Dog bite

[TheWormThatTurned]

I just typed a post that was way too long...

So, can I ask the dog owners out there:
If your dog bit another dog, in an unprovoked attack, and caused an injury, who is responsible to pay for vet fees?

For background:
Our dog is small (20lb, terrier), barks way too much, but generally ok around other dogs.
The dog that bit him is a Siberian husky, handled by 2 kids aged 10 &12. The dogs weren't playing, we were walking by their house as they were returning from a walk.

Owners of husky are taking the attitude of "she's never done it before". We're not paying a penny of the vet bill. Your dog barks and upsets her.
I'm thinking that there were young children around, and it was totally unprovoked.
It wasn't like she just growled / warned him, she went for him and bit him, he's got 5 stitches on his neck, a whole host of medicines over Christmas and we've got decent sized vet bill.

Vet has advised us to go to the police, which we're doing tomorrow. The owners are our neighbours, so I really don't want any hard feelings, but I also think they are in denial about what their dog did and how much worse it could have been.

Just looking for some sane advice from worldly dog owners about how to proceed,
Thanks in advance for any advice!!

I'm neither the OP, nor the husky owner, so my job was indeed done.

I picked up on the grammar, not because it had anything to do with my argument, but because your post was annoying to dredge through and I'm on holiday. I've marked all my books and felt like I needed to get my red pen out again.

Also, my autocorrect was not a grammatical issue. Happy to help.

I do get your points MoKnickers and Notreallyarsed but animals are unpredictable. If you have a "barky" dog then you've no way of knowing how other dogs will react to it. Our old dog was terrible when the kids were little, they were his "pack" and he wouldn't tolerate another dog near them. He was fine when out with just me or my husband.

Is it likely that this husky has form? If the parents are responsible then they wouldn't let the dog out with kids knowing it was aggressive. I'd be inclined towards believing that this is the first time and trust they will take appropriate action going forward. The catalyst for the attack was the confrontational behaviour of OP's dog, she needs to address this and act accordingly in future. Placing the blame wholly on two kids will not prevent OP's dog being bitten again if it's allowed to repeat it's behaviour.

Now I'm intrigued Valerrie. Please mark my work wise one. Behold Valerrie, dog trainer, champion breeder and school teacher! Where do you find the time?

Seriously, go on, correct my grammatical errors. Fly my ignorance like a banner. Teach me Senpai.

Just to clarify, did you address your dog's aggressive behaviour Valerrie?

I do take the point about barky dogs. My dad’s dog is an extremely neurotic GSD and she savagely barks and barks at anyone who comes within 20 feet of her. By contrast I heard our staffy boxer cross (she’s 6) bark for the very first time the other day, wound up by our new neighbours yappy spaniels Which start at 6am every fucking morning and she barked in defence of herself since they were throwing themselves at the fence aggressively. It could be that the husky reacted defensively, due to OPs dog barking, but I stand by my point that someone who can keep a dog under control must be in control of them at all times when they’re outside. That would have prevented this incident.

Sometimes, Sleep, childish behaviour is best ignored

I’m in the camp that both owners are at fault but if I were the husky owner I would pay and feel awful. Kids shouldn’t be out alone with such a strong breed but I have a dog with lead excitement that can be read as aggression and we are training him (coming on brilliantly - neatly said leaps and bounds but that’s not appropriate!) with distractions and positive reinforcement, we will cross the road if a dog will be passing too close etc. I hope OP will take on board that they need to work with their dog or accept that other animals may not react kindly to their behaviour.

And don’t buy bloody retractable leads! It’s so hard to gain control of a dog, particularly a large breed, with one.

The husky owners were more at fault, not just as their dog bite but with the kids and the lead it makes me so pissed off!

Hope your dog is recovering.

Oh for crying out loud, so a dog barking is reason for it to be attacked now? On what bloody planet?? In that case if i take offence at someone on here posting what i don't like can i bite them???

A dog barking is not good reason for it to be attacked if it is under control. If you let your dog approach another shouting its mouth off then you as owner are in the wrong because you shouldn't let it approach another dog - not because it decides to bark ffs.

OP please alert your local dog warden too, police will note things on file but dog on dog they don't act on (but it is worth notifying them!). Dog warden can act if they feel it appropriate. And personally i would ignore anyone telling you you were in the wrong cos your dog barked ffs

Hopefully, in light of events, the husky will be in future Notreallyarsed. It was a traumatic thing to happen for all involved, poor kids, poor OP. Tragically, if OP's dog is fear aggressive (rather than dominant) then the bite will make the behaviour worse. It needs addressing to prevent further attacks happening, either through training or avoiding similar situations.

Ah, can't find any grammatical errors then Valerrie? Or are you suddenly very busy?

Childish behaviour? Do you mean like name calling (dick, stupid, ideas are bollocks)?

No one thinks it's ok for a dog to be attacked, even if it is barking.

But reading the op, it seems that the bitten dog was being walked past the biting dog's house, near enough to the house and children to be bitten (ok lead was a long one, but even so bitten dog was close), and reacted to aggressive barking from the bitten dog.

I'd like to see the story told from the other side - I bet it's different (as many of these incidents are).

