Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think that ballet doesn't deserve its elitist image?

130 replies

k2p2k2tog · 05/01/2018 08:12

For the first time in my life last night I went to the ballet. My DD dances and she came with me, we saw Scottish Ballet do the Nutcracker. And it was amazing. Loved it. Live orchestra, stunning sets, sparkly costumes, great soloists and overall a good experience. DD was worried it would be hard to follow what was going on - she found it very easy to understand the story and was inspired by the fabulous dancers.

Our tickets were £14 each. This is not much more than going to the cinema, and half the price of panto tickets in Glasgow this year. Yes we could have paid more to sit in the grand circle but we had a very good, unrestricted view of what was happening on stage.

So why does ballet have this "posh" image when people are quite happy to pay £14 for a cinema ticket and popcorn, or £50 or more to see whoever's the latest pop star on tour?

OP posts:
Rebeccaslicker · 05/01/2018 08:15

Opera is the same, I think. Sure tickets can cost a fortune - but they don't always. You can often find them from about £20 upwards if you're not too fussy about which night/where you sit.

lalalonglegs · 05/01/2018 08:27

It's not just the cost though, is it? As you have already pointed out, many people are happy to pay the equivalent amount for tickets to a gig. The problem is more that they are seen as difficult to understand/appreciate - the audiences for many operas and ballets need a certain amount of knowledge of the traditions and technicalities to appreciate them fully. I'm really glad you enjoyed the Nutcracker you went to see; on the couple of occasions I have been to the ballet, it has left me a bit cold since, while I could admire the enormous skill and discipline of the dancers, it didn't really move me or even engage me very much (I've enjoyed operas that I have seen).

BikeRunSki · 05/01/2018 08:29

£14 (or £20) is a lot of money to many people! It may be cheap for the ballet/opera etc but it’s still a lot for a “nice to do” rather than “need to do”.

Our local independent cinema charges £5! We rarely go to the big complexes because of the cost. We’re all cyclists, both dc race. We’d love to go to more events at the Manchester Velodrome, but tickets at £20 each means that that won’t be happening very often for the 4 of us.

Original poster
k2p2k2tog · 05/01/2018 08:33

I totally understand the worries people have about ballet or opera being hard to follow. When we went into the theatre last night we were given an A4 handout with short bios of the main dancers that night (assuming they have a pool of dancers and different people take the leads each performance) and two short paragraphs explaining the plot. I think most people would be able to follow the plot without the sheet, but for other ballets or operas maybe less so.

I know Scottish Ballet and Scottish Opera do lots of outreach work in schools to try to break down the "elite" image - DS went to a schools performance of an opera where they shortened it and stopped after each scene to explain to the kids what was going to happen next. Assuming the same sort of things are happening up and down the country.

OP posts:
AgentProvocateur · 05/01/2018 08:34

Glad you enjoyed it. I’m going tomorrow night. I often go to Scottish Ballet and Scottish Opera productions, and I always buy the cheap tickets. That way, if you do t enjoy it, it doesn’t matter so much. I agree that it’s a great night out and good value for money. How long did the show last?

Foxyloxy1plus1 · 05/01/2018 08:34

I saw the Nutcracker at the Royal Albert Hall, last week and it was utterly, utterly magical. The set, the dancers, the grace and skill, just everything about it.

It was also very expensive, but it was a once in a lifetime thing that I will never forget. People spend money on what suits them and I guess that ballet is often in places that are very expensive to run.

NewPapaGuinea · 05/01/2018 08:35

Cost is partly irrelevant, it's what you gain enjoyment from. The "posh" stigma is due to who attends and participates in these performances, much like opera and like football is seen as chavvy, where as rugby is for the toffs.

AgentProvocateur · 05/01/2018 08:37

Also, if you’re under 26 (i’m Not) all Scottish opera tickets are £10

Original poster
k2p2k2tog · 05/01/2018 08:42

Agent - show was 2 hours including a 20 minute interval. We were out just after 9.30pm.

OP posts:
speakout · 05/01/2018 08:50

It's certainly elitist when it comes to the dancers- almost exclusively white middle class.
And I say that as the mother of a young woman who ballet dances at a professional level.
Yes it's beautiful, yes my DD has gained enormously from her experience, but not a vocation open to all.

Original poster
k2p2k2tog · 05/01/2018 08:51

Also agree FoxyLoxy that it can cost a lot more - London performances in general are more costly than elsewhere, and any National company is going to be more expensive than one not in the capital. We could have paid more for our tickets last night too, had we wanted to sit in the front row of the grand circle.

