To think the menstrual cycle affects our careers?

[Fianceechickie]

First day of AF today and I feel as usual, like a worn out dish rag. Most months I feel like this for a few days before/after starting. Not at work today but thinking ‘how the hell do I get through work feeling like this?’ I must have spent a quarter of my working life being well below par, plus when you add the probably dodgy decisions and irrational reactions I’ve made while having pms I can’t help thinking ‘what if all the hormonal stuff wasn’t there?’ What do you ladies think? I know some women have easier cycles but are women put at a disadvantage by hormones?

But you're using phrases like "woman up and push through" and "put up and shut up" which implies that you think women who don't (read, can't) do those things aren't as strong as you are.

That doesn't help. Why not adjust your attitude and think yourself lucky that you can take painkillers and get on with it, while appreciating that not everyone can do the same as you. I know people who can barely walk with cramps, let alone drive to work and concentrate for eight hours. Just because mine aren't that bad, doesn't mean I don't realise other people's are.

Accrual I have heard similar sad stories.

I have been lucky in actually feeling rather better since my periods stopped and I am almost through menopause. I don’t get anaemia and I don’t have that fatigue.

However, insomnia has replaced the above.

I actually find having a run of shifts whilst on my period shortens it by 2 days, being active and upright I believe makes it fall out of you quicker so it ends sooner!

It also says that women are only valuable if they can perform exactly like men.

This ^^, absolutely. In the trans debate we go on and on about them denying the biological facts involved in womanhood, but here it's ok to deny other biological facts, because those facts could be misconstrued and used against us? Not ok.

deepest I said clearly that was relating to me, I said that very specifically and I also said I wasn't sure if it was the right or wrong thing to do, but that it had prevented my career from being affected.

I've had my share of period horrors and that is how I have dealt with it. I'm not saying that everyone else should. I don't know what it is not ok for me to share my experience because you don't like it? You are making massive assumptions about my attitude to other people because of how I have dealt with my own situation.

No, but I genuinely think having that attitude is harmful.

If you don't have that attitude to other people, why do you treat yourself differently?

Why is my attitude towards myself harmful? How has it harmed me or anyone else?

Hmm. Well, I've had horrible cramps and the usual embarrassing logistical situations but I'm within the normal range and my career certainly hasn't been affected.

I'm not sure what the question is to be honest. My brother suffers from panic and anxiety which has affected his career. Some women have gynae issues that affect their career.

Presumably the drug companies are already all over it, as they want to make money.

What is the action required?

The menopause can have much worse effects which are more drawn out.

I have to also confess my mum had 'permanent menstrual tension' throughout our childhood and the outcome was her being a snarly cow to all and sundry then sobbing if challenged on any of it.

I think we should all support our colleagues if they're having an off day but I personally wouldn't want to work with someone whose default tone is snapping anger. It's just horrible and causes so much resentment.

Someone needs to invent a pill that will totally alleviate most period issues other than hormone birth control as they can cause a whole host of other issues. They'd make a fortune!

They definitely would!!

The menstrual cycle is an endocrine system though - there are multiple ways to eliminate periods but they're fundamentally only scientifically feasible either by dealing with the hormonal side or the mechanical side. From the hormonal side we have the option of combined of progestin only oral pills, intrauterine progestin or depot progestin - they may have other side effects but not sure how you'd feasibly affect the hormonal system without some kind of hormonal treatment. The alternative is mechanical - endometrial ablation to remove the womb lining or hysterectomy at its most drastic. It's horrific what women are posting they have to go through (I had absolutely no idea women suffered so much and so severely), but I'm not sure medically what the resolution other than hormonal or structural. Would be amazing if there was - hopefully if we get more women into STEM then research will throw up some more solutions!

It seems like there's not really a good alternative to things like going on birth control or having a hysterectomy for people who have terrible periods. Such a shame but I'm sure someone would have come up with an idea by now if it could be done. Maybe they will come up with a type of contraceptive pill that won't have as many side effects. I wonder if the new contraceptive pill that men can take will affect them mentally and cause migraines etc or if it won't affect them the same way

being active and upright I believe makes it fall out of you quicker so it ends sooner!

If only that worked for everyone..! Simply not possible for those of us who really really suffer. Especially if you endometriosis where the blood simply can’t fall out as you’re bleeding internally.
Movement and gentle stretching can help but it doesn’t scratch the surface

I have endometriosis and my period is so bad I get in a sort of delirious state, quite aside from the pain, need to pee every 10 mins, ditto bowel movements, all whilst shivering uncontrollably and occasionally vomiting. This is with painkillers.

