HSBC - not being helpful!

[ruthieness]

Am I being unreasonable to ask HSBC to confirm over the phone that the exact HSBC bank details I have already been given for a limited company actually correspond to that companies HSBC bank account before my daughter makes a large payment?

The first line customer service person said it was not "allowed"
and refused to call supervisor

I insisted on speaking to the supervisor.

Back on hold

Supervisor comes and speaks to customer service person and again he refuses to help.

I say "If it is a fraud don't they want to help me?"

He say's "if it is a fraud that is up to me to check!"

I ask to be put through to fraud department - although I do not think it is a fraud!

Put on hold again for over 10 more minutes!

total call 28 minutes - line was cut off -
not sure them or me!
No call back!

Shall I complain?

There real question here is does a Bank have a public duty to prevent fraud and mistakes? - yes. However, confirming bank details of one of their customers to some random person who phones up certainly does not help with that.
"public interest" overrides data protection! - you have a peculiar definition of public interest if you think it means giving out customer information to any individual who asks!
but I am only interested in sensible views on public interest and if banks should be helping to deal with fraud and mistakes! - no, you are only interested in people who are going to agree with your point of view!
And you still haven't answered why you just don't phone the company and ask THEM for THEIR details!

You can check companies house but you cannot check you are paying the company!

Yes you can. You can check with the company themselves.

If you have an invoice from ABC builders saying their sort code is 00-00-01 and account 0123456 you can call ABC Builders and ask them to confirm before paying. Or if you get a call from ABC builders saying actually can you pay into a totally separate account, you can call them back and verify it. Or if they email you and ask you to send the money elsewhere, again you call them.

What is unreasonable is expecting the BANK to confirm those details.

I used to work for a company which sent invoices and which had several bank accounts, all used for different purposes. The finance team managed the accounts and moved the money around. In the accounts payable dept we used ONE bank account to receive payments so they did not go astray.

So in short, YABU to expect banks to give out information to you when you are not the account holder and could be anyone. YABU not to pick up the phone and check the details with the company themselves. YABU for assuming the company in question has one account only. YABU to be running around doing all this on behalf of your adult daughter.

Yabu op. The bank are not allowed to confirm anyone else's details to you. They cannot tell you if the account details you have match those of a company called XYZ. Not even a yes or no.

Shout, scream, tantrum, speak to as many supervisors as you like - it will make no difference.

You obviously have doubts as to the legitimacy of the company so don't be under any misapprehension...when you make a direct bank payment, you just as well be handing over cash in an envelope. There is no cover if it turns out the company are not genuine or if they don't provide your goods or services. None.

Be 100% sure before you send money to anyone that the details are correct and the company genuine - this is your responsibility, not your banks.

I don't think your definition of public interest and the banks are the same.

The short answer is the bank is the bank is not going to give you an. answer, that is their right.

If you are concerned contact the company in question. However they also do not have to answer you as you are not the person carrying out a transaction with them, your daughter is.

You can advise your daughter to do the £1 thing which seems quite wise.

You can also google the company with the word scam and a question mark and see what results come.

Ask the company, I've done this many a time.

I agree I am being paranoid - it is a problem for me
but all the real scams going on make me like this!

somethingnewtoday
You are completely right except for one thing
I did not phone my bank
I phoned their Bank with the details they provided!

Poppycorn
and if ABC builders ltd are just a website and a mobile and want money upfront - how would you "check"?

without screaming and shouting!
on the QT!

I agree I am being paranoid - all the scams around make us like this!

Ask the company is obvious but for some reason OP isn't telling us why she can't do what any sensible person would do

and if ABC builders ltd are just a website and a mobile and want money upfront - how would you "check"

Aaaaargh!!!

You have a business relationship with ABC Builders so you ring them up and ask them or , you know, have a conversation when you book the work with them

Why are you being so obtuse ?

and if ABC builders ltd are just a website and a mobile and want money upfront - how would you "check"?

Why the hell would you even use them though?

There are so many tradesmen about, pick a reputable one, look at reviews, go off a recommendation or ask for a reference. Check the details held at Companies house and then call the number held and ask for a Director.

