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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To wonder why people have to be publicy shamed all the time?

75 replies

Midge1978 · 17/11/2017 21:11

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mums-outrage-after-sexist-surgeon-11525580

Mum Jo Martin was unable to take three-year-old daughter Jessica to her hospital appointment because she was unwell - so the little girl's dad did instead. Two weeks later the surgeon wrote a letter saying "thank you for referring this lovely young lady....Unfortunately her mum could not be at the clinic visit today as she has not been well and father stepped in manfully".

The surgeon may have old fashioned views about the roles of parents, he may just have been teasing the husband. Either way it probably wasn't the most appropriate thing to put in a letter but I think it's safe to say he wasn't deliberately trying to make the wife feel "guilty". The couple could have ignored it or complained privately but no - they decided to be publicly outraged on social media instead and now the papers are on board.

AIBU to wonder why people seem intent on being a victim and being publicly and morally outraged at every human mistake? Was there really any need to publicly shame the man like that? Who actually benefits from all this - do we really achieve a fairer society or just one where people are afraid to talk to each other?

OP posts:
Original poster
Midge1978 · 18/11/2017 22:33

Call this shit out?! He made their daughter better! For goodness sake! I don’t think this makes our society better, it just makes people fearful.

OP posts:
ifnotnowtenwhen · 18/11/2017 22:47

I hate this.

It’s like dog shit and litter. Yes people are disgusting. However I do not need to see another thread on fb that starts ‘to the lazy individual...’ even worse if there’s a description eg ‘to the man with the white spaniel...’

Yes I hate people who do litter/don’t clear up dog mess/queue jump etc . Sometimes I pick up other peoples mess. But I do not need to photograph it and seek a dialogue about it.

WildBluebelles · 18/11/2017 22:51

Call this shit out?! He made their daughter better!

He's a doctor, not a good samaritan. It is his job to make people better. Does not stop him being a sexist dinosaur and I would call someone who made racist/sexist/homophobic remarks out by complaining against them (prob not go to the papers) even if they did make me or my child better. That's neither here nor there.

Iamagreyhoundhearmeroar · 18/11/2017 22:54

What wiggypudding said. It is recognised code between medical personnel. Being described as "pleasant" indicates non confrontational. I can only image what "manfully" means, but I doubt it's anything good. He was probably an aggressive pain in the arse.

McTufty · 18/11/2017 23:00

It was an inappropriate comment which warranted a complaint to the hospital, but going to the press was pathetic.

chocolatecakeatmidnight · 18/11/2017 23:00

IamGreyhound Uh-oh. I've been called "pleasant" before by my GP. i had no idea it meant that!

chocolatecakeatmidnight · 18/11/2017 23:02

going to the press was pathetic yup. agree totally. mind you, all these first world problems in the tabloids are a light relief from the war/terrorism/ benefits and job cuts stuff, I suppose.

KeepServingTheDrinks · 19/11/2017 00:03
mammmamia · 20/11/2017 20:40

Sorry but I don't think that kind of code is acceptable.
If they want to pass coded messages between themselves why can't they just email each other or something?
It's patronising and unecessary at best. Insulting and sexist at worst. I have a lot of time for medical professional and the utmost respect but I don't get this code thing at all.

mammmamia · 20/11/2017 20:41

It's a code that makes a subjective, irrelevant judgement on an individual that has nothing to do with their condition.

Slartybartfast · 20/11/2017 20:43

The surgeon sounds jocular
But the point is the going to the press
Don't people get paid for a story, it is such a nonstory, ridiculous

Slartybartfast · 20/11/2017 20:44

The dad hasn't shown himself in a good light

AndNoneForGretchenWieners · 20/11/2017 20:52

I just checked DH's latest letter. Apparently he is a "fit gentleman" and I am his "lovely wife". What does this signify?