I don't think the husky should have been left in charge of children. I don't think it's ok that it bit the smaller dog. I would probably pay the bill if I was the owner of the biting dog, but I'd be very pissed off if a dog owner knew his dog was aggressive, knew he was likely to bark at another dog, and still walked close by.

As for correcting grammatical mistakes, how childish

I didn’t blame OPs dog, however if it hadn’t barked it’s unlikely the husky would have bitten. As I’ve stated previously, the owners of the husky are ultimately responsible because they didn’t ensure their dog was under control.

Nobody knows if the husky would have attacked had the dog not barked. I'm guessing OP (and many other owners of barky dogs) manage to walk them daily without them being set upon.

On a side note i bloody hate extendable leads, on any dog. The amount of dogs - even tiny ones - that are able to plod into roads or up to other dogs because people either can't or won't use them properly is astounding. Had the husky been on a normal lead there would have been less chance of it being able to make a beeline for OPs dog as fast as it did, even with a child attached to it

I agree extendable leads near roads are an accident waiting to happen. They give the dog a silly amount of leverage if they move suddenly, and once control is lost it's really difficult to get it back.

If you're going to anthropomorphize dogs Mustbemad17, then I'd hope that if I came into your house (territory) shouting that I was going to kill you and flashing a weapon (teeth) then you'd be totally correct in protecting yourself and your family (pack) by fighting me off.

I do agree about the retractable leads though, nearly saw a bouncy puppy go under a car yesterday.

I didn't correct any grammar, Mary

Retractable leads are used badly so often. In built up areas with passing cars and areas where there are cyclists and pedestrians. It also makes me cringe when I see owners letting their dogs run at full pelt then pressing the lock button, so they are flung backwards by their neck. Awful.

Sometimes they're useful for long lead training as long leads are a pain to keep clean and wind back up, but mainly they're not great.

As for the comment that they shouldn't be used on a husky because they're strong - they do have different weight limits. Some are tape not cord and huskies aren't terribly strong. I've used them over the years on well trained Malamutes who can pull up to 13 times their own body weight and none have ever given up. Certainly not for use on a husky in a street with a child at the other end, though.

Ok, making sarcastic remarks about picking up on grammar, as you called it. When I see people do that I tend to ignore what they are posting, whether it's sensible or not. Because it's annoying (and childish) and unnecessary.

Retractable leads (and barking dogs) are the bane of my life. They cause havoc for working dogs (guide dogs, assistance dogs) and learning puppies. I only use them for recall training, and even then they aren't great.

I don't think it's so much the strength of the dog that's the problem, it's that they can sort of get a run at it, and pull and jerk the lead out of the owner's hand. And then once it's long, you need strong hands and gloves to grab the "string" bit to retract it quickly.

Technically I think we are all actually agreeing with each other here.

Op should train her dog not to bark, or cross the road with him, and stay more than a lead's length from dogs if hers is likely to bark at them.

Husky shouldn't have been out with kids on a retractable lead. And should definitely get some training around aggression (or defensiveness).

I hope the op's dog is ok. And the children. I'm not so bothered about either the op or the ndn - as on many threads my sympathies lie with both dogs.

My Jack Russell has broken an extendable lead. He wasn’t chasing anything and luckily it happened inside (was leaving an apartment building). He just got to the end of the cord and it just popped right out of the handle. Must have been building for a while. So it’s certainly possible and not always easy to tell if a break is about to happen.

Their dog was allowed to be dangerously out of control by 1). Being on a flexible lead and 2). by being walked by children who are physically unable to control the dog and therefore the husky's owners are liable for the incident.

Report it to the council dog warden, the police don't deal with dog on dog attacks.

The dog warden will likely pay them a visit and can put control measures in place ie must be muzzled and leashes securely in public and walked by a responsible adult.

I hope your dog recovers. Perhaps look into some positive training classes for your dog going forward as barking incessantly at other dogs is not good manners and may land him in more trouble again.

Hope your dog is recovering alright OP. I think contacting dog warden is a good idea
..but only if your own house is in order.
Ie if your dog barks a lot in your own house or garden within earshot of the neighbours, a counter complaint about noise pollution would be on the cards. If your dog is quiet at home and only barks out on walks then no risk of this.

Sleep if you came in my house i'd pee on you 😝 But OP's dog didn't go into the dog's territory...and i'd be concerned that if the husky is that territorial that anyone walking past is a threat, the owners are irresponsible anyway!

The cord extendable leads are also bloody lethal cos they sometimes 'disappear' so unsuspecting short sighted in my case people fall over them. Grrr. Personally a lunge line built for a horse is better as long as you don't fall over the end

I really would contact your dog warden OP. Ours was really helpful to me (totally different issue). Really they should offer to pay or at least to contribute but I don't think you can enforce it. You could try the small claims court.

Really nobody can say if the husky would have attacked even if your dog didn't bark. It might be worth bearing in mind though if he is very vocal, especially as he could be more wary now. My dog trainer needed to point out to me that I should watch for my dog (young at the time) 'eyeballing' other dogs as it could make them snap at him. I used to turn his head he doesn't do it now.