But it doesn't have to be expensive and it seems that lots of ballet and opera companies up and down the country are doing what they can to keep prices down.

OP posts:
BetterWithCake · 05/01/2018 08:55

I agree OP it is often cheaper than panto tickets and IMO better value, more magical and sparkly especially at Christmas.

Headofthehive55 · 05/01/2018 08:57

I find both opera and ballet hard to follow and thus don't enjoy them much. I don't want "to be educated" by being given written info on plots etc, I want a night out where I can be entertained and don't have to think that much!
To be honest I think opera and ballet belong to a different age.

Headofthehive55 · 05/01/2018 08:57

Id rather watch ice hockey or go to a musical.

AgentProvocateur · 05/01/2018 08:58

Thanks. Can’t wait to see it!

MorrisZapp · 05/01/2018 09:00

There was a really good documentary on the other night about how they stage the Nutcracker. I have to say, every child and young adult dancer involved did seem super posh.

Original poster
k2p2k2tog · 05/01/2018 09:02

Well I have no idea about what class the dancers are... but the programme lists short bios and many aren't British. Lots from France/Italy/Australia.

Agree though not many non-white faces. There was one male dancer last night who appeared to be mixed race. One of the children in the opening party scenes was Asian. That's a problem which goes right back to childhood though - if you're not getting 10 year old boys and girls from non-white backgrounds enrolling in ballet schools for formal training, threre's not going to be mixed race, Asian or black ballet dancers on stage 10 years later.

OP posts:
Mummyoflittledragon · 05/01/2018 09:03

speakout
I agree. Yet it is difficult to make it in any industry where you don’t come from money due to training costs. Hollywood is also elitist. And as we know for women, it can also be what you are prepared to do sexually.

Billben · 05/01/2018 09:04

To be honest I think opera and ballet belong to a different age.

😱

Frogletmamma · 05/01/2018 09:05

I love ballet and opera but they are occasional treats.My daughter does ballet and I think it inspires her to see the professionals. By the way if you buy cheap tickets to opera make sure you will be able to see subtitles or unless you are a linguist you may be baffled

WeAreGerbil · 05/01/2018 09:06

I took DD to see the Nutcracker - she dances - but I was put off by how skinny some of the dancers were - one in particular - I didn't say anything but DD commented, we were quite close to the front as well so it was v obvious. I felt it was just a really bad example and we haven't gone again. I don't know whether all companies are like that. We do watch contemporary dance - more chunky thighs amongst those dancers!

peachgreen · 05/01/2018 09:07

It's a difficult one. I would have argued the same about Shakespeare - you can see a play at The Globe for a fiver, so why does it still have an elitist image? - but honestly, I think theatre / ballet / opera has a long way to go before it can be considered to be inclusive. There are some great companies from all those worlds doing good things to try and be inclusive (e.g. The Globe partner with Deutsche Bank each year to put on performances solely for teenagers from schools in deprived areas) but in general, audiences remain primarily white and middle / upper class.

I think if you're in or near a big cultural city like London, Edinburgh, Cardiff, Glasgow etc you're more likely to find opportunities for young people from different backgrounds to be exposed to and enjoy these things but in cities / towns which maybe have one theatre that just takes in West End transfer tours and the odd ballet - and charges quite a lot for tickets - there just aren't the same kinds of opportunities there, which is a real shame.

Not really sure what the answer is, to be honest.

LaurieMarlow · 05/01/2018 09:08

I wouldn't put ballet in the same category as opera. Ballet feels more accessible, many kids take classes in it and most people (I believe) would enjoy a performance without much technical knowledge. The same can't be said for opera, which feels much more elitist.

Chienrouge · 05/01/2018 09:11

To be honest I think opera and ballet belong to a different age

A little bit shocked by this comment. Why do you think this?
I love ballet, and often go to performances. I took my 4 year old to see the Nurcracker before Christmas and she loved it. Should I tell her it’s from a different age and she’d be better off going to the cinema?

PanannyPanoo · 05/01/2018 09:14

I think it is more to do with ballet as a hobby being expensive, classes, uniform, exams etc. You have to have a significant amount of disposable income in order to afford to send your child there, and if your child is not interested in ballet and has not experienced it has a hobby it is unlikely to occur to you as something to go and watch.

I love theatre and dance and have taken my children to different productions, I am not interested in horses though so it would not occur to me to take them to an event. It's a similar situation.