Husband wasting money- possible addiction again? More of WWYD?

[Stupidwife]

More of a what would you do.. posting here for traffic. Hope that's ok?

First time posting so please be gentle with me. I will try not to drip feed.

My husband I have been together for 10 years now. I have a teenage son from a pervious relationship and we have a toddler daughter together.

I always knew my husband liked to gamble a little and didn't see an issue with this until I learnt the full extent of it 3-4 years ago after he had gambled away £3,000 in savings and leaving us (him) in £10,000 worth of debt. He had started getting payday loans without my knowledge. It ended up being over 100 payday loans in one year before he finally got an IVA to sort the issue out. I was completely unaware of this until I opened a letter of his by mistake. God I sound and feel so stupid writing this! He doesn't have any family, literally just me and my family. My mum talked me around to giving the marriage another go on this basis. He handed over all finances to me, bank cards the lot. Deleted all gambling apps etc. I would give him cash as when required. Was horrible having to treat him like a child. He never got professional help but this worked well. I gave him his bank card back after 8 months on the understanding that I would do random checks of his internet banking.

Over the course of our relationship we had three miscarriages and fertility issues, so when I found out I was pregnant with my daughter I had to continue the pregnancy without a second thought. The last IVA payment was a month after she was born and I haven't felt the need to check his account for the last year.

Fast forward to tonight.. I have just found out after sorting through accounts to budget for a holiday that he had spent £315 on bloody in app purchases of an iPhone game over the course of around 7/8months. I'm to angry to talk to him about it right and need an outsiders thoughts.

We both work, I'm part time (well 28 hours) I get that its his money, but that's nearly two months car payments or a years worth of nappies or a months worth of food shopping!

It's the fact that he's been secretive about it. I can't believe he could be so stupid again.

No professional help. I did ask him to seek help but because it was managing the way we worked he never followed it up and I didn't either.

We aren't well off but thankfully not struggling either.

From what I have seen, it's been smaller payments up until a couple of weeks so I'm really hoping that I have caught it in time before it escalates further.

I did tell him the last time, that if he done it again, I would take the kids and leave. I wasn't prepared to go through this again but he doesn't see it the same as gambling.

My pervious relationship ended with me being left holding the baby with a shit load of debt to my name, which I'm still paying off now. I don't want to end up in the same situation again but with two children.

We have somebody like that in my DH family. Gambler’s GF gave him 2 chances already, but I have caught him doing it again 2weeks ago and not sure what to do about it, as his Gf prob will not stick with him again. But they have a 1year old, his GF has not returned to work yet, and it would fall on us to support her, as she has no family. The Gambler promised to change, but I am not so sure he will. He hasn’t paid his rent for 2 months now (my parents are his landlords- that’s how I know), lied to me even when confronted with facts... not sure what advice to give You, as don’t know what to do in our situation.

I forgot to add, that our bills have never been affected by any of this.. before or now.

@LeeBird what an awful situation to be put in especially your parents. I someone knew about my situation before me, I would want to know. Good luck with your decision.

To be fair to him, in-app purchases aren't really the same as gambling. The key aspect of gambling, or at least problem gambling, is that the gambler thinks that the solution to the problems they've created through gambling is more gambling. They think that they can win back their losses if they just pay for one more spin of the wheel.

In-app purchases are "just" spending. He won't have deluded himself into thinking that he can spend his way out of a hole, he'll have understood with every transaction that this money was gone for good. So although it's clearly a problem, and no doubt there's a link between the two problems, it is at least a different problem.

However, the key thing is, as you say, that he kept it quiet. What I think is going to be really important is to get to the crux of WHY he kept it quiet, because there are basically two possibilities.

The first possibility is that he didn't realise the scale of his spending, and therefore didn't realise there was anything to raise with you. This would mean that basically he's a fool who can't be trusted with the ability to spend family money, but it is at least potentially solvable - he might be able to train himself to be more aware of spending, or worst case you can treat him like a kid and remove his ability to spend via phone.

The second possibility is that he knew he'd goofed, but deliberately kept it a secret. This would be the killer IMO, because it's then not about the spending - it's about his fundamental dishonesty, and having established a pattern of dishonesty across the original gambling problem and this spending problem, I'd just lose all ability to trust him.

Thank you for your reply @ThePants999, I know the gambling and in app purchases are two different things but I know if they both are connected by addiction in some way. I have spoken to him since posting very briefly. He said he hasn't realised to added to that much but he spent £108.00 in one transaction, a week before Christmas! That in itself is not ok.

So I'm currently on the sofa wide awake and due in work soon while he's snoring his head off 😬

I will speak to him properly once I have cooled off

Yeah, OK, that's a good point - if the underlying problem is simply addiction, then it basically IS the same thing. I guess he thought he just had a gambling problem, but it turns out that he really just has a general addiction problem, and needs to address it properly. However, that still leaves the question of his deception, and whether he was deceiving himself or just trying to deceive you - basically, does he have one problem or two!

There was a great American programme about spending addiction and the psychologist described spending money that the family can't afford to spend on stuff like a $108 app (!) as stealing from the family. He is effectively stealing money from your children. It may be too emotive to describe it that way to him but he is behaving with a sense of entitlement that is so not cool. My mum has a spending addiction and it was so stressful to grow up with as we'd end up with these extravagant things we didn't need and then be struggling in other ways. Even to this day it is a problem. As an adult I am buying her groceries only to find that she bought herself a string of pearls and three bath mats (!!) for $1000.

