To think no actually, English isn't piss easy for non natives

[twiney]

I'm in France and you wouldn't believe the amount of people who have this idea that English is really basic and easy, the irony being of course that they don't actually speak it.

Last night I was out with a woman who got on to the subject of helping her son with his English homework (she literally doesn't speak a word of it).
"Don't trouble yourself with complexity," she appparently told him. "In English they just make really basic and easy sentences. Keep it simple."

She then got onto the subject of English-language music, and how basic and straightforward lyrics are compared to the dense richness of French music.

I was brought up bilingual and between countries so i feel well placed to say that actually most French music is basically just poetry they've added a few instruments to.

But why do people think this? Is it true? Personally I don't see it that way, and I find that with French at least, I would consider it easier in the sense that:
A) Once you've learnt how the pronunciation works, there are practically zero variations on it. You can see a French word you've never seen before, and know how to pronounce it.
B) I find stock turns of phrase crop up again and again in French, whereas I find English "looser".

I can only think it has something to do with conjugation, or lack of feminine/masculine? There's also the fact that I rarely hear English speakers correct non natives, perhaps giving them a false sense of confidence.

What's your experience/opinion?

There's no other way. I don't like grammar, and have forgotten most of what I learned by now. Maybe that was why I never managed to learn to speak much German (not liking grammar). Unfortunately I regret it now. Could have been useful 🐝.

I was an EFL teacher for a long time, and have taught English to many nationalities. Basic English is easy to learn despite the irregularities (most of the irregular words would not hinder communication if used incorrectly), and I think this is massively helped by the fact that English is so omnipresent for many around the world, in pop music, film, advertising, social media etc.

"Questions pour un Champignon"

Questions for a mushroom

pour un champion

not Champignon obviously

I write it down to auto-correct on my tablet

Seriously, did you think it read "mushroom" ??

I get this a lot from native Brits: of course your language/any random language that isn't English is so difficult, the implication being that I never had to make any effort at all because I only learnt English and that comes naturally, right? And English is everywhere- not in my young days, it wasn't. I learnt English by reading Sir Walter Scott and reciting irregular verbs.

Seriously, did you think it read "mushroom" ??

Almost the point of this thread, no ?

And by the way, it did read "mushroom" .

I guessed it was a typo for "champion". But not having the background in French culture, I had to also wonder if it was some sort of idiom, or in-joke.

Somewhere I have a programme from a play I saw in France which mentions another play (a farce ?) called "Champignons malgre lui" which meant exactly what it said "Mushrooms in spite of himself."

corythatwas is that seriously what you are getting from this thread?

I must be reading a different one

I am reading a thread where lots of interesting people of many different nationalities, many of whom speak several languages and some of whom have taught them, are having a really fascinating discussion about the difficulties of learning English and myriad other languages as well.

But OK Please don't fall for the stereotype of British people being xenophobes and ignoramouses

FWIW I speak very passable conversational French, a smattering of Dutch, and I'm able to order a drink in pretty much any European langauge

@LurkingHusband
Sounds like a reference to Le Médecin Malgré Lui by Molière!

Aren't we cultured! 😁

In any case this thread made me look up "Questions pour un Champion" on YouTube, and I still enjoy it, I'm watching the 25 anniversary program now. (I had French in school for five years in the late seventies / early eighties, and it's still good enough to pick up about 80% of what's said in the program, maybe that is why I like it)

I'm foreign and speak four languages.

I always found English the easiest, by far. The Grammar is fairly straightforward, verbs are super easy and objects have no gender.

Obviously this is subjective.

Ceci n'est pas un champignon

Ceci n'est pas un champignon

Ceci n'est pas un champignon

Ceci est ma femme

*I'm foreign and speak four languages.

I always found English the easiest, by far. The Grammar is fairly straightforward, verbs are super easy and objects have no gender.*
Me too

I was asked my name in my French oral GCSE exam, i answered "Je m'appelle Champignon" Christ alive! This was 24 years ago. I have since mastered Spanish/Castellano and Catalan. I can read French now but my spoken French is rubbish. It is next on my list.

I teach EFL and the jumps from B2-C1-C2 are huge.

This is a good link explaining why English is so difficult. Most non-native English speakers, no matter how easy they think English is, never manage to become truly fluent. They just think they are.

www.oxford-royale.co.uk/articles/learning-english-hard.html

Most non-native English speakers, no matter how easy they think English is, never manage to become truly fluent. They just think they are
You could say that just about ANY language!

@teens - true, but there are a lot of smug non-native English speakers here. English is right up there with Arabic, Mandarin, and Japanese in terms of difficulty!

This is a good link explaining why English is so difficult. Most non-native English speakers, no matter how easy they think English is, never manage to become truly fluent. They just think they are.

@teens - true, but there are a lot of smug non-native English speakers here. English is right up there with Arabic, Mandarin, and Japanese in terms of difficulty!

You must admit that there has been a lot of smug native English speakers on this thread too. I'm not going back through all pages but one poster was saying how people thought she was native when speaking German or Dutch, but that she had never heard a non-native English speaker speak perfect English. But obviously that's because the British are too polite to point it out...

I've been told before that that Basque (Euskara) is one of the most difficult languages to learn- apparently it's is a 'language isolate' and the grammar is somewhat tricky.

You must admit that there has been a lot of smug native English speakers on this thread too
Yep !

And yet we seem to be living in a high water mark for non-English TV ?

French, German, Danish - even Sicilian dialect - are among some of our more popular shows.

Foreign language films are where London stands out against the rest of the UK (You'd have thought with the technology available, you'd be able to stream/download non-English films by the thousand these days. Apparently not).

@LurkingHusband

Do you know Mubi? It's great!

And can I just say that English people DO point accents out! Obviously not in a "haha you can't speak properly" kind of way (although DP and my DC's do that to me)...but in a rather polite way such as:

Is that an accent I can hear? Where are you from? or after mentioning my home country oh, I thought I could hear a hint of an accent there or I would never have guessed, but now that you've mentioned it, there might be a teeny weeny slight bit of an accent in there.

So it's not like it never gets mentioned at all.

Used to teach English as a Foreign Language. Depends a lot in your mother tongue and your exposure to English. Depends on what knowledge (as a teacher) you have if English grammar.
We have compound verbs like "get up" and their "fancier" equivalent like "arise". It can be hard to know if and how the compound verb can be split up, when to use the "fancy" version. It's not easy .