AIBU to think small zoos should be closed down.

[WellyBooties]

After seeing the news unfold about the escaped Lynx from Borth Wild Animal Kingdom, in Wales, I can't believe small operations such as these are still allowed to run.

The zoo in Borth had a lynx escape which had to be shot dead. Whilst this was happening the council decided to perform an inspection. In their haste to move the remaining lynx to a larger more suitable encloser another lynx was strangled to death.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-mid-wales-41964094

The owners only recently bought the place and have not come from a zoo background. They have no formal training. They have already run out of money and are crowdfunding in order to make necessary repairs.

AIBU to think it's time small zoos, who often don't have the expertise (or money) to look after the animals properly, were closed?

That's what I meant Dull - any zoo can have one incident. It's how they react to it and deal with it that is the key.

When the reaction to it leads to the death of another animal it's a huge problem. Sadly, whilst only animals lose their life many people won't get up in arms about it so it continues.

Although even the death of a keeper doesn't always make people think twice about going to a bad zoo so fuck knows what it would take.

oh right lala, reading too quickly!
yes, agree completely.

I follow the Lynx UK Trust on Facebook and twitter and they are unconvering more and more about what happened.

It looks like something suspicious was going on at the zoo. To lose TWO lynx! That’s insane.

Apparently the Lynx UK Trust might have a further update today. They’re also in the middle of finding homes for the remaining animals.

One of Gerald Durrell's books (Menagerie Manor?) ends with a powerful description of the difference between a proper zoo and a showcase of animals for display.

The conservation of rare species - which are often rare because their habitats have been destroyed to make way for more people - is to him a good thing, and he wasn't happy to let species die out.

If you visit his zoo on Jersey, you'll see how this can be done right.

It's a world away from an amateurish collection of non-endangered creatureswhcih is not aimed at conservation education.

We live near a small zoo/originally a zoological garden in Germany. It's depressing. The polar bears are stressed in the heat. The big cats pace up and down and look thin. People gawp and laugh at the meercats begging for food, and a lot of the enclosures smell terrible.

To further this there is masses of unused garden area which could be used to expand animal habitats, but instead they buy more animals and stuff them into the same small spaces.

We don't go any more. Yet many people here have annual passes and see it as a lovely day out.

Inernational travel isn't as prohibitive as it was so there's really less point in having zoos anyway. I like the idea of native resorts. IME it isn't even very impressive to go and look at an animal in a cage, you might as well watch a video on YouTube.

I can think of nothing positive to say about any zoo, large or small. They can never provide sufficient space; a lot of animals display abnormal behaviour, endlessly pacing in their cage or swaying/ rocking; I believe that some animals are still removed from the wild to restock zoos which is unacceptable and finally if they are breeding for conservation, how many are reintroduced back into their natural habitat, very few I would guess.

I would say the same about places like Seaworld - it's an abomination to put whales and dolphins in small tanks expressly for the purpose of learning tricks for the amusement of human beings.

I wish more people would think about boycotting the hugely increasing number of food products which now contain palm oil. The habitat of orangutans and other animals is being destroyed at a huge rate. saynotopalmoil.com/Whats_the_issue

They're all shit now, you pay £20 to go & look at some bushes that might have a "Dreadlocked Skink" lurking in them.

Bring back concrete enclosures & zoo keepers with hats....

I think zoo's have their place.
I've been to Chester Zoo a number of times and love it.
The animals seem to be well cared for and a lot of thought has obviously gone into their enclosures. They also appear to do an awful lot for conservation programmes. I'm aware of several species that would've become extinct if it were not for breeding programmes in various zoos.

The zoo where the poor lynx died appears more like a profit-making private collection run by insufficiently trained and experienced amateurs.

I can see that there is an argument for keeping a few really well-run zoos for endangered species and to look after animals which wouldn't survive in the wild for whatever reason. But the bar should be really high and most of the shitty little zoos in this country (and no doubt elsewhere) should be shut down tomorrow. Plus there should be a national body which assesses applications and conducts inspections. Councils are skint and I'm sure many lack the necessary expertise.

