Grenfell ex-residents should get a 3-bed house with a garden if that's what they want

[pingodolcepo]

Daily mail outrage that some of the residents are asking for a 3-bed house with a garden. But honestly, they have been through a living hell that was caused by someone else's very bad choices.

There are plenty of people in London that have a 3 bed council house, why can't these people that have dealt with horrors get one also?

I know someone that got a council house in Highgate in the 80s, was a cabbie with a good wage, bought it when offered and sold it a few years ago for over a million and now lives in a fab place with loads of land and a pool in the south of France. If plenty of normal people got houses why can't these poor residents get one? They won't ever be able to afford to buy it due to the high cost of london houses now.

I don't understand the sentiment. Either they fit the criteria, or they don't. Creating some kind of special Grenfell criteria is divorced from the reality of high-priority council housing candidates - they will be all dealing with their own shit.

According to Rightmove, there are currently 33 low rise 3 bedroom apartments for sale in Kensington and Chelsea costing less than £915,000. Why did I chose this figure? It is the same cost that the government has spent via the stamp duty cut per new transaction (3.2bn cost, 3500 new transactions, governments own figures).

This will not end well. The last thread I started on Grenfell was pulled because at the time, I was flying against the hive mentality that all of the victims were perfect people who should be given what they want now.
Interesting to see, with the passage of time, that more people seem to think the same as I do.
No-one could possibly minimise the horrendous fire at Grenfell, and to the best of my knowledge, no-one ever has, on MN or elsewhere.
BUT, the residents need to be realistic.
If the houses don't exist, they cannot move into them.
I am amazed at people who seem to be quite intelligent pursuing the line that all victims should get what they want, without any idea of how this is possible.
I imagine there are thousands of people on the waiting list for council accommodation in K&C, and the situation will have been made worse by the loss of the Grenfell flats.
It's OK wringing our hands about how awful it is that victims are still in temporary accommodation, but my understanding is that most if not all of those people have been offered accommodation and have turned it down as unsuitable. This may be because the situation has been so politicised that the victims have been encouraged to think they can make unrealistic demands and they will be accommodated.
Or it may be that the properties offered were genuinely unsuitable. I can fully understand that they would not want to be housed in a high-rise after their experience.
But, if that's all there is, I am afraid that's all there is.
I think the stark choice most of the victims will eventually face will be:
a) Take another high rise
b) Stay in temp accommodation
c) Move out of the borough
None of which are ideal or desirable, but unfortunately, that may well be the reality of the situation, and no amount of campaigning, demos and pulling on heartstrings can change that.

They should be rehoused according to need the same way anyone else whose house has burnt down would be. They shouldn't be able to dictate bells and whistles because there is a lot of people who need housing, not just them.

According to Rightmove, there are currently 33 low rise 3 bedroom apartments for sale in Kensington and Chelsea costing less than £915,000. Why did I chose this figure? It is the same cost that the government has spent via the stamp duty cut per new transaction (3.2bn cost, 3500 new transactions, governments own figures).

How do you see these figures as relevant to one another?

TheFirstMrsDV

Momentum and other far left groups are turning it into a class issue and politicizing it;

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/grenfell-fire-exploited-by-militants-say-survivors-z60tdbqlw

And of course this has become political fodder only because the resident were 'disadvantaged'. There's no comparison to be drawn between Grenfell and a hypothetical middle-class victim set because middle-class people (if you mean what I think you mean) would never quality for housing assistance in Zone 1 under any circumstances. I would imagine that in any case they'd have carried fire insurance and the cost would have been borne privately.

They should be housed in similar accommodation (size-wise/bedrooms) as they were living in before. They don't suddenly get an upgrade, surely?

It is relevant since it seems very easy to find money when the main beneficiaries are not on benefits, homeless, or refugees. If the government can find 3.2bn to help an extra 3,500 buy a house, it must surely be able to find £45m to house those made homeless in Grenfell in the local area.

Agreed with cathf

Housing isn't something that lands according to the haphazardness of chance, or the gift of God. Land is acquired, and property is built as a direct result of choice and policy. The problem with supply in Kensington is a direct result of policy choice.

If it doesn't exist already, we can build it. Instruments like compulsory purchase of land exist.

And what about others made homeless by fires and floods Jazzybeats?
What about families escaping violence and crime?
What about families on the run from violent ex-partners?
Are they not deserving as well?
Can you see the point? Yes, it as awful, but many people are facing awful circumstances who you are advocating should be jumped over in the queue to make way for Grenfell victims who have been offered accommodation but it's not to their taste. Is that fair?

There are also families that may already be in emergency accommodation who are also waiting for a council house... Should they be shoved aside when a new house comes up, so that Grenfell residents can be rehoused quicker?

Sorry... Basically what Catherine said. Again :)

OH! That should say CATH, autocorrected it.

If it doesn't exist already, we can build it. Instruments like compulsory purchase of land exist.

Which land in Kensington is a sensible candidate for forcible purchase?

I don't know the area but surely most housing in London is neither high rise nor three bed with garden.

Won't most of these people be offered flats in non high rise buildings?

Exactly Museum. I just don't understand how some folk seem to think that the impossible can be achieved. It's weird.

Why are the Grenfell residents being treated like they're Nobel Prize Winners and jumping the queues for every possible help and get everything on a plate for them when nobody lifts a finger to help all the private tenants who live in London and work damn hard, support themselves, suffer just as many knocks and tragedies as the Grenfell lot but just get on with it?

Christ that's some chip on your shoulder.

The whole issue is that as council homed tenants they should have been housed in accommodation that was fit for purpose. You know, adequately safe so it wouldn't burn down overnight.

as I posted earlier can people really not see how hard it would be for people dealing with the loss of material goods, of life to just start again elsewhere?!

I can kind of see where you are coming from Franklin, but I would expect your post to be pulled soon.

Exactly Museum. I just don't understand how some folk seem to think that the impossible can be achieved. It's weird.

Yes.

I just can't see sense in the state providing housing in Zone 1. Like most everyone, I share the unease at the thought of London being a poor-person free zone, but surely the solution to this is higher interest rates, tax policy penalising non-doms etc (gently - in all cases) rather than pretending this stands up to any kind of scrutiny?

JacquesHammer The whole debate is ludicrous. They were asked if they wanted sprinklers and the panel which included residents said no. Now they whinge. They had the same cladding which hundreds of thousands of others in private accommodation have and that met all the standards.

as I posted earlier can people really not see how hard it would be for people dealing with the loss of material goods, of life to just start again elsewhere?!
Millions of us have done it without any help from the government for hundreds of years.

cathf Thanks. It doesn't break any guidelines, so how can it though? It's about time all opinions concerning Grenfell are voiced.

Millions of us have done it without any help from the government for hundreds of years

Well DONE on just being so much better.

It's not a race to the bottom you know