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AIBU?

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Original poster

To feel sorry for this doctor?

695 replies

HarryStylesismycrack · 25/01/2018 16:05

I am not in any way downplaying the death of that beautiful little boy and it is clearly acknowledged there were some failures by the doctor in question however AIBU to feel as though this intervention by the GMC into the independent decision making by the MPTS is concerning? It appears to me that the MPTS took into account many things, not just the outcome (which I completely acknowledge is heartbreaking), the fact that this doctor was working the job of several other medical staff in an unfamiliar environment with significant IT issues with no senior input. It feels like this doctor has been made a bit of a scapegoat for huge systemic failures.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/jack-adcock-latest-downs-syndrome-death-doctor-hadiza-babwa-garba-struck-off-general-medical-council-a8177721.html

A different link to a blog by other medical practitioners 54000doctors.org/blogs/an-account-by-concerned-uk-paediatric-consultants-of-the-tragic-events-surrounding-the-gmc-action-against-dr-bawa-garba.html

OP posts:
AnyFucker · 13/08/2018 22:36

I am glad to see this decision made

My best wishes to the doctor concerned. I hope you will stay in the NHS after this, although I would not blame you if you did not

BoreOfWhabylon · 13/08/2018 22:39

It was the right result but I wonder if she will ever be able to move on from this. I know I couldn't (am a nurse)

Does anyone know if the nurse who was also convicted and struck off has appealed?

LifeImplosionImminent · 13/08/2018 22:43

The thing that shocked me was just now on the BBC - was the mother who was still quite vitriolic about the situation, calling for the doctor's loss of freedom whilst on holiday... So much hate...It should not be right that a person in a high stake job who is let down by the system is threatened with manslaughter when things go wrong.

serbska · 13/08/2018 22:47

Thank goodness she won the appeal.

Nothing will bring back the child and she was totally thrown under the bus. There would have been far reaching concequences for doctors/HCPs re reflections and a bailout to learn from mistakes.

Shocking all round this ever went so far.

serbska · 13/08/2018 22:50

if it was my child, I couldn't get over the DNR mistake. No matter how tired you are, you should double and triple check that every time I thin

The findings were what the DNR error did not change the final outcome. So get over it or not, that isn’t the reason the poor boy died. It’s emotive, and headline grabbing, but that isn’t the real issue here.

AndhowcouldIeverrefuse · 13/08/2018 22:55

She wasn't aware of the hospital's drug policy because she hadn't had an induction. When you consider all the factors at the time, a death or serious injury was unavoidable.

The reporting on mainstream media has been poor as per usual - a handful of selected facts relayed so poorly that they make little sense, and no mention of the fact that the drug the parents gave this poor child might have contributed to its death. But the focus in this case should be the deliberate underfunding of the NHS. That's the real scandal.

serbska · 13/08/2018 22:57

The thing that shocked me was just now on the BBC - was the mother who was still quite vitriolic about the situation, calling for the doctor's loss of freedom whilst on holiday... So much hate...

The parents never came out of this well. For sure, loosing a child is a terrible terrible thing and I can’t begin to think the pain they went through/are going through - but they have done nothing but fire up a witch hunt pitchfork mentality.

It’s worth remembering that just because something tragic has happened to someone, doesn’t mean they are a nice person. We see on MN AIBU all the time people posting about people they are having issues with who don’t do the ‘right’ thing or behave the ‘right’ way.

The bloody media give too much air time to people who are, in fact, nothing and no one. Having a child die doesn’t make you a saint, give your view point any more validity or make you more deserving of getting what you want.

kentparent · 13/08/2018 22:58

The way to improve safety is for open reporting, Root cause analysis and reflection and learning when things go wrong. This case will likely stop that. Its disgusting that the GMC spent money pursuing this case instead of seeing it for what it really is: a systems failure. The NHS let this child down and the department of health let the NHS down.

greendale17 · 13/08/2018 22:58

The thing that shocked me was just now on the BBC - was the mother who was still quite vitriolic about the situation, calling for the doctor's loss of freedom whilst on holiday... So much hate

^I agree. The mother can’t see the facts through the hate.

HoleyCoMoley · 13/08/2018 23:09

What's happened to the nurse, will she appeal now. I don't see how two people can be blamed for everything that happened that day.

trollbuster · 13/08/2018 23:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Cuppaorwine · 13/08/2018 23:48

Mmm posters critisising the parents in their grief should be Utterly ashamed of themselves and thank fuck they never ever have a seriously injured or dead child. You would empathise more with the parents in their grief. They don’t give a crap who to Blame they are just fucking angry!!

You would be too.

