Is it appropriate for a university to give out pro-life leaflets

[StealthPolarBear]

I genuinely don't know. Was a bit disappointed

These are the times in our life when the hardest most important lessons are learnt but that's my point of view. I understand that it's not everyone else's.

When I had my abortion I was asked 3 times in the clinic is it what I want to do.
I was then sent home because I seemed pressured and told to come back the following week if it was still what I wanted.

Mumof56. I'm thinking critically about your posts and you are spouting 'facts' without showing any evidence they are true.

You would be much more persuasive if you linked to hard evidence of what you are claiming.

In fact if Marie Stopes read your posts it would probably have a case to sue you for talking bollocks defamation. You'll note I say 'probably' because I don't have solid evidence that that is the case.

@BertrandRussell - I think it would be naive to think there aren't some women who have an abortion because they feel they couldn't cope due to lack of support. That is why non-directive counselling is so important. Research suggests that women who suffer emotionally after an abortion tend to be those who did not truly choose it. So those who panic and have an abortion without considering it, those who are pushed into our by parents or partner etc.

Mumof56. I'm thinking critically about your posts and you are spouting 'facts' without showing any evidence they are true

You would be much more persuasive if you linked to hard evidence of what you are claiming

In fact if Marie Stopes read your posts it would probably have a case to sue you for talking bollocks defamation. You'll note I say 'probably' because I don't have solid evidence that that is the case

I would have thought that those interested and concerned about women having access to safe abortion would have been aware of the care quality commissions inspections and reports on Marie's stopes.

Is it just abortion you want with no regard if they are safe?

Here's the link.

www.cqc.org.uk/provider/1-102643434

They’re not the only clinic that provides abortions though.

SPUC can absolutely spuc off with the lies they're peddling to women to push a hardline religious agenda. I have zero time for the "pro-life" movement in any way, shape or form.

removing leaflets on the assumption someone cannot make up their own mind is censorship and patronising
So, extending that argument, how about allowing people to leave some BNP, EDL, National Action etc leaflets around university campuses?

Most reasonable people would (a) assume these weren't actually put on display by the university, (b) not expect the university to just leave them in situ, perhaps putting a few 'stand up to racism' leaflets next to them for balance.

I hate this nonsense about 'balance'. Should scientists within universities also give students some climate change denial cock and bull for the sake of 'balance'? Of course not. As others have pointed out, SPUC literature is blatant propaganda, not a fact-based 'counter argument'.

Mumof56 thanks for linking to that report. It is pretty damning. Can't see anything about termination targets or unlidded bins in there though, nor your failed abortion numbers. I also searched for your Danish abortion figures earlier and couldn't find them either.

It is your job to back up your claims if you want to be taken seriously not mine to have evidence of what you say before you've said it.

In any case it's beside the point. Of course abortion should be safe. I don't think you're interested in the safe provision of abortion however. You believe in forced birth and are using the real and made up failures of a particular set of clinics to argue it. You're entitled to your opinion of course but expecting people to accept what you say with nothing to back it up is a rubbish way of getting people to agree with you. Here's a face right back at you.

Marie Stopes probably shouldn't distribute leaflets saying 'we have exemplary inspection reports' just as SPUC shouldn't have leaflets saying 'we will give you balanced advice.'

@twofingerstoEverything there are laws against hate speech, racism etc Any leaflets that contravene the law should obviously be removed.

Marie Stopes is not the only abortion provider available.

The reports you link to bear absolutely no relation to the horrors you posted. Please can you back those up. And explain their relevance to the discussion in hand.

there are laws against hate speech, racism etc Any leaflets that contravene the law should obviously be removed.
Your argument was for free speech. Now you're saying people should have free speech except when there's a law against it? Why? Why should a university allow people to spread propaganda and lies by means of leaving their leaflets on the premises? Would it be allowed in your workplace? Should SPUC be allowed to leave their leaflets wherever they please? Cafes/Public toilets etc... because... free speech?

So, extending that argument, how about allowing people to leave some BNP, EDL, National Action etc leaflets around university campuses? Yes

Should scientists within universities also give students some climate change denial And yes.

“Should scientists within universities also give students some climate change denial And yes.”

Why?

Yes, I am saying there should be free speech unless that speech is against the law. Sorry I assumed that was implied.

It's your opinion it's propaganda. I can't agree or disagree as I haven't analysed it in detail. I didn't see anything in it that I thought was illegal.

Why the fuck am I being lectured to about northern ireland?

Someone around here clearly thinks women are stupid and it's not the pro choice people.

Should scientists within universities also give students some climate change denial And yes.
So we should always counter facts with uninformed opinion/downright lies in the interests of balance? eg.
Scientist: "The earth is round."
Unspecified university person put into post to ensure balance: "Well, here with some alternative 'facts' is someone from the Flat Earth Society to lecture you..."
No wonder we've ended up with Trump as the head of the free world.

"So, extending that argument, how about allowing people to leave some BNP, EDL, National Action etc leaflets around university campuses? Yes

Should scientists within universities also give students some climate change denial And yes."

So yes to leaving leaflets saying that certain people should get out of the country etc as long as they don't quite cross over into inciting violence

And yes to teaching the earth is flat in schools (growing movement in the USA) because well why not?

We are in a post-truth age alright with added spice in terms of it being AOK to make minority groups know they are not welcome.

FWIW to me SPUC is a hate group the same possibly worse than EDL etc. Because of the actual harm they do and the breadth of the harm they would do if they were allowed.

Anti science -

the spuc types must love this because their entire framework is based on belief that they back up with half truths and lies.

When confronted with the litany of death and disablement their ideas cause, they stick their fingers in their ears and go tralala

Dangerous dangerous people.

I also still can't see how the opposite of pro life (forced birth) is pro choice. The actual opposite is pro death (forced abortion for all pregnancies).

A pro life and a pro choice leaflet on a desk are not giving "alternative viewpoints" - one gives all viewpoints and the other says don't have an abortion if you do you are a murderer.

It's your opinion it's propaganda. I can't agree or disagree as I haven't analysed it in detail. I didn't see anything in it that I thought was illegal.
If it ain't fact, it's propaganda.
Unless you think it's 'fact' that abortion causes breast cancer.
Who said the contents of the leaflet were illegal?

I also still can't see how the opposite of pro life (forced birth) is pro choice. The actual opposite is pro death (forced abortion for all pregnancies).
That's why 'pro life' is such a misnomer.

Sorry should have said pro choice gives all options.

Not all viewpoints - they don't usually say "some people believe if you have an abortion you are worse than satan and should be imprisoned indefinitely" for instance.

People can call it what they want to, 'foetus' is an unborn baby and that's all there is to it

No, that is not all there is to it. You have an opinion, that is all.

Pretending it's not alive when a woman is 8 months pregnant and suddenly becomes alive when it comes out, that's what's disingenuous

It's not disingenuous, its simple fact. You count your life from when you were born, same as everyone else. Your life began on the day you were born, that is when you became a person.

It should be "pro foetus"

They are not interested in women (whether they live or die / are injured irreperably / mental health ruined) or in fact usually children once they have been born.

Look at that case where they kept a dead pregnant woman on life support while her body was rotting, exposing her kids and her husband to that, with her whole family saying to let her die.

It was genuinely disturbing. This is where feotus fetishisation takes you. No regard for the already born at all.