OP, where did the bank account details come from, that your dd is using to make the payment?

Why would there be any concern that perhaps the information is not genuine, and that makes you want to check?

(Incidentally, when banks talk about the public interest, they are talking about money-laundering, international fraud, drug money, terrorism and the like; and where they are obliged to release information as directed by the courts etc).

Sandy the op is looking at using a company for the first time, she has no business relationship with them. She wants to make sure the account details on their website actually belong to a company of the same name.

To confirm a set of account details belong to someone or a company is technically breaking data protection for them.

Get the company you’re paying to confirm if they’re correct.

OP If 'ABC Builders Ltd' are just a website and a mobile number, then I wouldn't pay them anything upfront without checking Companies House, and asking the local Trading Standards people first.

Even then I'd be wary and would prefer to part with my money after the work has been done to my satisfaction.

I really don't understand why you are calling instead of your daughter. You probably rang around asking if X shop had any Saturday jobs for her.

Travis this would not be breaching data protection. The data protection act only applies to individuals, not companies.

OP: why is your daughter paying money to someone she does not know.......this sounds very familiar...please read.....

On this subject on Radio 4 last week there was reports of significant fraud whereby a fraudster company had set up a website in a very similar name as a reputable consultancy who manage government grants.

It was a terrible case where a hairdressing salon owner thought she was getting a government grant but had to pay some monies up front first to set it all up. She got her accountant and her bank to check it out. Of course, it all checked out fine: indeed her accountant checked at Companies House etc, all looked fine, but the fraudsters had set a fake website with fake bank details. Hairdresser had done her due diligence, but still got scammed even after bank and accountant had checked it out for her.

Radio 4 advises doing LOADS of due diligence but also mentioned a website (name of which I have forgotten) where you can check how long a website has been operating. If you are dealing with say John Lewis but the webpage you have been referred to is only 3 days old then that may give you cause for concern.

Sandy the op is looking at using a company for the first time, she has no business relationship with them. She wants to make sure the account details on their website actually belong to a company of the same name

If she doesn't have a busines relationship with them she won't be paying them will she?

If she decides to use their services i.e. when she gets to the stage of needing to pay them the relationship will be established and presumably she will have spoken to someone or had contact

Or have I misunderstood and she randomly wants to check bank account details on people's websites

There are no account details on their website! They give the account number by email or text! - perhaps they should!

Maybe this is the answer! very useful - thank you!

Companies house do not provide a phone number.

details from companies house on abc builders not including sole traders and partnerships!!

ABC BUILDERS LIMITED
03860503 - Incorporated on 18 October 1999
155 Wellingborough Road, Rushden, Northamptonshire, NN10 9TB
ABC BUILDERS LONDON LTD
09257657 - Incorporated on 9 October 2014
134 High Street, New Malden, London, England, KT3 4EP
ABC BUILDERS MERCHANTS LIMITED
06823614 - Incorporated on 18 February 2009 - Liquidation
Unit 6 Raglan Street, Hyde, Cheshire, United Kingdom, SK14 2DX
ARC COUNSTRUCTION LTD
Matching previous names:
ABC BUILDERS CONTRACTORS
10088048 - Dissolved on 31 January 2017
Office 225 2a Ruckholt Road, Legacy Business Centre, London, United Kingdom, E10 5NP
ABC GENERAL BUILDERS LTD.
SC378821 - Dissolved on 30 August 2016
64 Clarion Crescent, Glasgow, United Kingdom, G13 3LG

I think the op said the company wanted the money upfront. This is why she wants to check they are legitimate and the account details they quote are valid.

I understand why the op wants to do this, she just can't.

As mentioned on page 1, send a pound, check they got it.

No need for such a massive drama.

yes there are ways to check a website history
"way back machine"

but Companies often change their domain name and provider
and this is not definitive!

Wheresmyphone
That sounds like a terrible case!
Shocking!
this is just what I am talking about!

If it was more than she can afford to lose we would refuse to go ahead without getting consent from the company to talk to the bank but I need to trust her but my paranoia does not!

pengggwn

Why not read the HSBC terms and conditions for bank accounts as I have?

Get some facts?

Rx