Not a rape culture, you say?

[christmasrage]

Two men who had sex with 14-year-old girls avoid jail ‘because sex was consensual’ - The Independentapple.news/AGivyPy3QQGW-pAFDF8SlHQ

If the link doesn't work:

15 yr old girls on a sleepover, mucking about in bikinis, having a drink. 25 yr old men turn up with drugs and more booze. Turns into an 'orgy'.

Men get suspended sentence because skimpy clothing.

So girls who drink and wear skimpy clothes in private are fair game.

1DAD2KIDS why would you not say rape culture? Why not name it as it is?

Actually, forget that. I’ve just remembered you started a thread a while ago denying rape culture exists so I doubt you’ve changed your mind now.

Appalling. What kind of grown man wants to have sex with 14 year olds? The entitlement is breathtaking.

Has anyone who denies there is a rape culture, yet defined what rape culture means to them?

This has been all over social media in our area we are very close by. Its a disgrace and to be honest a lot of people raised concerns about this judge and his actions. You cant help but wonder if he thinks this is acceptable whether it crosses over into his personal life.

The girls are 14- under the influence of drink and drugs- unable to consent due to age and being under the influence so why this has happened I dont know.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_culture

I tried to find a good sentence in wiki to illustrate it, but there were so many. It makes it pretty clear we do live in a rape culture, and the comments of two or three posters are themselves indicative of that.

Where women (in this case children) who are raped are questioned about their history, behaviour and clothing- because if they invited it, it wasn't rape.
Where women don't tell because they feel ashamed.
Where 7% of students IN THEIR FIRST YEAR experience it...
Between 1 in 7 and 1 in 4 women in their lifetime, depending on whose numbers you use.
And on and on...

Another version... after guilty verdict but before sentencing. Wonder what changed the judge's mind?

www.middevonadvertiser.co.uk/article.cfm?id=110404&headline=Men%20face%20jail%20for%20underage%20sex%20and%20drugs%20orgy&sectionIs=news&searchyear=2017

It is utterly bonkers growing up in a world where women and children are seen as fair game.
What on earth goes through peoples heads, im sure these same men wouldnt find it acceptable if it had been their little sisters.
It is always the adults fault for having sex with a minor regardless of their excuses.

We live in a ridiculous country where they want to ban the burka but are quick to say its a girls fault for wearing revealing clothing if she is raped.
Women and girls will never win this argument we will always be wrong.
We have laws to supposedly protect us yet they have more loop holes in then safety nets.

Of course it is part of a wider rape culture. Why the fuck would anyone say otherwise? Minimising it no doubt so they can sleep better at night or because NAMALT.

Rape culture is a perversive attitude that normalises rape and sexual harassment/assault as a result of societal attitudes. Demonstrated by; victim blaming, trivialising rape, shaming women. This is an example of rape culture chapter and verse. What else is it? A single unique deviation from the norm?

I've been present in courtroom before and then seen the reporter say something completely contradictory to what was actually said.

Looking at quote in the article:

"But the judge said the girls 'must accept a degree of responsibility' because the sex was 'consensual' and they were 'almost naked' when the men arrived."

Look at what is quoted and what isn't. The judge didn't say that sentence.

This is what he actually said:
"Sentencing them, Judge Graham Cottle said:'By the time you arrived they were, if not completely naked, then almost.

And there followed consensual sexual activity between the two girls and the two of you.'

But you should never have been in that position. You should have turned around and walked out and not got involved in what turned into something of an orgy.

'You knew they were only 14. I have read their victim impact statements."

He does say that it was consensual but he might have been told that by the victims. We don't have all the facts of the case here.

I don't agree with the sentence at all and I actually agree with OP but I just wanted to make the point that what the press say is rarely what was actually said.

It is always the adults fault for having sex with a minor regardless of their excuses.

Agreed, for me part of 'rape culture' is even the ability to use 'I thought she was older' as a defence. If I worked in a supermarket and served someone alcohol who was 17 it would be no defence at all in law. Why does the 'right' to have sex with strangers override an absolute requirement to be 100% certain they are not children?

The law clearly states that even if it is 'consensual', it is against the law. Fact. No if's or but's. Fact.

Legally you cannot give 'informed consent' under 16 years of age.

The Judge should be ashamed of himself and the Attorney General should order an immediate inquiry. This sends out all the wrong messages.

Any man with even the slightest degree of responsibility and morality would not have even gone to where these girls were. Going there with drink and drugs are the actions of predatory peadophiles.

Regardless of press coverage, judge comments, these sick men are just plain sick and should at the very least be jailed.

I speak from personal experience and shout unreservedly that there are many aspects of the law in our country, being totally in-effective and morally wrong.

This shocking case is unfortunately just one of many.

That's a good point Ken. I don't particularly want to castigate the judge- there are reasons he made the decision he made. He should know however that no matter how willing the girls were, they did not consent because at 14 they cannot. Poor choice of words and he should do better.

I'm just appalled that this situation happens, that people can defend our culture where this happens.

I agree that you cannot believe what you read in the papers, asit is predominantly 'click bait' to sell more papers; but no matter what has been written, what the judge has said or not said, men of 26 should not be having sex with 14 year old girls.

Regardless of drink, drugs or consent, it is so wrong.

If the men turned up with drink and drugs, they acted in a predatory manner, planning to ply these girls or if they didn't know they were there, their sister(?) with drink and drugs.

Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.

We don't live in a 'rape culture' at all. If we did, old Marge in the post office would be quite literally rogered over the first class stamps by Derek the Postie every time he delivered. We wouldn't be safe to go out and we are

I don't think you actually understand what rape culture is.

I'm afraid OP I find these sorts of threads borderline akin to hysteria

And then you down play the issue by using misogynistic insults.

JacquesHammer

How can you possibly believe it is correct to attempt to inject humour into a discussion such as this.

This in itself comes across a misogynistic.

How can you possibly believe it is correct to attempt to inject humour into a discussion such as this

Nothing in my post was humourous. It was statement of fact.

Which bit did you assume was me trying to be funny?! The bit where I said a PP didn't understand rape culture or calling out the use of the word "hysteria" to shut down discussion?

Jacques was quoting a PP in bold.

Old Marge and Derek the postie?

Apologies if the reference to Marge and Derek were a quote from a previous message.

Apologies if the reference to Marge and Derek were a quote from a previous message

They were. Not my words. Nothing in any way humourous about rape culture.

If the 14 yr old girls knew what they were doing, then how much more so did the 25 yr old men.

Men want and they think they have the right to take any which way they can. And the fucking male establishment agrees. All the responsibility on girls, all the entitlement and excuses for the men. It's getting as bad as it's ever been.

That’s definitely going to appeal. I hope the judge gets the sack.

It’s a report by the Independent quoting the Mail??