Is this a completely bonkers U-turn by the NHS?

[HappySecret]

My faster is well and truly flabbered. Can this be in any way reasonable? Justifiable?

From today's Times:

The system is shit. Dying pets tend to get better treatment than dying people as far as I can see. I'd welcome a system where we could pay for good treatment. At the moment some things aren't paid for by the nhs- because it's shit- and can't be bought privately- because the nhs should deal with it. So people suffer. Super. Let's leave people suffering, waiting for appointments they'll probably die before.

Its so easy to blame politicians for 'perceived' issues with the NHS. Everyone wants it to be all things for all people with an unlimited budget and a hospital right on their doorstep.

Its an impossibility because costs increase exponentially as people live longer and new drugs cost a small fortune. Yet when any government tries to make changes and improve things everyone is against it. The UK public needs a reality check.

Fuck me can't they just fucking charge a bit more tax and this issue is addressed
An NHS only 2% increase

It's so fucking fixable

An eloquence bypass there

I had to take a student to the ER (A&E) in Washington DC after a minor accident on a school trip.

PhineyJ, A&E care had gotten a lot better in the US in the last 10 years or so partly due to competition from "urgent care" providers who can deal with a lot of the problems people take to A&E faster and less expensively, and also because A&E is a major source of admissions for hospitals, so have a good, patient friendly A&E department helps keep the beds filled and the occupancy rates up.

In any case, I'm glad you and your student received good care.

My frail and elderly mum was referred to gastroenterology for suspected stomach cancer two weeks ago. The Prof saw her yesteday afternoon and booked her in for a gastroscopy today (thankfully negative). All the staff we encountered and the Prof himself were brilliant - professional, friendly, efficient and compassionate with both mum and me. It can be done. It is being done. We just need funding equivalent to that in the rest of Western Europe.

Sorry for typos. I’ve had gin. :)

Still believe the Australian system seems to be one that works, and could be Introduced to the UK. The current system of you will be seen within x amount of time isn’t working, people being bumped off lists. If the arrangement is you will be operated on at 18 months, it’s harder to shuffle that around. Britain needs to accept that an increase in the private sector is inevitable to ‘save’ public health. The Australian system of private health care being means tested, with TAC (instead of paying MOT everyone pays into a private insurance fund- all car accidents are then funded through this, not the public sector) and workcover- mandatory employer payed private health which then covers all work related injuries, the public system can concentrate on other things. Bit saying it’s perfect, but having worked in both, I despair of the lack of treatment family have received in the UK that just wouldn’t happen in Australia.

I agree with phiney. A trust I use has a grand piano and pianist in the foyer and three hour waits for a blood test. One phlebotomist compared to four managers who dealt with me when I complained.

My dd has recently recovered from my problems. Anxiety, depression, self harm. She had an underlying Neuro developmental disability. The BHS refused to help her. She has recovered because we had £4,500 to spend in addition to the thousands BUPA also paid.

The system is a complete and utter farce. The emperor has No clothes. It isn't free, It's funded by us for us and I am no longer grateful for shite services. I expect every doctor, every nurse to communicate nicely and to be polite. I'm sick of hearing It's free. It isn't. We pay for it, each and every one of us, as much as we can afford and we pay shedloads for shite services.

User the GP set up in Australia is better than the UK from what I've heard (I'm Australian). The $25 you paid is not connected to private insurance. Some GPs will only charge the government rate for appointments meaning they are free for the patient (called bulk billing) or you can chose to go to a GP that charges more than the standard amount. I do this as I find the free GPs can be not that great where I live. Wherever you go it won't be the mad 8am scramble for appointments or two week wait that seems common in the UK.

The $1500 limit you talk of is for medications not for insurance excess. Yes, the gap isn't large in most cases but it can be huge. It's not like car insurance where the excess is known and agreed at purchase. See this article for example www.abc.net.au/news/2017-09-24/privately-insured-women-with-breast-cancer-paying-thousands-fees/8979790.

Britain needs to accept that an increase in the private sector is inevitable to ‘save’ public health.
But explain why this is the case when by definition 'private sector' just means someone is making s profit off the back of it? What's wrong with running an efficient publicly funded system that does the same but without paying out dividends to shareholders?

And yes, I agree that pets get treated better. On the other hand I would be a bit if my DH went to the GP and they said, well he's getting on a bit, his osteoarthritis will just get worse, we can't fix it and he's had a good innings, you need to think about 'letting him go'.

What's wrong with running an efficiently run free public sector is that there will never be any customer service because all the staff think they are doing you a favour because It's "free". "Free" is the excuse for suboptimal care because the recipients must by virtue of receiving a free service be grateful for a poor service. Innit blad, whilst popping gum - and yes I've experienced that from a degree educated hcp. Good Innit? NOT.

a 2% increase in tax will be a drop in the ocean for the NHS. Unless its reformed first any money will sucked into a black hole and we will see no difference.

It's fucked, basically.

I’m with stopfuckingshouting we as a Country have to accept that if we want a first class first world healthcare system then we have to be prepared to contribute more than we do now. But also our Government need to prioritise healthcare when it comes to spending.
And we as a nation need to start demanding that the Government stops fiddling whilst Rome burns!

People have very short memories. Under labour waiting times for operations were drastically cut.

And also demand that NHS workers appreciate they are not providing a free service.

Oh and whoever said you don’t get Consultants in on Christmas Day, well I’d love to know where my DH is actually spending Xmas day this year then! Because I’m pretty certain he will doing the ward round followed by any emergency endoscopies.

Under Labour brasty - A chap called Tony Coleman, my local general hospital closed within months in 1997. Local medics begged for it not to. The previous conservative incumbent had kept it open for years.

DS was born on Christmas day in 1994. He nearly died due to incompetence and lack of senior staff supervising. Major London teaching hospital.

We spend less on healthcare than lots and lots of other countries, and then complain when it is not as good as those countries healthcare.
Its like going on a cheap deal to a caravan holiday park, and complaining because it does not match up to renting a luxury lodge. Decent care costs. That is healthcare 101. How would it be possible for Britain to get amazing healthcare but pay less than other comparable countries?

bluetongue the point about that woman paying thousands though is that her private cover didn't pay it all.

However she could still be treated free in the public system if she chose. If she chooses to go private it's not free for her because her cover isn't high enough. But as she has the option of free treatment on Medicare she's still better off than she would be on the NHS because the waiting lists in the public system there are still better than in the NHS.

The point is, it's not like the USA where if you're poor you have no healthcare. You might not get the fanciest hospital, or the best food etc, or necessarily pick the exact surgeon you want if you go public. But you will get medical care, and it will be free.

Under the Labour Government I was working in a cancer diagnostic service. We received a massive increase in funding and we used it very wisely, we invested in staff, equipment and training. We went from waiting lists that were months long to seeing urgent cases in two weeks and all patients within 6 weeks. I cannot tell you how proud and excited we were, and how much more job satisfaction we got, suddenly I loved my job.

It’s all gone horribly wrong under this Government and the waiting lists are back to months long. I’ve left nursing.