to wonder when money and stuff became so important?

[unicornfarts]

Perhaps I'm being nostalgic/ deluding myself, but I thought there was a time when it was normal to be respected/ feel valued by your community as long as you contributed something of use to your fellow man. Now it seems that (especially) if you're doing a low skilled job, no matter how useful it is, you're somehow 'worth' less and get treated badly just because you're not highly paid, or maybe you don't have a sparkly new car/ trendy clothes. Why have we all become so materialistic? Maybe IABU and just need to move in different circles? Hoping for cheering replies that there are less 'grabby' and entitled communities out there!

You're not wrong. But I have noticed this since age 9. When I became aware of money. In the UK respect is bought with material things.

This is going to be controversial, but is it an inevitable consequence of having less spirituality in our lives? As illogical as most religion is, maybe it did help people to think that there were 'other rewards' to be sought in/ after this life?

I live in a village in the mountains, not in UK. Here the gap between rich and poor is much smaller, and so people are much less materialistic. Don't get me wrong, the teens still want the latest overpriced jeans, but on the whole kids keep their clothes until they are worn out, adults are respected regardless of their job and social circles are not divided by wealth. It is getting ridiculous in the UK IMO and I have started to dislike especially my friends who now live in London who are work and wealth obsessed. It is extremely dull.

In the 80's. The whole yuppy consumer shite, stupid wages for footballers, loadsa money. Horrid.

I’m poor yet valued highly in my village because I pull the pints at the pub. Priorities

Humans have always been materialistic, right back to the beginnings of time there were rich and poor, those who had and those who had not.

Respect I don't think comes from what you have anywhere, but generally from you and your achievements, be that someone who helps out in a soup kitchen or runs a multi national corporation. Personality also dictates respect, for who you are as a person,

I don't know anyone who is "treated badly"because they are in a low paid unskilled job, treated badly by whom? I think you need to expand on this.

What "time" are you thinking was better? People doing low skilled jobs have always been denigrated by society, and people who could afford it have always sought to have the newest, the latest, the flashiest goods to display their wealth, to the point of lavish ridiculousness: when pineapples were a rare and expensive import, wealthy individuals would buy or hire them just to display, to show everyone how much money they had!

Is there actually anything innately wrong with materialism and acquiring "things"? I think it's a universal human trait. Even in the few traditional communities which are left in the world, individuals displaying wealth and power with objects is commonplace.

Agree it is in our nature to be hierarchical, but can we not be enlightened enough to limit our own excesses? No specific first hand witness anecdotes of seeing people being treated poorly, but lots of friends colleagues feeling undervalued, people less and less likely to help each other unless there's some monetary compensation.
I'm now conflating many things and starting to ramble, but I have an overwhelming sense that life could be so much better if we were all in a position to help each other more - if we felt less stretched, work was a little less all-consuming, if we didn't have to work so much just for security and to be able to have stuff, if spare time didn't always have to be filled with frenetic activity. Feel like so many of us are running to stand still and there is no quick/ simple fix.

I was talking about this with a colleague just the other day. We both blamed Margaret Thatcher.

I don't think social media over-sharing has helped, where people instagram every meal they have, how many Christmas presents they've bought their DC, and all images are photoshopped to within an inch of their lives to the point you don't recognise the person in the picture. But in reality people are drowning in debt and living riddled with anxiety and depression. This whole keeping up with the Joneses thing has got way out of hand.

Consumerism is rampant, but it always has been. The difference is that most people were around a similar level of affluence in their communities as each other. Now the levels are so mixed, plus SM, so everyone can always see who has more ... and by that also who has less.

There are people really struggling who live next door to a new block of flats which cost 3/4 of a million each.

@whifflesqueak I did get an awful lot of respect in my uni town as pourer of pints the older regulars would tip their hats and open shop doors for me. Taxi drivers would give me free lifts - was great!

I agree with BlindAssassin, the daily sharing of "life stories" on the Internet has put it so much more in your face. I also think social networking itself will become materialistic. Facebook and Instagram and other free sites will start to get a bad name (It has started with FaceBook already) and become the thing NOT to do, while exclusive private networks will spring up that you have to be invited to and pay to join.

It may be that people doing low-skilled work have been denigrated in the past (I dispute 'always'). Why do we need to continue to do so? Are health care assistants changing the bedding for incontinent elderly people at home alone not really valuable and relatively selfless to do the work for little pay?