And I am glad the junior doctor has been reinstated.

nolongersurprised · 14/08/2018 00:20

The parents insisted on giving their child a medication that they’d specifically been told not to give. Shortly after this their child who had been objectively improving arrested and died.

It may be easier for them to direct their hatred towards one doctor than acknowledge this.

laptopdisaster · 14/08/2018 06:11

@DopeyDazey so you haven't read properly about the case. All the documents say that DNAR error didn't contribute to his death. It was systems failure which killed that poor boy.

Toddlerteaplease · 14/08/2018 06:17

I can't believe the situation she was put in by the hospital. They are to blame so I'm glad she's won her appeal.

NicoAndTheNiners · 14/08/2018 06:21

I used to work with a doctor who during an elective section the baby died. I won’t go into too many details but it was reported in the media at the time. It was felt the doctor made a mistake during the section in how she removed the baby. This was a very competent registrar with a lot of experience and a baby who was I guess a bit wedged in.

The coroner asked the Parents at the inquest if they’d like a manslaughter charge to be considered as he felt there was enough evidence for this to be a possibility and if so he’d stop the inquest.

Parents said no. I obviously feel sorry for those parents but also for the doctor. If I needed a section I’d happily let her do it. She is/was a very good doctor. But she could easily have been in the same position as this doctor.

greendale17 · 14/08/2018 06:47

Mmm posters critisising the parents in their grief should be Utterly ashamed of themselves and thank fuck they never ever have a seriously injured or dead child. You would empathise more with the parents in their grief. They don’t give a crap who to Blame they are just fucking angry!!

^They don’t give a crap who is to blame? Yeah if you say so (!) The parents are fuelling the media’s witchunt against the doctor.

youarenotkiddingme · 14/08/2018 07:00

I've thought long and hard about posting this but feel now more are discussing the medicine given by the parents now is the time.

It is well documented those who have Down's syndrome have heart difficulties of varying severity. It is one of the common reasons for death in people with DS - cardiac arrest.

I've often wondered how much of this fight is to stop the mums guilt for her giving him the medicine which undoubtedly participated in his eventual death. All interviews with his parents are the Mum talking and about her anger and the Dad says very little.

And as for "would you want this dr to treat your child"

Hell yes! She's probably going to be the most attentive and safest paediatric dr in the U.K. now!

LakieLady · 14/08/2018 07:23

Consultant has skipped the country and voluntarily taken himself off the register after using Hadiza as a scapegoat

I didn't know (or possibly had forgotten) that.

That's appalling.

NemoRocksMyWorld · 14/08/2018 07:24

I'm a paediatric doctor, and we are all very pleased with this ruling. This job is getting worse and worse and people are leaving fast. This leaves rotas understaffed and those who remain are pushed to work harder and harder. I recently worked an evening shift when I was an sho down and an advanced nurse practitioner down. The one sho I had is useless and rough. I have reported this to the consultants manytimes but they can't fill the rotas so they continue extending the contracts. I had approximately twenty patients waiting to be seen plus a ward full with sick children. I had a lumbar puncture to do and multiple bloods. I rang the consultant and said it was unmanageable, he said he had only just got home and I should just work through it. So I did, I worked as hard as I possibly could. Meanwhile parents are complaining to me, nurses are complaining to me. The night registrar was a locum who rang me to say he would be an hour late, so ended up working an extra hour an a half (on top of a 13 hour day). I almost cried after that shift!

Two registrar's I know of have killed themselves in the last year in my area alone.

I will go into work today and the roots today is understaffed by one consultant, one registrar and one sho. So we will work with for doctors when fully staffed is seven. This is usual.

I worked in Leicester when this happened. She isn't a bad doctor and she was very let down by the system. Furthermore, I have seen equally as bad or worse mistakes made in my career which have not had these consequences.

For anyone who says "even if she was very tired she shouldn't have made that mistake" or comments such as these, please follow me around for a busy weekend shift. See the amount of decisions I am having to make all the time, and the confusion and chaos we are all working in constantly and see if you would never make a mistake.....

NicoAndTheNiners · 14/08/2018 07:37

The nurse in this case was struck off and remains off the register.

LizzieSiddal · 14/08/2018 07:39

Nemo thank you for what you continue to do under such awful circumstances.Flowers.

The Govt are to blame for this incident and many others(which don’t get the same publicity). No one else.

LakieLady · 14/08/2018 07:42

Nemo It's shit and I can't think of any other environment where people would just keep working under those conditions and pressures.

Doctors and nurses do a fantastic job in appalling circumstances. The deserve better and so do their patients, but without more money it's hard to see how things can be improved.

Flowers
flapjackfairy · 14/08/2018 07:47

I am appalled by this
That poor doctor
It is truly disgusting .

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