To breast feed if it's causing DS pain or discomfort?

[QueenAmongstMen]

I have a 6 week old baby and at Day 7 I had him assessed for Tongue Tie because feeding was horrendous and at Day 9 he had it snipped.

Feeding was pain free following the division but I've continued to have problems on one breast with poor attachment, clicking noises, milk leaking out the side of his mouth and lots of spluttering. His feeding on the other breast still isn't perfect but pretty close.

Due to being 5 weeks post Tongue-tie repair and still having these problems I had him reassessed three days ago and after lots of discussion, reassessment of his sucking abilities and observing feeds the woman said the problems I'm having aren't related to his tongue tie and in her opinion it's because he has a misalignment of his neck. He has always tilted his head to the left and she said it's very common in c-section babies, which is how DS was delivered. She advised I see a Chiropractor or someone who performs cranial osteopathy in order to correct his neck positioning.

It is likely that breast feeding is uncomfortable for him due to him being unable to feed in the correct position and having to twist his neck in an unnatural position for him and I can see that this makes sense as DS has never comfort fed and unless he's hungry he will not go to the breast. His feeds are often very quick and it's like he sees them as nothing but a food supply and he wants to get the job done as quickly as possible.

I will be contacting the Chiropractor tomorrow and it's usually a week wait for the initial consultation and then weekly sessions with most necks being corrected in three sessions.

I was talking to my brother about it this evening and he basically said I'm being cruel to continue breast feeding if it's causing discomfort and I should just "put him on the bottle." I explained I was intending to get the misalignment corrected and within a month things should be fine but he said that a month is a long time to go if I'm causing DS discomfort.

His comments were quite upsetting actually as I had never considered myself to be doing anything wrong by DS by intending to continue breast feeding him.

Aside from the feeding difficulties mentioned above DS appears settled at the breast and doesn't seem to be in pain or discomfort hence my plan to just carry on breast feeding alongside having treatment but my brother has made me doubt myself now.

Is continuing to breast feed for the next month really such a bad thing? Even if it's slightly uncomfortable until treatment is complete it's no different to what he's used to anyway, and surely the benefits of him being able to breast feed correctly after the treatment outweigh the ease of just putting him on bottles instead?

Has anyone else been in a situation like this?

Instead of turning him round to feed off the other breast can you just move him across using pillows at the side of you to help support him.

I could try this but again, it's not something you can do at each feed unless you stay in the house all day and I can't do that. I suppose though that I could feed on the good side whilst out and about and the bad side when I'm home when I can feed in the more socially awkward positions.

Sorry OP, I do not know the answer to this but I think I have read that laid back feeding is a good position if you have a fats let down (you put some cushions behind you, seat back and sort of lay baby on your chest). You could also try to express before a feed.

cheby - it's my right side that is problematic too. His weight has always been between the 75th-91st percentile hence why I've just carried on.

My family in general are pretty anti-breastfeeding so that doesn't help matters.

Maybe because BF went so well with DS1 I'm unrealistically looking for it to be perfect this time round too, which as a lot of you gave said, there is no perfect breast feed. I think I need to just stop striving for something and instead just work with what I've got.

Please take home to a cranial osteopath asap, and for now feed on one side only, and express she n the other?

Cranial osteopathy isn't 'woo' at all...my midwife recommended it to me after my DDs instrumental birth/shoulder dystochia as she would only feed on one side happily. it was amazing, had 6 sessions and after 4 she was a totally different baby. She started sleeping much better immediately, the osteo pointed out she would turn her whole body to the left rather than turn her head, she was clearly unable to do it. I bf for 18 months after that, no further issues. Your brother is wrong imho, switching to bottles isn't addressing the problem.

I agree with others that it's worth trying to feed him so he lies the same way. I had an amazing breastfeeding pillow. I don't think it was intended as such, but worked well. It was a V-shaped foam pillow from Dunelm, I think. Baby can then lie in a comfortable position to feed.

I've got a V pillow so I will experiment in the morning.

I've started feeding him in the bad side and this time, rather than put him nose to nipple and aim for the perfect attachment position I let him just bob around my boob to let him self attach and he found his own position. He is at a funny angle and his head is twisted a little but he's feeding really well!! No clicking or leakage and he's been going for over 20 minutes - very unlike him!! It feels a little uncomfortable for me but it's worth it to feel like he's getting a good feed.

My husband was just playing with him and holding him up in the air and his head droop/tilt to the left side was really obvious so we will get him seen.

The LC did say that seeking out treatment was completely optional but for the sake of a successful BF relationship she'd recommend it. She said the problem normally rectifies itself naturally but that she can't say whether it would be in 5 months or 5 years. She also said that if left untreated and it also not resolving itself can lead to nerve related problems in the neck and upper back in the future.

I don't really know much about cranial osteopathy so I will make an appointment tomorrow for a Consult and take it from there.

Hi OP. I can relate! Was the CS due to malposition in the womb? MY DS2 (currently 16 weeks) was transverse for much of the second half of pregnancy, and is strongly averse to looking left. I fed DS1 until he was roughly 2.5 years.

We're currently partway through an initial 4 week course of chiropractic care, and it is making a huge difference, tonight he has actually fallen asleep with face turned to the left. He has had some feeding challenges, but these seem to be related to letdown rather than position. My right boob is trigger happy (spraying people in cafes - not my greatest moments!), whereas my left is more of a trickle. I've found just after a growth spurt to be the most challenging.

