School displaying DD's attainment levels on the wall

[Erinsboroughrocks]

DD is in y6 and working towards her SATs. The teacher has a chart on the wall with each child's name listed. Next to each name is a colour for each subject. Green is working above, orange is working at and red is working below. All the children know what the colours mean. DD doesn't like having this up and I feel a bit uneasy about it. WIBU to ask them to take it down (or instead put up a board of colour coded teacher observations in the staffroom 😉)?

I am talking about in classroom Firecracker.

My uncle got into one of the best Grammer Schools in Manchester hes now a millionaire however he did mediocre In his o levels he didnt stay to sit Alevels he went into insurance instead clearly he is very intelligent but I don't think his exam results did much to warrent his success ,It was more about going into a career he could be successful at and a little bit of luck along the way too .

it's the complete opposite, children need to know where they are, they need to learn that being at the top requires work, if not from others, but from their part.

My ds is working at a level 2-4 years below his age (depending on the area), he works exceptionally hard, harder than many of the children who don't have a severe speech disorder, low muscle tone, health issues that cause him extreme discomfort and pain etc.

Schools that celebrate effort, and individual progress made should be celebrated not derided as breeding snowflakes.

Maybe we should bring back dunces' caps, I mean a table on the wall might get missed.

I think you're right, Llangollen, I lose doing that. Actually I think you are being goady, because nobody is genuinely that stupid.

But it pains me because please remember that you aren't actually writing in the abstract. This is about our actual, real-live children. I have full bragging rights, because I have one child who is doing GCSE maths at primary school. But the other has a specific learning disability that means that he struggles to count to 20 on some days, despite us doing our level best to help in every possible way. He KNOWS. Of course he fucking knows that he struggles. So how do you think it would motivate him having his failure posted on the board for the rest of the class to see? Would it motivate him to work hard on it every day? Oh hang on, he already does that. So what would it do? I'd actually really like an answer, though I'm under no illusions that I"ll actually get one. Because like Gove et al, the only student you have in mind is the bright lazy ones who might, just might get a kick up the arse from results being posted up (though I doubt it). You don't really give a toss about the collateral damage.

If a child is not doing ok in maths, there's no harm to let him know.

But that’s not the same as letting the whole class know, is it? If he’s getting 10/30 in maths tests and being sat on the lower tables and being taken out of the class for extra maths focus, then he probably knows already. He also doesn’t need to know that the other kids aren’t struggling.

My DD is 12. When she was in year 4 (age 8) she did a drawing in art, scribbled it out, turned the page over and tried again but didn’t have much time. The teacher picked up this work and took it down to the year 1 (age 5) class and picked out a few pieces of year 1 work, and in front of the whole of year 1 and year 4 said that her work was worse. Then a few weeks later he used her work for the year below’s example of “how not to do this”. She still remembers these incidents very, very clearly and there is no convincing her that any artwork she produces is any good. She knew she wasn’t the next Picasso, she didn’t need to be told that her work was rubbish and humiliated.

I don’t know what 10yo you all meet who “get a shock” when they discover they’re not special geniuses. I’ve never known that happen, and I’ve got 3 secondary age kids and a lot of friends with secondary age kids. It can’t be that common. My DD has always known she’s good at netball, dance, maths, and languages. She knows she’s not great at art and cooking.

Actually I think you are being goady, because nobody is genuinely that stupid.

thank you for that.

So what's your solution? To protect someone who struggle we take away the achievements from someone who is striving, through hard work? That's my issue with your reasoning. I have no interest in humiliating anyone.
I do not agree that telling children that results do not matter is doing anyone any favour at all, especially not in the long term. Results do matter.

Those that are striving know full well they are though we don't need to humiliate the kids that arnt striving to make those who are aware surely ?

How is this any different that having a reward chart for children trying hard?

It is not a list of results, it is not their progress, it is not even the level they are working at so academic children aren't advantaged on it.

All it shows is that a child is trying hard and achieving their individual (private) target. That could be a really high target for bright children or a low target but it doesn't show that on the chart. How is that different than putting a sticker up to say so and so worked really hard today.

Of course results matter - at GCSE and above.

But that is no reason to publically post test scores or a form order up for 10 and 11 year olds.

You aren't 'taking away achievements' by not publishing scores for all classmates to pick over.

