How to confront Granny?

[Raven11]

My Gran is in her mid 80s and I usually do her food shopping/anything she needs so I firstly I can't just cut contact with her (which I would like to!)

IVe realised my Gran is a narcissist, selfish and cannot help but lie/stir the pot. She's always been like this looking back but I've only just noticed it for myself.

My Gran has done a lot of things this year but this is the most recent/ something I don't just want to ignore and carry on as usual:

My sister lives in another country and I quite often spend Christmas with her and my nephews. This year some other family members are going over and it will be a full house (already discussed with my sis, and spoke of how everyone would fit etc). According to my grandmother my sister called her crying as she didn't know how to tell me that there wouldn't be room for me, and that my sis would prefer to me to go another time. Gran then ended the conversation with a huge smile on her face with 'don't worry you can come here'. I. Shouldn't . Of. Took. No. Notice. I. Knew. She. Was. Lying.

Apparently the conversation went like:
DG 'looks like you'll be having a full place at yours this Christmas so Raven will have to come here.'
Dsis 'no, she's here every year and we can always make space, you could even come!'

I now haven't booked my ticket. I'm very insecure and while I knew my gran was lying I thought at the time that maybe i should let my sis and other family members have quality time together. It's now going to cost me 3x the amount it would have a month ago and to be honest I just can't afford it. My sister is livid and doesn't want to speak to her again as this isn't the first time something like this has happened.

My Gran loves trying to get the family members to fall out. She loves stirring the pot. I used to be extremely close with her but I cannot stand her. She just lies and manipulates everyone around her- I've seen it so many times I know my sister is 100x telling the truth. I want to have it out with her. I've never had an argument in life before, if anyone raises their voice at me I can't help but cry- she still makes me cry! I need some words of advice how to approach that she flat out lied to me and twisted things for her benefit. Any ideas?

Although your gran went about it in an unforgivably manipulative way, is she actually saying Help, I need some looking after over Christmas? and is far too proud to admit it?

Are all your nearby family going abroad? Who will buy her groceries and keep an eye on her/provide any company? Is she capable of doing her own shopping?

Maybe she feels lonely and wanted your company, but too proud to say so?

Older people often do get grumpy when their support network is planning on being unavailable. Because they are scared of how they will manage without it. But this takes things to a whole other level.
Nasty, selfish and hurtful.

Thank you everyone for your replies. There's no way I can afford the tickets now as they're around £1,000+ instead of the usual £300-400 mark. I usually go a couple of times a year for a month or so, but now the price of one ticket could easily mean I could go for my two nephews birthdays instead/I literally don't have the money.

I knew my gran was lying at the time. I just knew it but she didn't even mention it once the pressure I was putting on my sister by going. I'm extremely close with my sister and know exactly how she's feeling but she always puts others first so even if she didn't want me to come, she'd never tell me. But anyho, this isn't just about Christmas as my gran has pulled a couple of the stunts to get her own way a few times this year with me. She also has five living siblings who haven't had anything to do with her for years (I've never even met them albeit one). I also have 13 cousins and apart from a couple who have flying visits have nothing to do with her as she's done this to them as well. She also abused her children mentally and physically which I never really believed until recently as I always saw her through rose tinted glasses.

Today I should have gone over there to take her shopping but I really can't face her anymore. I've somewhat disappeared from her life before by moving away but then she'll just play the victim of being an abandoned old lady (which she absolutely loves being the victim) and I feel like I'm in the wrong. I need to say something to her but I get all stressed in this situations and just end begging for forgiveness.

Where is your mother in all this?

I trust you will NOT be spending Xmas day with Granny?

Can you set up online shopping for her?

What a shame you cant get a flight, dithering has cost you.
If you feel like you will be all weak and tearful with old gran then keep away from her. Have a nice Christmas day on your own. She knows your weak points by the sound of it and she sounds like an octogenarian bully.

Why has it taken you a month to find out the situation from your sister? You said you knew at the time your grandmother was lying so what was the point of waiting a month to have the conversation with your sister, particularly as you knew ticket prices would rise?

I also have two cousins who would have her for Christmas but a) she won't leave her home (as she's in charge and can dictate) b) she wants to watch her soaps/xmas specials c) has my uncle living with her and has 24/7 carers so won't be alone.

I didn't have the best childhood, so I spent my teenage years there for Christmas which I just sat at the table doing revising/course work as I wasn't allowed to talk in the living room for 6 hours.

As for the shopping she lives 100m away from coop so it's not like she'll starve, she just doesn't like paying the prices (she's got the money, but likes 'going shopping'). If she wasn't so difficult other members of the family would help but everyone has just had it with her. She has always been this way, it's nothing recent with old age.

The thing is, she was somewhat like a mother to me growing up and I do love her dearly. I'm just struggling with the way she's not only treated me for years, but also with everyone else. I think my mother would of been in a better position if it wasn't the mental issues she had from being abused by my grandmother herself.

Fast forward to 2018.

If Granny is increasingly difficult now six months down the line she will be an even bigger nightmare.

Exactly now is the time to deal with her on a brand new footing.

Forget that she has been the adult and you have until recently been the child/ young person in the relationship. Roles must now completely reverse. You must upgrade yourself to being the dominant adult in this relationship and constantly remind yourself that you hold the ace card'. Think of it as winning a big promotion at work.