Swirlingasong · 20/11/2017 20:56

Is it really a code? Are there any doctors here who can confirm? I remember getting one saying it was a great pleasure to me dh and I and our lovely dc. Nice as that is, I found it odd as a)irrelevant and b) pleasure isn't exactly the emotion that springs to mind when meeting to discuss a child's medical conditions!

greenapplesplatter · 20/11/2017 21:12

@QueenNovo I've just spent 40 minutes sniggering at the compo face page - I'm supposed to be ironing

Ttbb · 20/11/2017 21:18

Because they have no pride? I would be beyond embarrassed if I found myself featured in the Daily Mail (that's right-I dare you to lift this)

willyougotobed · 20/11/2017 21:22

As someone who's done NHS audio typing, it was possibly misheard by the person typing up the letter. They have to churn through a lot and the quality of tape isn't always great. But yes, I despair about the way people jump to humiliate others, particularly in the national press. I think it tells you more about the complainant really.

mammmamia · 20/11/2017 22:53

DH's one wrote that he is a 'charming young man'. He's nearly 40. It's nonsense and they need to stop.

Butterymuffin · 20/11/2017 23:03

Given that we keep being told no NHS employee has a spare moment to catch their breath, you'd think consultants would just get on with dictating the essential facts of the appointment.

nightshade · 20/11/2017 23:11

I've had the pleasure of reading consultants letters..

They tend to be conversational and directly to the GP...not for the public consumption..

They can be very informative...

And are usually drafted as a 'thank you' to gp for referral and outcome..

The general public are so up their own arse at times...myself included...

ZaphodBeeblerox · 21/11/2017 00:59

As an aside OP you might really enjoy reading Jon Ronson’s “So you’ve been publicly shamed”. It talks a bit about the psychology behind public shaming and why we like having these villains to hate.

I think surgeon was spouting sexist twaddle but still don’t think 90% of the sad face stories warrant the level of public shaming some people indulge in. I’ve had clearly demonstrable failings in care or service and found them resolved/addresses by directly interacting with the provider. But more than a few people I know feel the need to instantly jump on FB or Twitter to name and shame some poor Uber driver or delivery person - don’t understand what they get out of it!

elpinguino · 21/11/2017 03:30

Just to clear up the concerns about a secret medical "code" - there isn't one. Just as an example, if I write in a letter that "it was a pleasure to see Jessica and her father in clinic today" it's because it was! It's not code for anything at all. It really is nice to see patients for follow up that you might have seen months ago when they were really unwell and now they're better and doing well. It's one of the best bits of the job to see a patient who is well again. I have never had any "training" in how to write letters to GPs except in an apprenticeship setting - ie I used to watch the boss write them, then when I'm seeing patients on my own I started out by copying the style of the boss in my dictation until I worked out my own way with words. (It's really awkward dictating for the first few times!) Yes its traditional to start letters for new referrals with something along the lines of "dear GP, thank you for referring x, I saw her accompanied by her parents in clinic this morning" or for a follow up "it was a pleasure to see x in clinic this morning etc etc". But there is no code, and every medic will develop their own style. I can't say I've ever used the term "manfully" though, nor do I think it appropriate that it was used in that way.

TheStoic · 21/11/2017 03:57

Are people really losing the ability to deal with life themselves without having to garner public support?

Says someone posting on AIBU.

WilyMinx · 21/11/2017 04:35

Silly choice of words but she must lead a sheltered life if she is outraged over such a letter. And I don't see why she should feel guilty about missing her daughter's appointment.

nooka · 21/11/2017 04:49

It's pretty strange phrasing and sexist as it assumes that it was the mothers job to be at the appointment and some sort of heroic effort for the father to attend in her stead (manful = resolute or brave, especially in the face of adversity).

I'd be pretty pissed off if I read that as applied to my family. I might well share that bit of the letter with friends or post about it here. Who knows how the Mirror picked it up, I lock my Facebook down very tightly, but not everyone does that.

In a previous career I read a lot of letters from consultants, no codes but definitely favoured phrases. Most completely innocuous. Many 'this pleasant woman' (I worked in breast screening so all the patients were women). It was also strange for me in my 20s to hear women in their 40s being described as young, but most patients were post menopausal and in their 70s so to the clinicians 40 was young.