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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

freezing to death

64 replies

Greenshoots1 · 27/12/2017 22:09

This is the sixth individual I have heard of freezing to death on the street in the last three weeks.

I haven't been at work today, but a friend who works in the same homeless shelter has just rung up and told me.

2 people in their 30s, 1 in their 40s, 3 in their 50s, 2 woman 4 men, 2 drinkers, 4 not drinkers,

if any of that makes any difference.

Are we being unreasonable to allow this to be happening in the uk.

obviously yes

OP posts:

allegretto · 28/12/2017 09:41

The youngest rough sleeper I have encountered in London this year was 2 years old....

A few years ago where I live a two-week old baby froze to death on the streets. The parents had hidden the fact that they were homeless and nobody realised in time.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 28/12/2017 09:43

The places to stay aren't necessarily where some of the homeless people are.

Hoppinggreen · 28/12/2017 09:50

If I see a homeless person I often offer them food or a drink and a few weeks ago I gave some warm clothes.
Without exception they all seem to have drug, alcohol or MH issues so having hostel spaces available doesn’t mean they will go. Our local Council has a policy of offering every homeless person somewhere warm to go if the temperature drops to freezing and volunteers are on the streets telling them this. Even so they won’t go so it’s the reasons for this that need to be addressed rather than lack of places

namechange2222 · 28/12/2017 09:50

Where I live the people who are homeless need to book their place in the shelter for that night at a certain time in the day. So many homeless here have addiction needs and that needs to always take priority in the day. Someone I know would plan each day to get into the shelter that night but life and addiction would get in the way. Once nightfall came the place hadn't been booked and he wasn't allowed to just turn up. And so it went on. To a heroin addict every bit of energy needs to be used to getcenough money for a fix, to contact the dealer and then to run around town to get the gear. This is repeated several times a day It must be absolutely exhausting. To take out a couple of hours to go to a shelter to book yourself in for the night is impossible when your life is so chaotic

makeourfuture · 28/12/2017 09:56

Everyone should have access to shelter as a basic human right.

Absolutely.

MorrisZapp · 28/12/2017 10:00

I watch loads of 'call the ambulance' type programmes and there was one recently in Birmingham where a young lad had nowhere to sleep. The amazing ambulance lady (whose job is probably poorly paid, and isn't meant to include homelessness issues) put loads of energy into finding him a bed for the night in a local hostel.

He then walked away from it twice, stating that he was going to sleep out. The lady had to give up.

I'm not saying he's typical, but it's an illustration of how complex this issue really is. We all feel horror at the thought of rough sleeping, and in theory most of us would like to share what we have.

But if someone can't stay in a shelter because they can't abide by the rules, would you invite them to your house? I just wouldn't.

The problem is much deeper and it starts with addiction and presumably neglect or abuse.

MorrisZapp · 28/12/2017 10:07

Also on here and on social media I often see people react the homeless /addiction issue by saying 'well can you blame them? I'd want a drink too if I was homeless' which massively misses the point.

BabsCabsIsLocal · 28/12/2017 19:31

There are people without addiction issues who cannot access shelter. I know, I was one of them. Please bear in mind it varies wildly by area, if there are shelter places in your area it's one of the better areas.

Original poster

Greenshoots1 · 28/12/2017 20:21

absolutly.

I work in two shelters at the moment.

The small one is for teetotal non drug takers. Many of our guests have jobs. We are able to get many of them into long term accommodation. There is a huge waiting list, More than twice as many people as we can take in are sleeping out, waiting and hoping to come to us and get the opportunities available for support nd help.

The other hostel is a large one, it takes drinkers and drug addicts, although they cannot drink or use on the premises, they need to leave the premises to drink and then come back. We do allow them in drunk, as long as they have no alcohol on them. We offer drink and drug counselling.

(This is entirely different to the small hostel, where a guest would lose their place straight away if they are known to have drunk any alcohol at all. This is because one of the ways we help them is by providing a reference to potential land lords, and this reference says we guarantee they have been teetotal in all their time with us)

The small shelter, for teetotal, working guess is hugely oversubscribed, with a massive waiting list.

The larger one which takes drinkers and drug addicts does have a few empty beds most nights. ( Not everyone there is a drinker or drug addict, many in this shelter are also teetotal and working)

The two individuals currently in my home (Through night stop) are both teetotal non smokers, well educated and with hopes of a home and a career.

OP posts:

anothernetter · 28/12/2017 20:42

Something needs to be done to address this. I cannot believe in this day and age that there is any reason for people to end up on the streets. The Government surely has a responsibility to pour money and resources into this area of need. I just think it's so sad that when we are tucked up in our warm beds at night that there are people outside in freezing conditions at the mercy of the elements and whoever they might bump into. It's an absolute travesty. This needs to be a priority for the Government to look into. Has anyone seen any online petitions in relation to this? I've just done a quick Google search but I can't find anything recent

Original poster

Greenshoots1 · 28/12/2017 20:58

The Crisis "everybody in" campaign maybe?

OP posts:

Original poster

Greenshoots1 · 28/12/2017 20:59

I've heard it promoted, but don't actually know all the ins and outs of it

OP posts:

BabsCabsIsLocal · 29/12/2017 11:53

Out of interest, OP, when you say "teetotal" do you actually mean teetotal, or just not actually an alcoholic/rocking up steaming drunk?

Original poster

Greenshoots1 · 29/12/2017 12:38

Out of interest, OP, when you say "teetotal" do you actually mean teetotal, or just not actually an alcoholic/rocking up steaming drunk?

I mean teetotal.

We aim to get people housed, and one of the biggest boost to their chances is a reference from us, and one of the biggest weighing questions on the references is about drinking.

Our best chance of getting some one housed is if we can say " to the best of our knowledge, this individual drank absolutely zero alcohol in the time they were with us"

Of course, some may drink and get away with being undetected, but if they are detected they lose their place, because they are harder to house, and we have waiting list of people prepared to abide by the conditions to get the best chance of housing.

so teetotal for the time with us is a condition of staying, yes.

And of course, many people are teetotal anyway, there are a lot of teetotal homeless Muslims, for example, as the two young people staying in my home right now.

In the larger shelter there are people who are alcoholics, people who my not be alcoholics but still drink, people who generally don't drink, and people who are teetotal, so a whole range.

It is certainly true that in some cases alcoholism is one of the factors in becoming homeless, or being unable to access shelter.

it is also true that in many cases becoming homeless and being unable to get into a shelter has absolutely nothing to do with alcohol

OP posts:

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