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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Or is exH? Childcare and maintenance.

57 replies

JParkson · 23/10/2017 20:53

Ok this has probably been done to death but I'm struggling to understand who is right and who isn't.. ..

Ex H and I have full shared arrangement of our 3 children. 50/50. I have them Monday Tuesday, he has them weds and Thurs, then we alternate weekends.

I used to pay for 100% of the childcare and nearly beggared myself doing so as I was earning half of what exH does. ExH paid a pittance such is maintenance and said that was all he was going to give me. If I wanted him to cover the childcare for his days then he'd stop paying maintenance.

In the end something had to give. I agreed.

His reasoning is that if he pays me maintenance then that covers all childcare costs even if the children go to a minder on the days where he is lead contact for parental issues (i.e. the nights where the children stay with him, he's responsible for them, so any problems at school, he gets the phonecall not me).

Whereas the way I see it is that those days he is demanding 100% responsibility for the children and this includes arranging and thus paying for any childcare as appropriate.

My reasoning is also that maintenance is payable - he's receiving a discount for having them half the week, so from my conversations with CMA and also calculations on the government website, he does have to pay. He says not.

Who is right?

OP posts:
Original poster
JParkson · 23/10/2017 21:21

Right now I receive nothing for maintenance and he pays his own childcare.

But he then treats me like his secretary.

He can also be abusive towards the kids, especially our eldest, but that's another story. I'm stuck in the arrangement we're in. I can't stop him having the kids now that we are as we are.

OP posts:
NetRunner · 23/10/2017 21:22

Others are right - no maintenance is payable due to 50-50 arrangement. CMS have wrong end of stick somewhere. He should pay CC costs on his days. If he is currently paying 'maintenance' which covers both his CC costs and yours, you have been getting a remarkably good deal and no wonder he doesn't see he should pay further CC costs on top! If the 'maintenance' payment covers his CC costs and you pay the bill, everything is as it should be and you have no cause for complaint.

NapQueen · 23/10/2017 21:22

He can also be abusive towards the kids

Drip feed much?

NetRunner · 23/10/2017 21:23

Nothing for maintenance and him paying his own CC costs is how it should be OP.

NetRunner · 23/10/2017 21:24

Agree on the drip feed... and it's also a different thread. If he is abusive you need to take steps through the family courts to remove or limit access. It has nothing to do with who pays childcare costs and whether maintenance is due.

BernardBlacksHangover · 23/10/2017 21:26

If he is abusive you need to take steps through the family courts to remove or limit access. It has nothing to do with who pays childcare costs and whether maintenance is due.

This^^.

Original poster
JParkson · 23/10/2017 21:26

I wish the kids went to parties (or clubs or anything else that is arranged with his agreement) on his weekends! I accept the invite after checking with him that he'll take them.

They don't go unless I remind him all the way to the last minute.

He does have his own clothes for the younger ones now but didn't used to. He also hoards the clothes for the eldest. The faster I buy them, the quicker they disappear. I've now stopped buying them.

I get confused with CMS. They write to me telling he should pay. I phone to confirm and declare it's 50/50. They still say he should pay. Then another says he shouldn't. A third says he should. So far he doesn't.

OP posts:
Gertrudesings · 23/10/2017 21:27

I have responsibility for dentist, doctors and shopping for clothes etc. But I don't charge for it because...I do it for the DC's.

Belleoftheball8 · 23/10/2017 21:27

Your not entitled to cm due to the current access arrangements

PretendTeaPot · 23/10/2017 21:28

NetRunner I understood it that the ex pays OP maintenance as she pays the childcare bills so it covers the whole time childcare is needed rather than having individual bills

Original poster
JParkson · 23/10/2017 21:29

No drip feed intended.

The abuse is long running, and is nothing to do with this. This is about maintenance vs childcare vs responsibility as a parent.

If IABU then so be it.

Thank you for your time and feedback, much appreciated. Have a good evening everyone.

OP posts:
Pickleypickles · 23/10/2017 21:30

Fuck the arrangement if someone is abusive to your kids why does he have them 50% of the time Confused. I wouldnt let my kids be that exposed to an abusive father arrangement or not.

tempstamos · 23/10/2017 21:32

If he is abusing your kids you need to get full custody.
ATM you share them 50/50 and are both paying your share of childcare costs so he is right he shouldn’t have to pay you maintenance as well.
I would be more concerned about him abusing your kids not getting a few extra pounds right now.

ohreallyohreallyoh · 23/10/2017 21:35

I too don't think nderstand why he is due to pay maintenance when you have 50/50 shared access. Is there a reason for this?

How many together couples do you know who share the cost of bringing up their children on a 50/50 basis. There would be cries of LTB if a higher earning partner demanded that household and childcare costs were split 50/50.

No maintenance payable is reasonable in cases where separated couples earn roughly the same and have similar out goings (e.g. Where care is hared on a week on/week off basis and full time childcare is needed by one parent so will have to be paid for both weeks, regardless) is fine. Where one parent is earning less and paying out, more then there is very much an argument for maintenance even where care is shared.

Flopjustwantscoffee · 23/10/2017 21:35

Picklreypickles, I assume the OP is in the U.K. But where I am 50:50 is assumed as the standard were it to get to court and one parent saying there is abuse isn't enough to change things - you would need hard evidence which is difficult. Since the OP already has a 50:50 arrangement it isn't as simple as her saying "actually yes I get every other weekend". Sorry, I know that's a matter for another thread. It just annoys me when people instantly start judging/saying well you shouldn't let him have the kids then when it really isn't that simple

Flopjustwantscoffee · 23/10/2017 21:37

But to get back on track, if it is genuinely 50:50 then it should be 50:50 on costs as well - e.g. On school trip expenses, buying school things etc. Do you have a parenting plan? What does that say?

