Very rude house guest

[kennycat]

Talk me down from committing murder please.

My BIL is 40. He comes for Christmas dinner every year because he has no partner and we have widowed MIL too. I accept this.

However, said BIL buys gifts for my two children, his mum and my husband. ( despite us having a no adult present agreement ) Nothing for me. He brings nothing in thanks for the feast he is offered, not even the booze he intends to drink which is copious.

He only says thank you as an afterthought once his mum has said it.

It drives me loopy and honestly upsets me every year. I work my arse off for several weeks preparing for the dinner etc and he just a comes in, sits like a pudding, gets waited on hand and foot and offers no gestures or help.

If I was his mum I would be bloody embarrassed about his behaviour; it is infantile in my opinion.

I've told my husband how I feel about it and he always just says ' well that's what he's like'. I know I can't change him but I really wonder how many years I can put up with it before I actually let rip and lay in to him around the table.

What do I do other than grin and bear (bare? Never quite sure) it??

Advise Welcome

Dsis is the same although she does bring presents and says thanks. Doesn’t contribute or help at all, ever. Barely moves unless she wants a fag.
If he did try to help he’d be shit at it I’m sure. Try not to let it get to you.

It's obvious that talking to your husband is not going to help.

Have you talked to your BIL about this? Because surely, that would be the thing to do.

When you invite him, tell him he has to bring three bottles of wine (or whatever it is you want him to bring). If he turns up empty-handed, ask him to go back home to get the wine he's obviously forgotten. If he hasn't bought any, serve up and apologise to your guests about the lack of wine and tell them it was his job to supply it, but he didn't bother. Ask him, then call him out on it.

When you have finished eating, if he doesn't say thank you, tell him that it's good manners to thank the host.

If he doesn't help with clearing away, tell him to take X or Y out into the kitchen.

Tell him what you want from him. You can do it in a way that's not rude, but which makes it clear what's acceptable and what isn't.

"Doesn’t contribute or help at all, ever. "

Have you asked her to? To be honest, if I'm eating at someone else's home I leave them to the preparations as well. It's their house, they know what they're doing. What are guests supposed to do???

I would just say you were going away for Christmas next year to break the cycle.

If that doesn't work, tell BIL he is in charge of bringing the booze. Don't have any in the house (apart from a secret place in your bedroom so you don't suffer)

If he doesn't bring booze and there isn't any he won't make that mistake again will he?

And I agree with PP that your DH is part of this problem.

Can't your DH start asking about booze bringing well in advance? He is making a contribution by bringing the kids presents. I would just let it go TBH and I'm not the martyr type.

I can't believe your DH hasn't had a quiet word. If he really is so socially inept that he can't see any issue with handing round gifts to all but one person in the room then I'd guess he's used to people "having a quiet word" because he's hardly just inept at Christmas!

Have none of your dc ever asked why no gift for mum? Honestly mine would have innocently asked when they were pre-schoolers, I don't suppose yours could innocently ask now?

I have to admit that by this stage I'd have indulged in some openly sarcastic digs, I don't think I could bite my tongue year in, year out. Eg Thanks for the gift BIL it's just what I wanted, so thoughtful of you. Or Cheers for all your help BIL, I've read on MN that some guests show up with one arm as long as the other and expect their host to buzz around like a blue-arsed fly waiting on them...

Yeah, ok I know but you can at least fantasize about it on MN!

He sounds frustrating. I wonder if he doesn't actually want to come, but does to "be polite"?

Also, perhaps he genuinely thinks that if the no adult presents is your rule, then you don't want one, and doesn't see how rude it is? Not sure - but your husband (who is presumably his brother) should just set him straight.

He sounds great compared to my MIL. Shall we do a swap?
I bloody hate Christmas and go into festive overdrive to compensate. I lost both my parents v close to Christmas when I was in my 20's so do a whole fake it til' you make it thing, otherwise I'd be dangling from a noose. My MIL knows this but still persists in being vile.
Got grunts in monosyllables, tuts and eye rolls all day : turkey was dry - well it wasn't cos I'd brined the bugger; two Christmas trees are self-indulgent nonsense for those with more money than sense; I am barren and spoilt - she has no idea what DH got me for Christmas; my cats are entitled and overly-pampered ( I totally own that one).
My DH loathes her and she doesn't realise that I'm the one who invites her. Well, she didn't until he told her in no uncertain terms. She didn't do the MN wailing MIL routine, just stropped out. Hasn't rung us and DH is a very happy man.
Oh and we did do all her food shopping every week and paid for it as she is a poor pensioner - 67 is not old in my book.
Well, no more. She can buy her own Mellow Birds, Actimel and man-sized tissues.
She also left the Clarins hamper we bought her but had decided and announced that to me way before DH told her to do one - it just wasn't Lauder enough for her.
Sorry kenny - needed a little vent. Do you want to borrow DH to tell your BIL to fuck off?