And btw my son also works incredibly hard he always does his best also hindered by a tough home life his brother is severly autistic and has learning disabilities I'm veey proud of him because of who he is.

Not unreasonable at all and well done for getting it fixed. To those who think the system works for the high achievers it certainly doesn't always, it can quite easily lead to embarrassment and bullying for them too (I have seen this). Scores etc. should be confidential imo.

They would be better implementing this for "effort" rather than "attainment"

Again, I think it's more the parents who pick over the results, a lot more than the kids.

I do not see how any of what has been discussed is "humiliating" for the children. I don't see how copies being given by order of results is humiliating, or giving prices to the top pupils is humiliating. I do not believe it is "humiliating", that's not the point at all. It doesn't hurt anyone to have their results colour coded, for them to refer.
It doesn't hurt them to see their goal, or the group they belong to.

Well you probably wouldn't if your kids are doing very well would you ...

. It doesn't hurt anyone to have their results colour coded

Tell that to the child who works so hard yet never gets placed near the top l!

Can you imagine being in a running race and being last every single time? Will you try harder or give up?

Because you'll never win?

Quite Green.

My son does his best in every year they have he came running out of school a few weeks ago to tell me about his spellings he teacher had accidentally given him the harder spellings not meant for his table but I tested and tested him and on the Friday when his teacher gave him the easier spellings and he told her he had learnt the other spellings she told him to try the. Harder ones he got 11/14 My god was I proud hes never managed it since but even so.

How long do you keep pretending their lack of results has no consequences and that it doesn't matter if they don't do well? Also, if you hide all their weaknesses, you don't praise their achievements? It makes no sense at all.

Again, Llangollen, how on earth does this have anything to do with the thread? Deciding not to post children's results on the classroom wall does not and cannot equate to pretending that it doesn't matter if they don't do well and hiding weaknesses? If you know anything whatsoever about what goes on in schools, you would know that this absolutely doesn't happen: schools track each and every child, and if there are problems they will certainly be telling the parents.

So what's your solution? To protect someone who struggle we take away the achievements from someone who is striving, through hard work?

How does it take away from their achievements? They will still see their 10/10 test results and the As or gold stars on their homework.

x2boys you must have felt proud, I have a GS who struggles with his spellings, he tries so hard and it is getting easier. Encouragement works so much better than humiliation.

They would be better implementing this for "effort" rather than "attainment"

this is exactly what I fear the most for our schools. I honestly believe it's wrong on so many levels.

So Llangollen the child who puts limited effort in and gets 80% is more worthy of praise at 10 than the child who puts loads of effort in at gets 40%? I don't think so.

When it comes to GCSEs we know it is ultimately about attainment. But I will be delighted with whatever results my DD gets if she has tried her best, after all, I can't ask for more than that.

Not everyone is academically clever. Schools, especially primary schools, should be encouraging all pupils to do their best, not demotivating less naturally bright pupils by having their scores on display for other kids to laugh at.

I agree with people saying that coming out top on these lists doesn't necessarily help children either. I came out at or near the top of the prominently posted lists at my school without much effort; it really came as a bit of a shock when I went to university and found that I actually had to work pretty hard to keep up to the standards expected. And I knew a number of people who happily worked on the basis that coming in the top half was fine, they really weren't bothered about coming first so happily coasted along doing pretty minimal work.

In what way are you taking away their achievement? Again, I would genuinely like to know. Like I said earlier, the gold star mentality hurts academic-minded children. I know - I have three degrees from a top university, in a subject I was very good at but never really passionate about.

And if you honestly think that being constantly, publicly declared bottom of the class despite trying your VERY hardest to improve isn't humiliating, I'd like to know what emotions you think it would elicit in a child. Again, these are genuine questions. If you aren't being goady, then I'm assuming you have answers. And actual answers, not avoidance tactics. We aren't talking about hypothetical harm to the kids at the top of the class, we're talking about the ones at the bottom. But like I said, I suspect like Gove that you think they are collateral damage and don't really matter.

@GreenTulips sorry but how is the more able kids helping the less able kids in the best interests of the more able kids? Surely their classroom time should be spent on their own learning! If they are miles ahead of most of the class then they aren't being stretched enough and will be at a disadvantage compared to similarly able pupils elsewhere who are having more targeted, ability-specific teaching with stretches them....