Babyroobs · 23/10/2017 21:40

Can you not get help from tax credits for childcare if you are on a low income ? Surely if you can then you should apply for that then ask him to pay half of the remaining amount that you need to pay. If you have them 50% of the time each then no maintainence is due but costs must be shared.

seasidesally · 23/10/2017 21:41

do you get CTC op?

NeedsAsockamnesty · 23/10/2017 21:46

He is responsible for the child associated costs during his time.

That’s the entire reasoning behind no CM being paid with 50/50.

Why are you enabling him by picking up his slack, stop it make him step up and do it himself or formalise the arangement whereby you are responsible for more than 50%

AnneLovesGilbert · 23/10/2017 21:50

He shouldn't pay maintenance. You should both pay childcare on your days. Which is happening.

Stop being his secretary. It's a choice. So he misses parents evenings, they miss the odd party. While you keep doing the wifework for him, despite splitting up, he won't step up.

If he says he's covering half term, that's what happens. Drop them off and he can arrange childcare. Or take them to the childminder and tell them to bill him. As above, what reason does he have to step up if you cover for him.

If he's abusive then get proof and stop contact. But as you say, that's nothing to do with this issue.

Willow2017 · 23/10/2017 21:50

Its all very well saying if its 50:50 care then she isnt entitled tp maintenance
But if he us doing nothing with kids, keeping clithes so op has to buy more, its all duwn ti her to take time off for appointments and take kids to clybs, parties, having to atrange extra cover when he decides he cant be bothered to have kuds in holidays/cant be botheted to get child care etc he is hardly contributing much.

Why should it all come out of her snaller budget. Its crap and there isnt always a way to get ex to pay up for stuff I know from experience. And mine hardly sees kids never mind have them stay over. I have to find the money for just about everything .

NetRunner · 23/10/2017 21:52

@ohreallyohreallyoh Hmmm I see your point but it doesn't work that way. 50-50 care means no maintenance payable and all other costs shared. If OP is on a low income and receives the child benefit, the children will be classed as resident with her for the purposes of any benefit or tax credits claim, which she could use to supplement her income if required. If the other parent (here the dad) pays maintenance when there is a 50-50 arrangement because he earns more than the mother, you are effectively saying that he should top up what she has available to her once the children have been paid for - that's spousal maintenance then. If the children do a lot of expensive activities which were affordable when parents were living together but are no longer affordable when shared 50-50 because one parent has a much lower income, then it is down to the parents to come to a fair arrangement regarding the proportional split of such costs. A parent is not liable for child maintenance in a 50-50 arrangement but may potentially be liable for some temporary spousal maintenance where there is a large discrepancy in relative incomes - especially if this discrepancy relates to child rearing.

Willow2017 · 23/10/2017 21:52

Scuse spelling. Damm phone jumping around.

Original poster
JParkson · 23/10/2017 21:57

Thanks flop - I am in the UK and I'm finding it hard to garner support in the abuse front. He is very manipulative and charms the kids with money - he earns twice what I do.

That then makes it ok for him to miss DC3's medicine, to be verbally abusive to DC1 (he has been physical in the past) and DC3. DC2 seems oblivious to it all and doesn't bear the brunt of any apparent abuse.

I feel it's all linked with the finance side. When we were married he was abusive on many fronts, but never physical with me. Now I'm out of the picture on a day to day basis he takes out his frustrations on the kids. He started off so well when we first split up which is why I agreed to 50/50 but now neglects them emotionally. If you cant fling money at it he doesn't want to know.

That's the impression I get.

I've tried to restrict access. He played the perfect parent and had social services and my hard-as-nails childminder eating out of his hand. After I scraped my jaw off the floor and recovered from the smirks he threw at me I now fret and stress at everything.

As long as he's getting his own way the world is sunshine and bunny rabbits. The second I say no to something (taking a week off my new job to "support" him) then he gets shitty and takes it out on me as much as he can and the kids as well.

I have no physical proof. I have a DC3 that worships the ground he walks on, but hides when they mess themselves due to their medical condition. Cries for him yet when they're poorly on a day that is his responsibility - his response? "I'm a manager, deal with it. You shouted at me because they're with you on my day. I could take the day off work or work from home but I won't."

Words to that effect anyway. Add in a few expletives and saying how his work know how much of a bitch I am. Threatening me with recorded phonecalls. Saying I'm mentally unstable.

I took a day unpaid leave today to do so. I've refused the rest of the week.

I get the general consensus is that IABU with regards to maintenance.

I just figured it was the least he could do seeing as he's so generous elsewhere (!)

Thank you again and goodnight.

OP posts:
ohreallyohreallyoh · 23/10/2017 22:00

NetRunner I know how maintenance works. I also k ow that the 50/50 thing in terms of cost can't be enforced legally. I also know that in my case, my ex earns over 6 times what I do and pays nothing. During a period of shared care, he paid less. Sure, he fed them when with him but the rest was down to me. I can't opt out of paying because I need childcare to work and because my children need lunch money or haircuts or new shoes when the old Ines no longer fit.

It is not fair but let's face it, no one gives a fuck cos single mums are benefit scum/stupid/ get everything they deserve. My ex, on the other hand, is a hero for seeing his children.

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