Christmas is a pita so far as I'm concerned. I have 2 friends with nowhere else to go so took pity one year. Now it's a tradition. One is 73 and has never cooked a Christmas dinner; the other hasn't cooked one for over 20 years. It would be nice if, just once, one of them would offer to host. Whoever it was that said "Guests are like fish, after three days they start to stink" was spot on!

The problem is your DH.

Why on earth is he allowing anyone to treat you like this in your own home? You need to tell your DH that enough is enough.

And, no, you are definitely not stuck with it - why should you be? Like you, I spend ages preparing for Christmas and to be treated as cook and waitress and provider of booze without thanks would be too fucking much for me.

DH needs to have a word, quiet or otherwise. It's not hard, you jsut need to set people's expectations and so far the expectation has been that you will do everything.

So say as things are winding up this year, We are happy to keep hosting, but next year we need to spread the load a little bit. BIL, can you bring 3 bottles of decent red and pick up the turkey from this butcher - we'll order it but it would be hugely helpful if you pick it up.

Or, do as my DH did with his family and blow up at them over breakfast with "You guys do realise Pop has been waiting on you hand and foot since we arrived??? Could you show her a little gratitude and maybe someone else could do the clearing up!" We were all terribly embarrassed but they were embarrassed and guilty and changed their behaviour.

You have my sympathy, OP, having just played host for 4 days to DB and DSIL who are exactly like this. Not a finger is lifted to help and no food or alcohol is brought to contribute, although we collectively get through a lot of champagne.

There was a vague offer of help from DSIL (this is progress!) which I readily accepted as the dishwasher was going on (for the 6th time that day) saying I would love help to unload and reload the dishwasher once it finished (it makes an audible sound when it does). I then asked for help when it did and precisely nothing happened.

If all of those who sat down after the main Christmas meal had instead washed and dried up by hand, we all could have sat down and relaxed half an hour later, but instead DP and I spent all afternoon on our feet, clearing up.

DM was the only other person during the entire festive period who didn't ask, just rolled up her sleeves and got stuck in to help e.g. clearing plates and made endless cups of tea for all (until I told her to stop and sit down because she is 74 with health issues and has "done her bit" hosting us all over the years; this was her turn to have a year off).

I do suspect some special needs (Aspergers perhaps) at play, and also DB and DSIL are both youngest children and child-free so behave/are treated as "the children" still, but how ignorant do you have to be to turn up completely empty-handed when you are prepared to eat and drink your fill and are expecting the hosts to cater for medical diets to boot? Flowers, a bottle of fizz, or some chocolates, and washing up after the big meal would have been much appreciated!

OP I don't have any suggestions, but this is why we don't host every year.

I think you must have my relative staying with you. This is because not only does my relative do exactly as you describe, but he is overtly rude and obnoxious as well, going so far as to openly insult me and pick and criticise everything from my decor, to my driving.
If he is at your house, this is because I told him last year why he wasn't bloody coming to my house at Christmas again, and exactly why.

Sorry. And if he isn't my relative, then this means that there is more than one of them. Arggggghhhhhhh

Who are these people who don't bring booze? I've never turned up for food at someone's house without a bottle of something

Mind you, I used to be forced go to MILs for Xmas every year, and I typically would not lift a finger to help. Not because I was blind or lazy, but because I fundamentally didn't want to be there, and because i knew that it was expected that the ladies would do all the cleaning up.
Had my now ExH pitched in to do anything, I would have matched his efforts. But he didn't. He wanted Xmas with his FOO every year because his mother would do all of the work, and female guests would do all the cleaning up.
I think I got a family Xmas at home once, and my now ExH deliberately made it as miserable as possible.
Wish I'd left him years earlier than we actually got divorced.

Did you mention it to him about the crackers (not sure if these were for cheese or ones that you were expecting to pull) at the time - like "Bill, where are the crackers that I asked you to bring?" if you did what was his response? Why didn't your DH say "Bill that's the only think KennyCat asked you to bring and you couldn't even do that, that's not on really"

"It's just the way he is" is usually trotted out when people don't challenge others about how they are behaving. Challenge them on it, they may squirm a bit when they are under the spotlight but they will realise that their poor behaviour will not go unnoticed.

Cannot stand people like him yanbu

"I've never turned up for food at someone's house without a bottle of something"

Family too? I don't bring any food at Christmas because my family always has way too much as do most people I know.

He would be incapable of hosting- I'm not sure he has a functioning kitchen and his house is a hovel because he's very idle- not for the want of the cash to sort it.

Surely he's capable of hosting at a restaurant?

If we didn't have him over he would have nowhere else to go which isn't a fair option.

But surely it's considerably less fair that he keeps coming to yours and never reciprocates in any way.

Not sure whether I've missed something... If you have no adult gift arrangement does that mean you don't get him a present and he doesn't get you or your dh one?

Blackberry, OP said in the first post that he gets presents for her DH. She's the only one he doesn't bring presents for.