I agree that the standards for keeping a zoo must be high, for the sake of the animals. I disagree with the concept of keeping the animals & closing them off to the public, primarily because without public money there would be no funding. I'm against pointless breeding - someone mentioned the giraffe that was culled because there was no space for him - but agree with careful breeding of almost extinct animals.

I do wish that more was being done to wipe out poaching & canned hunts & the such, so that we can work towards a day when we can safely release some of our captive bred animals into a conservation area without fear.

I know, i live in a dream world

Well said safariboot. Although, I sometimes wonder at the wisdom of keeping animals in an environment so unlike their natural one. For example the polar bears at Yorkshire Wildlife Park. We had one week of hot weather this summer and the odd warm day, and it must have been so uncomfortable for them.

That said, the lion rescue and the conservation work they are carrying out with the Amur leopards is exemplary.

I agree that standards should be tougher and much higher for animals kept in captivity and agree with IrenetheQuaint and mustbemad

" profit-making private collection "

Having lived in the area for some years, I can agree that that is exactly what it is.

Let's be honest tho...we can't even get proper regulations in place for our domesticated pets. What chance have our exotics got? Poor things

Someone above mentioned the Lynx UK Trust - just wanted to say that this isn’t a properly recognised organisation, it’s just a husband and wife who decided to create a company. Lynx UK Trust CIC is an incorporated company no 09386570 with shares owned exclusively by Emily Elizabeth O'Donaghue. Strange that a not-for-profit Community Interest Company should have shareholders, they are normally limited by guarantee. Latest accounts made up to March 2016 show balance sheet value of £137 with £43 in the bank.
It is a totally insignificant organisation.

I’ve been really conflicted this week as I don’t agree with zoos and find the two deaths hard to stomach, but know the zoo owners personally (as friends of the family) so really do sympathise with them. They have only recently taken over the failing zoo and have worked so hard to improve the surroundings for the animals and get the zoo up to a good standard. They have spent huge amounts of money, worked around the clock and undertaken as much training as they could. It’s a terrible shame that this has happened.

All zoo's are cruel

It's hard to say how animals feel. Any judgement we pass without obvious signs of unhappiness would be projections of our own feelings. Unfortunately I actually wouldn't really care if I never left my house ever again provided that it is comfortable and I am provided with everything I need, food, a bit if company, books etc. so I really am not the best judge. I know, I'm a massive homebody, don't judge. My first impulse is to think that zoos are cruel but then some of the zoos I have been to didn't seem like a bad place to live (again, might just be me, I think I may have been a house cat in a past life).

Obviously I agree that if it were possible to maintain populations in their natural habitat then that would negate the need for zoos altogether but unless you propose to recolonise large parts of the world it's not going to happen any time soon unfortunately. I would rather that endangered species were bred in captivity in the hope that one day it might be possible to reintroduce them to the wild but I tend to be a shameless optimist at times.

Shiela2017 while I feel uncomfortable about keeping animals in captivity do we just let endangered species die out? For example it is estimated that there are only about 70 Amur leopards left in the wild. With so few of them left in the wild the problem with inbreeding weakens the gene pool and ultimately they will die out.

They have been hunted for their fur, and humans have destroyed their habitat. Conservation work is helping to increase their numbers, but they also need help from breeding programmes in zoos like the Yorkshire Wildlife Park. They are breeding the leopards with leopards from other zoos to widen the gene pool with the intention of releasing them back into the wild.

I don’t work for YWP, but have visited often.

Chester zoo has several breeding programmes where they have been able to reintroduce animals in to the wild the Bali Starling being one.

I cant fathom how someone can get a license to keep wild animals/run a zoo on this scale with no previous experience.

Close all the menageries like this one, keep the 'ark' zoos open.