ago. The companies I worked for 25 & 30 years ago no longer exist but I have been able to track down some staff who have written references for me on the basis that they can confirm I did work there 30 years ago (as if anyone really cares about that long ago Hmm ) and I didn't leave for any unprofessional reason. That is all they write.

It sounds like you are writing a personal character reference in which case you could just say that you have lost contact with her and are unable to provide an up to date reference however during the time you knew her she was found to be trustworthy/reliable/quick to learn etc.

songbird11 · 31/01/2018 12:55

I think if you are giving a personal reference it’s different to giving one in the capacity as an employer. If the former they are just looking for being told someone’s reliable and friendly or whatever.

Original poster
WineIsTheAnswer · 31/01/2018 12:55

Yes, I'm just a friend/ex friend.

OP posts:
MatildaTheCat · 31/01/2018 12:55

Ignoring you is completely unacceptable. I’d leave a message saying you need to speak to her and won’t be able to act as referee until you have spoken as there are some points you need to be clarified.

If and when she does get in touch I would then tell her that you don’t feel able to continue for more than, say, one more month as you have effectively lost touch.

If she got the first job why is she needing so many more? If she is making applications to satisfy the JC she could be making dozens of them. That’s not at all fair on you.

You need to speak in order to get a feel for what is going on.

Sparklesocks · 31/01/2018 12:58

Are these all for jobs, OP? Does she change jobs a lot?

Foxanddana · 31/01/2018 12:59

Hmm. I’d probably just carry on doing it. It’s not that hard for you to do and it makes a massive difference to her. You can always start with “during the time I knew X (2006-2008)...”
I always think it’s nice to be kind even if it’s not ideal,convenient or reciprocated.

Original poster
WineIsTheAnswer · 31/01/2018 12:59

Jane wasn't employed in all the years I have known her so I think the companies are trying to dig a bit deeper than a personal reference might. If I just answer the personal questions and use Reinette suggestion on lost contact

OP posts:
Original poster
WineIsTheAnswer · 31/01/2018 13:01

From the reference letters I think shes going for/doing lots of little jobs. Nothing full time.

OP posts:
QuiteLikely5 · 31/01/2018 13:05

I really wouldn’t mind doing a good deed. I see you feel unappreciated but surely being a kind person takes priority

Nikephorus · 31/01/2018 13:12

If she doesn't have the courtesy to check with you first (or at least warn you) then I wouldn't bother. It's just a lack of manners.

FluffyWuffy100 · 31/01/2018 13:17

I really wouldn’t mind doing a good deed. I see you feel unappreciated but surely being a kind person takes priority

Say someone who probably hasn’t got any experience of writing personal references tailored to each individual request.

Probably 30-60 mins of OPs time per request. Multiple requests. For someone who can’t wven message her as a courtesy?

Hats not being a ‘kind person’ it’s being taken advantage of.

Viviennemary · 31/01/2018 13:18

Firstly she was extremely cheeky to use you as a reference without asking first. I would send her an e-mail saying you regret you will be unable to give any reference for her beyond. I have know x for x number of years and am no longer in touch with her. Cf.

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 31/01/2018 13:20

I think you've gone way beyond being a good pal!

Similar happened to me with someone I had been pals with....she left the geographic area. I kept getting ref requests... She never told me they were coming... But always a text a 48 hrs after they arrived to nudge me....

These references were taking an increasingly long time to write as I was having to track her down /nail her down to ask what she was doing....

I did say these were taking several hours to write... Often quite detailed responses were asked for.. And always different job types...

I never had any response/thanks from her.. Or indeed update on whether she had got the jobs...

She too, appeared to not have many other pals..this IS A CLUE!!

I did finally write, and in the nicest wayHmm said I did feel a bit used and this seemed to be the norm for her....

We had sporadic contact for the next couple of years....then lost all contact.

Didn't leave a very good taste for me...

hungryhippo90 · 31/01/2018 13:22

She shouldn’t be asking you for references now.
My friend who I used for references stopped being asked for favours about 6 months before I really felt like I had to give up on the friendship.

It’s cheekyfuckery.

Original poster
WineIsTheAnswer · 31/01/2018 13:23

Not asking or responding is kind of what I became use to as her issues snowballed last year. She became very erratic and self-focused which is one reason I think her issues may be returning and making question my willingness to blindly write these references.

OP posts:
Sweetpea55 · 31/01/2018 13:29

I would be replying the person asking for the reference to say that you haven't had contact with her in xyz but give comments on what you DO know.

StealthNinjaMum · 31/01/2018 13:30

I suppose for me it would depend on whether I felt she was reliable, honest, hardworking and could do the job. I understand it must be awful to feel used like this as it sounds like she's moved on as a friend and just wants the reference. Years ago when I managed a team there were people who just stayed in touch with me to get a reference and i would only comment on what they were like when they worked for me/ I knew them so that could be your approach. Hopefully it won't be a problem for much longer because she'll build up a range of new contacts.

Honeycombcrunch · 31/01/2018 13:32

Were her issues problems that will seriously affect her ability to work or to live somewhere peacefully? Don't write any more references for her unless she gets in contact to thank you for the help you've already given and to reassure you that she isn't going back to her old behaviour.

Angrybird345 · 31/01/2018 13:37

If she can't give the heads up first, I would ignore the reference requests. Very rude of her.

1099 · 31/01/2018 13:45

Why not just draft a testimonial, based on when you were friends, and caveat it with the dates you are happy with, I.e. I was a friend of XX during the period a to b, although we don't have much contact now, during this time I found her to be etc etc. and just attach it to any future requests.

Original poster
WineIsTheAnswer · 31/01/2018 13:48

Yes, if she's back to her worst patch last year then she wouldn't be suitable for employment. I don't think she is but she could be spiralling down again.

If she's where she was when I last met up with her then I'm comfortable to give references even though our friendship is at an end. I feel used in this case but with her making progress I'm happy to write that I knew her until last year.

It's the not knowing how she is/what she's doing thats making the references increasingly difficult to truthfully write.

I think I'm going to sit down tonight and send her a "best of luck on your interviews but I know so little about your life that I'm not sure my references are of any use. Hope your able to use someone more up to date" type email. And see where it goes.

OP posts:
daisypond · 31/01/2018 14:03

Although the friend should have asked you first about being a referee, I don't think she should have to tell you about every job she goes for - there could be loads, and it would be really humiliating for her if she has to tell you about all the jobs she applies for, probably most of which she might not even get to the reference stage with. I wouldn't stop writing references - but you need to be honest - some good wording above.

Mosaic123 · 31/01/2018 14:04

But OP you say you met up at Xmas last year (so 2017) which is only just over a month ago?

If you are the only person who can give a reference then it would be a real kindness to do your best for her, whilst not lying of course.

As far as I know, any employer can get rid of an employee within the first two years of employment very easily so you are not really doing anything bad. If she's not up to the job she won't be kept on.

Yes, she is definitely being cheeky not to contact you and ask you or thank you for your help but I'm assuming she had mental health problems?

It's rather kind to help her with this small matter if you can do so without compromising your integrity.

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