If I were speaking to someone doing a low-skilled job I would like to think I would not denigrate them and rather speak to them as a fellow human being just like anyone else. I am perenially shocked by the number of my peers who regard this as strange. Many people I work with in my socioeconomic group will not smile/ look at those 'below' them, won;t be polite when asking for their assistance/ conveying instructions, will only hold doors open for those with higher status etc. It's weird

It’s actually a lot better than the ‘good old days’ when people thought having money made you a good person; and that poverty was a sign of laziness. A lot of navel gazing going on, on this thread.

YANBU. Society has become competitive and attitudes have changed. It's all about what others can do for you now rather than helping one another out just to be helpful. Everyone is watching what they have in comparison to what others have. The 'keeping up with the Jones'' attitude has taken over. When we were children, people used to pop in if they were passing, now you need to give people notice and ask for permission to visit. People pretend not to be home or being openly rude in everyday interactions. People are a lot more antisocial under the guise of 'being so busy'. Social media has replaced personality and real friendship. Is it any wonder a lot of people's mental health has never been worse.

Many people I work with in my socioeconomic group will not smile/ look at those 'below' them...

Yeah I've seen this attitude a lot in the type of job I work in right now. People click their fingers and point at my colleagues for attention, throw rubbish, snotty tissues and receipts on the counters for staff to clean up. One woman said she did this because 'it keeps them employed'. There is a distinct lack of respect. But really it shows them up to be very bad mannered and entitled.

Two words; Margaret Thatcher. Credit cards, selling off social housing, privatisation of public services, meritocracy need I go on?

There is less community now. You used to have whole areas of people living in the same type of house, working in the same factories all with little money left over to blow on things.

There is more competition now in lower income groups as the range of products and use of credit has expanded.

A rise in social mobility has meant there is more new money about who are the flashiest eg footballers. Old money have always been the same. More subtle but probably judging as much as anyone else.

I disagree that it is worse between income group. I think classism attitudes are at an all time low. Its universally seen as unpleasant to look down on health care assistants and it is something I haven't really seen.

Materialism still only matters as much as you let it. I think living your life trying to impress others will lead to unhappiness. I do what make me happy. I don't look on instagram and don't care what stuff others have. If I'm seen as less valuable, so be it.

It’s actually a lot better than the ‘good old days’ when people thought having money made you a good person; and that poverty was a sign of laziness. You really think it's better? "Strivers vs shirkers". The whole "austerity" thing is made possible by the theme that benefits is a "lifestyle choice" and that anyone can become a millionaire through "hard work" and "making the right choices".

Money and stuff has always been important, we have had the class and peerage system for centuries.
Consumerism became the driving force in the 1980's.

There have always been people who choose to do good. That's got nothing to do with spirituality.
Nothing has changed, because the system of capitalism has not changed.

I attended private school on a scholarship. Everyone around me came from wealthy families. I made the decision at 11 that if I coveted what they had, I'd make myself miserable, so I didn't and I'm so glad. It's an easy trap to fall into though.

Honestly? I think you need to move in different circles. Nobody I know would 'not smile/ look at those 'below' them, won;t be polite when asking for their assistance/ conveying instructions, will only hold doors open for those with higher status etc'. Your 'socio-economic' group sound like assholes, frankly.

I couldn't disagree more, society has never been so open and flexible. Yes, people on benefit might be looked down (see the number of threads on this forum, if they haven't all been deleted already), and we live in the generation X-Factor/Football player. However, you can come from nothing and make it, even if people believe no effort is needed.

In the past, you were pretty much stuck where you were born unless you were exceptional, there are not many historical examples. Look Prince Harry is marrying a (lovely if you ask me) divorced mixed-race American Actress from a non-posh background. That would have been impossible not many years ago.

I think it's because it's possible to become a millionaire whilst starting as a builder, or whatever trade you do that people who just changed level look down at others.

Consumerism was a tool to create control and we've fell for it. The idea that constant growth is the goal. We're the only species that pays to live on the planet.
We need to learn how to just "be" more, back to basics, community, out into nature, yes spirituality, not religion. If your idea of spirituality is connecting with nature then great. I think we also need to look into ourselves more instead of looking to other's (the powers that be) to give and find the answers for us. Learn to trust yourself instead of trusting the other.