You will immediately feel more empowered and confident dealing with her. She needs you more than you need her. All strength and power to you. Your life is for living. She's had her turn.

I know someone exactly like this and NC is the only answer.
No matter how old she is, she is still a nasty piece of work and you need to stat putting yourself first.

Thinking about it, I was speaking to my sister on a daily basis about two/three weeks ago. I was feeling pretty raw from my grandmother, as not only she she say things I knew were lies she also sad some pure nasty things which got me down. I don't really want to take about flights as it's pretty telling for outsider who may know me in RL. But basically the country (different continent) usually has cheap flights with budget airlines but once they're gone, normal airlines cost a fortune especially this time of year.

Well there's no need to feel guilty about not helping if she has 24/7 carers there, and your uncle.

It all sounds very toxic really but I can understand you saying you do care about her if she was a mother figure of sorts in what sounds like a very difficult childhood.

I can't help thinking that you delayed buying the flights assuming there wouldn't be extra costs involved and are now blaming all of this on what she said?

Really disappointing for you though. There's no need to feel bad about distancing yourself from your gran if you feel she's manipulating you.

What's the worst that will happen if you cut ties with her and go NC?

I hate how people can spend their whole life behaving in way that is unacceptable and get to that age. While there are so many nice people that die young.

Forgot to say... put increasing distance between your visits.

Granny could go on living until she is 99 and assume she will.
Try to do something new and fun every week and broaden your activity base. Basically find substitute activity that you can do instead of trying to prioritise and please her...

The person who needs to make the biggest change is you and you will feel so much better and less burdened when you gather your strength and take this route.

Full marks for ageism, classism, and total lack of empathy as to why someone who self-describes as totally caring and non-aggressive might think their family didn't really want them over Christmas, when they were told that by a relative.

I'm more than sympathetic to OP, but the bottom line is she knew GM was lying and didn't check with her sister. Sister is not likely to have told GM that kind of info. Big red flag right there.

No idea where you got the idea I'm ageist - I'm the one saying you can't really call out an old woman out even if she's extremely unpleasant. Perhaps you don't have elderly relatives to care for - but people's minds do go as they get older - aside from dementia. They can get confused and anxious, they can also get demanding, self-centred and unreasonable.

My aunt always takes it personally when anyone leaves the country as she thinks we should all be running round after her, which we do, but not exclusively. She asked me to give up my job and family to move in and care for her & was most put out when I said it wasn't possible.

OP's GM has clearly always been unpleasant. The combination of that plus old age is not a good one. OP needs to wise up to the extent of her manipulation and set very firm boundaries.

Well there's no need to feel guilty about not helping if she has 24/7 carers there, and your uncle

Exactly. She's got plenty of care round her so you can step back, see her on your own terms, and not pay heed to a word of her nonsense.

If she tells you your sister doesn't like you and to spend your birthday with her just say: 'What big ears you have grandma'.

To be honest, now thinking about things. This isn't about the flight or not having a Christmas but more of how she treats me/and especially my mum. My Gran does financially support my mum but in turn dictates and plays games with every aspect of her life. The reason my mum can't work is because my gran abused her mentally/physically from a young age and my mum can't hold down a healthy relationship/life nor a job. She also isnt able to get benefits so in a catch 22.

Now thinking about it, I can't just leave like I've done in the past as mum can't handle my gran. Also my gran can't be 100% vindictive towards my mum as I'm there. Hopefully this time next year I'll be in more of a position to get my mum away from her for good but really I'd prefer just to give my gran a good talking to so she knows she I've seen through her finally. She's literally brainwashed/conditioned me since being a child but i'm not going to put up with it.

I'm also going to drive over to my mums tonight and give her a hug. We're getting out of here!!

To be fair she probably hasn't got long left in this life. I'd just take it on the chin, tell her to do her own shopping and book your flight on a credit card and begrudge paying it off for the next few months. Take a few Christmas photos with your sister throwing her the V and post them to her.

Let your uncle take her shopping. He lives there. He know what's in the cupboards. Let him pull his weight

I don't understand. If you didn't believe your Gran why didn't you buy the ticket anyway? Or at least call your sister to check?

Good for you, Raven, try to move forward and not hark to the toxic past

Do frequent faceTime Christmas calls with you sister. Travel when you can better afford to visit and when you can get exclusive time with your nephews.

Plan time away from your Gran's home each day this Xmas - winter beach walks with you mum etc. Really concentrate on the future and try to airbrush her whenever you can..

Do you fear if you don't jump through granny's hoops she might cut support to your mum? Or is it more of a moral obligation?

There's no point giving a woman in her mid 80s a talking to. It will probably just make things worse for both you and your mum. She won't admit culpability for anything at this point. And old people are fragile even if they're still poisonous. You don't want to her to have a stroke or a fall or something that's then on your conscience.

Find a way to get to your sister's for Christmas.

Tell your grandmother she needs to make other arrangements for her groceries, because you can't be around her for a few months while you try to decide if you can move past her deceitful, nasty lies.

Your gran is a nasty. toxic individual, you are under no obligation to do anything she says. I would even go low to no contact with her. Speak to your sister to confirm all is ok for Christmas, then book your ticket if it is. If not, then have a nice Christmas on yiur own, of with friends.