AIBU to define 'sex' as including oral-only activity?

[AlbaAlba]

I've asked around and some people say sex = PIV or PIA sexual intercourse only.

Most (maybe all!) lesbian women say very firmly that sex = non-PIV intimate activity.

Some people class 'sex' as oral or PIV/A.

When you hear or read that someone has had sex, what does that imply to you?

I'm a writer and trying to get an idea of the general consensus to see how my words are being interpreted by most people.

I think of oral and anal as being sex. So I do not accept the Clinton defence.

and how do you class virginity? If a gay woman has not had piv, but plenty of non piv sex with her partner, is she a virgin?

I'm with you, OP.

And I write in an amateurish sort of way, and had exactly this discussion with some other writer friends. I was trying to construct a fantasy world with no modern contraception, and a mixed warrior class who would do all sorts of sexual things but had a taboo against PIV to prevent pregnancy - to my surprise the general consensus seemed to be "but it's not proper sex without PIV", which I found strange, having had a long relationship in my youth with a Catholic lad who was "saving himself for marriage" but would happily do "everything but" - I still count it as one of the most sexually satisfying relationships I've had.

We need to see the sex scene to advise OP

I think of sex as PIV, if I meant oral then I’d say that. I think different people will think differently depending on sexuality and experiences.

Well exactly papaya, only in some very unenlightened minds I imagine.

No, I'm not writing a Mills & Boon, though we (male and female) used to have huge fun on field trips making up our own straining loins and pulsating rods of fire type scenes. I could probably write Mills & Boon, but I'm going for something a little more literary!

It's a close 3rd person p.o.v., but without writing out the scene that's probably not going to help.

It seems that the definition is varied, so maybe I have to find a way round it.

It's the whole thing surely starting with the kissing and fondeling and the other tweaking and touching and
Licking and inserting. The act of putting a penis into a vagina is simply intercourse the other is only oral sex or oral penetration depending on the fore and after

I'd say it's sexual activity but not sex .. If DP and I had oral I wouldn't say we'd had sex that week.
In terms of lesbians I think it does count as that's their primary sexual activity.

It is sex

OK, what about 'shagging'? Any agreed definitions on that one?

It depends who you're talking about. If you said someone 'had sex' I would assume PIV for a hetero couple, PIA for two men or manual/oral/scissoring/sex with toys for lesbians.

You'd need to say 'oral sex' for me to assume oral in the case of a straight or two men, and I'd only assume it was anal for a straight couple if you specified 'anal sex'.

I know that they are all forms of sex/sexual contact/activity but if you say just sex the above us what I'd think of.

We live in a patriarchy so most people assume PIV for sex. But if I had the choice of only having PIV or only having cunnilingus for the rest of my life I'd choose cunnilingus.

My DD's usborne book about sex makes it very clear that sex is anything including genital contact so oral is sex.

'Shagging' is the same as my above post - possibly even more so.

Yes, I'd generally take shagging to mean penetration. There's a reference to shagging later on in the book (talking to a 3rd character) which demonstrates that the physical relationship has moved further.

Context is everything.

Again I would take shagging as PIV if it's a heterosexual couple (not because I live in a patriarchy but because that's how I normally have sex so if you just say shagging that would be my default position). I really do think that if you specifically don't want your readers to think anything but oral they you must make it explicit in some way. If you just say sex readers could think either oral, anal, PIV or all three!

I don’t think sex means just PIV but I know most people do so I assume they mean that.

I am gay, and i usually count sex when there is an orgasm. both have an orgasm = sex

Every straight person takes 'they had sex' to mean actual shagging. Of course there are a million interpretations of what sex should mean, but it's overwhelmingy used to mean piv.

'I've just found out my teenage daughter has been having sex'

'what kind? Remember if it's piv then she'll need contraceptive advice'

Said no one ever.

I've had a long day, so my brain is foggy, but I'm not sure I understand the issue. Rather than saying they had sex or whatever, why not describe what's happening? You're writing. Show don't tell.

Sex=Piv

And I think if a heterosexual person told me they'd had sex, that would mean PIV to me.

Its sex; unless you do foreplay then you have sex.

Fucking someone is fucking somene. A blowjob is a blowjob. Fucking around is fucking around.

Four totally different things.

Three even