Talk to him. If the amount is affordable to come out of his spending money (which you should both have an equal amount of, after bills and savings have been accounted for), and he realises that, in that spending this money on app things means that he can have fewer clothes, nights out with friends, gadgets or whatever he likes to spend his money on, it's not a disaster.

But if it's the top of another slippery slope, it might be time to split, especially if you don't want to spend the rest of your life policing his spending in fear he's going to gamble away the mortgage money or spend it on virtual crap.

What game is he playing and what are the in app purchases for? This is important as there have been several news articles on in app purchases and gambling recently.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/technology-42110066

There are more, I remember reading several a month or two ago.

My BIL is a addicted to gambling. He went to gamblers anonymous (SIL issued an ultimatum after discovering £10k of savings gone) and they recommended no access to money. BIL went to appease SIL but was both shocked by the fellow addicts circumstances and recognised himself.

He hasnt had access to family/personal money for around 10 years now and probably never will. She has to carefully monitor the credit card he has from his job for expenses.

She has been clear to his family that she will support him but only if his family support her (MIL had form for lending him money behind her back to cover his tracks even when she knew he had an addiction). All his family and friends know he has an addiction to prevent any lending.

LeeBird I would tell the gamblers GF about the rent, it is only fair she knows and can either protect or leave him before further debts spiral out of control. It will be tough either way but doing nothing and keeping his debts secret is encouraging his addiction and not helping him.

SW, I don’t like your user name, you are not stupid , any addiction is incredibly tough to live with. You need to decide if you think your dh has an addiction or is just poor with money. If you think he has an addiction you need to face it head on like my SIL and accept you will need to block all access to money or legally separate before you become liable for any debts he incurs.

@43percentburnt it's a wrestling game. Not sure what the purchases are actually for but he described it as to progress further in the game.

Thank you all for replying. I will go through all comments properly on my lunch break. I'm really struggling this morning after next to no sleep

My dh had a massive issue with buying online games through steam and the like. Because it wasn’t a physical purchase it wasn’t really registering.

We ended up with me taking full control of the finances after he spent £500 in three months. It’s been that way for 6 years now

I have messaged him to tell him to leave our home before I get home. I think he needs to realise what he's done. I can deal with anything but being secretive is one thing I can't and won't tolerate.

I don't want to have to worry about our bills not getting paid and don't want to have to police his spending indefinitely. I have two children, I don't want a third.

This isn't me turning my back on him, I will make sure he gets the help he needs. I just think he needs a shock to realise what exactly he's done/ doing.

yes I agree. I had an ex dp who had a gambling addiction. It is so awful and you have my deepest sympathy.

He did delete all the apps on his phone but I then found out (later) that he had been giving money to other people to get them to put bets on and he had been physically placing bets at the bookies (and no doubt gambling on those fixed odds machines etc.)

Like you say, it's the secretive thing that is the issue - do you know that he doesn't go into the shops and put bets on? If he has managed to stop it by just deleting the apps I'd be impressed but I'd also be surprised :(

I would actually insist this time that he goes to gamblers anonymous or whatever it is they call it - that is his sign to you that he is serious about it. I would be very surprised if he can kick this addiction without help...

and others are right, you are not stupid!

You sound like you're a very wise woman and doing exactly the right things.

Just to add (as I'm sure you know): the roots of addiction are almost always in childhood trauma, therefore addressing the emptiness caused by that is often more fruitful than dealing with one addiction directly, only for it to recur or shapeshift into a new addition or form of impulsive behaviour.

Would your dh be open to addressing what's at the heart of his struggles? There's all kinds of ways he could do this... meditation, Primal Happiness, a very good coach/therapist, forms of healing childhood trauma (eg the Birth Into Being method), or even plant medicines (administered by properly trained people).

I really hope you can both move forward from this into happier times.

Good luck, OP. I think you should ask him to attend Gambler's Anonymous. I don't know of any trauma in my life, but I have an addictive personality. Fortunately I have never gambled, but I played games like a gambler, so I can understand the mentality and it is not easy.

@MakChoon I didn't know that addiction can stem from childhood trauma.. something tragic did happen when he was a child which definitely changed his character. First time the gambling became an issue was around 16- 17 years old where he stole his dads credit card and maxed it out on gambling sites

It's a difficult one.

For all that spending money on app games is incomprehensible to me, its a hobby and adults spending money on hobbies is normal. It works out to £40 a month ish, which is not massive (granted, ML is not a time for inessential spending). If he was spending this on a night out a month, or gym membership, or craft supplies or whatever, provided it was coming out of his fun money nobody would think that problematic.

However, I can see why your Spidey senses are tingling given the history.

It would worth checking out the work of Gabor Mate then, it should be very helpful.

@IsaSchmisa I totally get what your trying to say. And if he had told me I can honestly say I wouldn't be impressed but I wouldn't have an issue with it. It's the secrecy that has caused this.

The glass on your large cooker door came off New Year's Eve, that money, in particular the large amount right before Christmas could have gone towards that being fixed.

@MakChoon Thank you. I will have a look into it later tonight once our toddler goes to bed

Yeah it's the context isn't it. Did you have a discussion about household expenses and fun money on ML?

@IsaSchmisa sorry what's ML?