fewer d&v outbreaks in private schools...

[actuallyfromholbycity]

My friend works in statistics and research where she covers infection control and disease outbreaks. She told me from where she's sitting, there are fewer d&v outbreaks in private schools.

(This is not official research, just something she has observed.)

She thinks it's because parents don't think twice about keeping their children off an extra day if they are ill because they don't get penalised and because private schools generally have more money to do a regular deep clean and educate and enforce kids to wash hands after toilet and before eating.

Does this sound like bullshit to you?

Yep its bullshit with a capital B

I work in private school deep cleaning and fruit throughout the day have never seen either of those 😂

Not really that shocking is it?

It is a lot easier/healthier to be rich than it is to be poor.

I have been both. Trust me, rich is healthier.

Fewer students, smaller class sizes

Fruit makes no difference to whether someone catches D&V!, Calvin!!! hmm

Globally, it almost certainly increases the risk, very, very rarely in the UK though of course - fruit washed in unclean water, as against all hot food which is cooked to kill bugs.

If the stats are true, might one of the possible reasons be that when the kids are ill, the parents can afford childcare to take care of them at home? Or at least be in the sort of senior roles where you have a bit more control over your own workload, and where the company don't see you as disposable labour, so you can take the odd day off without losing your job?

My experience is, the lower down the pay scale I was, the less leeway I had to do things like take sick days off because my kid was ill, so the temptation was to send him in anyway if he was just a bit ill.

Less children will be the significant factor

...and that means although an individual pupil might then be off sick, the whole school doesn't come down with it.

(Forgot to put this most important bit in!)

As a private school teacher I’d say we have many more stay at home mums than when I worked in the state sector - therefore easy to keep your child off if they are unwell or even if you suspect they’re coming down with something. The working mums tend to be able to work from home/conference call etc if needed as they are usually pretty senior or are in freelance type jobs.

Surely it's just fewer pupils stuck together and maybe private school kids are kept cleaner? Ie through no fault of their own, some state school kids won't be washed as often and neither will their clothes so possibly more likely to spread diseases. My dad is at private and I have noticed her friend in state has been through a spate of illnesses after leaving private school for state. I can only imagine that double the amount of children in a class increases the chances of catching something. Dd private school place huge emphasis on hand washing (and do provide fruit in the fees).
Most children in private schools will be eating well and washed. Not all children in state have that due to poverty or other reasons.
Could be all bullshit though

My dd *

But private schools are FULL of the clap.

So, if this anecdotal discussion holds true, and there is less general illness in private schools than state due to class size; does this mean that on leaving school, private school children's immune system is weaker having not built up as much?

Yes, it does sound like bullshit for this reason alone: This is not official research, just something she has observed. As a statistician she knows this, too.

Wasn't there a discussion recently about how parents in better jobs were also more likely to have flexible working arrangements? So taking a day Wfh or off is easier to do than eg if you are paid hourly. And you can afford the hit of lost earnings more easily too. (eg I don't have to worry on the odd occasion my union has called a strike - I won't get paid but it's not a "eating or not" situation.)

That said, I would be suspicious of this without actual stats and a peer reviewed paper - if it really is statistically significant then it should be investigated properly so the same conditions can be replicated elsewhere.

ArcheryAnnie & paperandpaint have very good reason why this may be true.

handrails, I forgot the bloody hand rails in the foyer...

may just be coincidence that neighbour is ill and so am I?

and ds is a germ magnet. (hmm, maybe that is how the neighbour got ill)

healthier lifestyle helps.

I'd love to know what your friend's actual role is?

This is a lovely thread to read with intelligent thinking of the multiple factors that could be involved.

If your friend in anything more than a data entry clerk, I shudder at her ignorance of how causation and interpreting data

I don't think this has been mentioned yet... are more wealthy parents more likely to lie about the illness because they don't like to mention bodily fluids? So, under reporting D&V and over reporting a migraine or ear infection.

Oh so the phenomenon was a guess as well as the reasons?

Simple reasons.
Fewer children (not less) in each class. Less crowded spaces. Just imagine the average comprehensive dining hall where there aren’t even enough seats and no cutlery.
Better lavatory facilities and decent hand washing facilities. Loo roll.
Probably a smaller local germ pool.
In boarding schools, isolation facilities.
A designated medical room/ sanitorium away from other pupils and staffed by registered nurses rather than a receptionist whose also doing a hundred other things.
Fresh air. Time outside.

Just imagine the average comprehensive dining hall where there aren’t even enough seats and no cutlery.

No cutlery?

private schools generally have more money to do a regular deep clean and educate and enforce kids to wash hands after toilet and before eating.

This. The toilets in state schools are a disgrace.
As said above, the children can’t operate the taps. Also, cleaners only comes in at the end of the day. If someone doesn’t make it to the toilet in time in the morning then there is no one to clean it up until the end of the day. Often a few children can be in and out before a teacher is told and the toilets shut.

My DCS moved from state to private and IME d&v bugs are less prevalent in the private school. I think the main factor, apart from class size, is that most people who can afford private school fees, also have jobs/lifestyles which mean that taking time off is not a problem. The majority of families of children my DCs' forms have at least one parent who does not work outside the home so it's easy to observe the 48 hour rule. There appear to be none of the politics about attendance, either.

I'd want to look at the effect of number of people in household and density of people per square metre too, I expect both and certainly the latter to be greater in lower income families (who are in state school not private).

If you feel sick and you go home to your own bed in your own room, chances are your little sister won't catch it.

If your sister shares your room, or even your bed - she's more likely to catch it.

Let's throw another hypothesis in.

You are an alcoholic and you didn't wake up this morning. Your child missed school as a result. What's the go-to reason "she had D&V". Does your friend think that chaotic households are over or under represented in state schools vs private?