So no, I can't just work through it! Also notice I am more weepy/less productive right before my period. However, I also notice a surge in creativity, drive, energy etc, mid-cycle ish. So I think if you averaged out my performance over the month it would add up fine.

I think we are looking at it the wrong way, through the lens of a male-dominated world. Was talking to a male friend ages ago about the idea of "period leave" and he said it would be unproductive. Well, it's unproductive that people have to stop to eat and sleep and things, but we accept those as normal bodily functions without (much!) question. Because men (aka "normal people"/the default) have those functions too. If the world was historically and currently female-dominated, we'd have the monthly cycles built in to our idea of a working life, just as loo breaks and shift patterns are now.

And if hormones wax and wane in such a way as to alter performance throughout the month, it stands to reason that there must be better times as well as worse times. But we are framing the worse times as deviating from the norm, and a problem... rather than framing the super-productive time of the month as an asset. (Struggling to put this into words!))

I'm now well into my menpause, but when younger had horrendous periods causing many days off work. I believe this had an impact on my career in IT where I was competing with men. A wonder pill would have helped.

If you had period leave would this just be extra sick days you could take? I wouldn't need any period leave because mine aren't any bother, but I have a chronic pain condition - if a colleague had extra sick days for their periods, would I be able to take extra sick days for my own medical issues also?

I’m not sure there ever would be a wonder pill but giving proper consideration to adaptations for women in the workplace, including flexible working would help. There absolutely needs to be honest and open discussion of the menstrual cycle (pms as well as periods and associated conditions) and perimenopause/menopause. It should be acceptable to say ‘let’s schedule that important meeting another time because...’ or ‘I think that didn’t go so well because’ or ‘I need to work from home because’ and that may well make some people feel they’re picking up the slack for women who struggle but to them I would say ‘you have the biological advantage of this not happening to you’.

It certainly had mine. PMDD has followed me from job to job and disciplinary to disciplinary. It was undiagnosed and the hardest thing for colleagues and employers is that I am like 2 different people. One cheerful, capable and competent and one angry, emotional wreck.

If you had period leave would this just be extra sick days you could take?

Obviously can't speak for everyone but for me I wouldn't need leave, just the ability to work from home 2/3 days per month. It isn't pain/hormonal for me, simply the sheer godawful heaviness meaning both commuting (for anything longer than 30mins) and sitting in work would be nigh on impossible.

I totally agree with a PP about the need for flexible working; I now work for myself from home and am just as productive on the whole during my period as off it, with a few minor adjustments.

Today I was in the classroom, alone because cuts have lost me my TA, with 32 kids under 6. I had to be there from 8.50 till 11 without a break. Because I am menopausal, I had to wear a super tampon, a big fat pad, and one of those pants for incontinence to get through till then as I'm prone to flooding.

The problem.isnt necessarily the period. It's the GP who won't "medicalise" the perimenopause and patronized me and the cuts that have left me unsupported in school, along with the Academy in charge who genuinely don't give a shit.

It's no worse to the awfulness we can all feel with various illnesses and pains.

It's no worse to the awfulness we can all feel with various illnesses and pains

Lucky you!

Just as I wouldn't assume all women have horrendous periods, you can't assume all women don't.

* If only that worked for everyone..!Simply not possible for those of us who really really suffer. Especially if you endometriosis where the blood simply can’t fall out as you’re bleeding internally.*
Movement and gentle stretching can help but it doesn’t scratch the surface

I was talking about my personal experience, hence saying “I find that if I”. I pass clots the size of cherries. Different kind of pain to endometriosis, but painful all the same. Wearing a menstrual cup has really helped me reduce my pain levels.

I think it definitely had the potential to impact on my career.

For a few years recently my period lasted 8 days in a 21 day cycle, and the pain also occurred mid cycle. So about 50% of the time I was in extreme pain, and my period was so heavy I couldn't make it from home to work without bleeding through a super plus extra tampon. There were times I'd spend hours clutching my desk and shallow breathing because I was too scared to move a mm in case i made the pain worse.

I don't want time off to deal with that, I just want a fix. I did eventually get to see a gyno and things are a bit better now but not "normal" still.

I never took time off - I figured if I did it once I'd be doing it half the time. It did impact my performance, but I think I did enough on my good days to get away with it. I managed to work from home bed when needed.

I know so many people who struggle to get referred to a gynaecologist. I think easier access should be the first step. Also better protection for all sickness due to long term conditions in employment law.