He's never much been one for comfort feeding, but I attribute that to personality, he's like me and wants to be off and doing things, he's also not massively into cuddles, whereas DS1 was much more laid back and loved nothing more than a long leisurely feed.

I've pretty much always let him lead with positioning - if anything he positions more normally that DS1 (who liked to be bolt upright straddling my leg), but not still not conventionally, and it's much easier at home where we can use a v shaped pillow. For feeding out and about, a chair with arms works well instead of the pillow.

Our family chiropractor is fantastic, very experienced with children and specialises in latch issues. I just wish I spotted the problem sooner as we are now also having to work on flattening to one side of the head as well.

You'll probably be advised to do loads of tummy time to help with strengthening the neck muscles, so ask for ideas on how to do more. I pop DS2 on the bed and sit and talk to him from floor, and we do some stuff with my birthing ball.

Best of luck to you, and hope your bf journey continues for as long as both of you want!

Sorry for the mini essay!

My daughter was born via emerging c-section and she had neck problems and was diagnosed with torticollis she ended up seeing a physiotherapist. The problem soon sorted it's self out once we were seeing the right people.

Mine had a tongue tie that grew back, and he fed much worse on one side than the other. Re-snipping it fixed it.

The milk dribbling out settled as he got bigger and more able to cope. He is now big enough to feed lying down - his head is bigger and he can twist round to the right position.

I’d have the tongue-tie reassessed and re-done if needed, and for everything else I would just give it time. Six weeks was the nadir of breastfeeding for us, it was so much better at ten weeks and was a breeze by four months. They get bigger and are more able to sort themselves out (repositioning themselves, stronger suck, etc). The cranial osteopathy sounds like snake oil.

Hi op don't have experience with tt or neck issues so won't comment on those directly but wanted to say please don't worry if baby isn't like older sibling. My first was always feeding constantly and for long periods and for comfort. I assumed all my babies would be similar. Until ds arrived and fed for 5-10mins max. Rarely feeds 20mins or more and rarely for comfort. Just a completely different baby and not what I was expecting at all. I did worry a lot in beginning that he wasn't comfortable or bf perfectly. Now we're 11mths in still bf and he's doing great weight/size wise. I think he was just a more efficient feeder and not interested in comfort feeding (even when ill he did up bf slightly but no where approaching his older siblings levels!). Also he has just never got on with my right side form day one. Just didn't seem comfortable there. He did latch and feed okay but always felt completely akward for both of us. Somewhere along the line we just didn't bothered much with that side. Just the other day I realised I couldn't remember last time he fed from that side so tried him. He took milk but looked akward. Had good supply both sides no issues. I honestly think he just wasn't happy that side. Not in pain just not as happy. Hasn't caused me or him any problems. Please don't feel like your baby is in pain. As pp said he wouldn't latch at all of genuinely in pain.

Maybe look up your nearest la leche league group as they are great at helping you figure out a breastfeeding solution.
Your brother is an idiot and undermining you will not help. Neither will bottles be some magic fix!!
I'm wondering what kind of birth did you have? Is it possible there's a palsy of some kind if there's a definite drop and weakness to one side? Maybe see gp and ask for a referral back to the hospital you delivered at. And good luck with the cranial oestopathy, I have heard positive things about that for babies who have had difficult deliveries. X

He was an emergency section. The LC said that with vaginsl births the head and body naturally tend to be aligned correctly as they are pushed through the birth canal whereas in c-sections the surgeon may grab the head and twist it slightly in order to pull the baby out thus affecting the alignment of the head/neck. She said that sometimes in emergency sections this twisting can be done more roughly due to their haste in getting the baby out therefore the chance of alignment issues are even higher.

As I started talking to her about my one sided issues she asked me what kind of delivery he was and when I said emergency section she smiled and said, "thought so".

She then had a little look at his head flexibility and asked me if he appeared to have good head control and I said that he did and that people had commented on it, even the HV, and she said babies with this issue also tend to have tight muscles in one side of the neck which can then force the neck to hold the head in a steady "looking forward" state and this head position is usually perceived to be a sign of good head control when in fact it's got nothing to do with the baby's ability and is just a symptom of the muscular complications of misalignment of the neck.

She said his tight muscles were on the left side of his neck hence why he always had his head turned to the left, both whilst at rest and whilst feeding because he struggles to turn his head into a neutral position without probably feeling some discomfort.

He sounds very much like my C section DD. She hated feeding from one side, and developed a flat head on one side too. I saw a GP and mentioned I suspected a neck issue, and was thinking of trying osteopathy. She poo-pooed it and I unfortunately went along with her

OP if you genuinely think there might be something amiss with your baby's neck, spine or nerves, you need a consultant paediatrician. Spines and anything near them are far too delicate and fragile to start messing with pseudoscience practitioners, especially for a tiny baby. See your GP to see if she feels a referral is needed.

On the feeding itself, I never could master rugby hold but I could manage a version of it if I fed my baby on one side and then when he latched off, very carefully moved him across my body, keeping his head facing the same way.

Not sure why there are so many comments slating osteopathy as 'pseudoscience', it was recommended to me by my NHS midwife

He's got his 6 week check on Tuesday but to be fair I don't have much faith in GPs. With my current baby the GP was horrified when I said he BF 9-10 times a day and he told me that 6 feeds a day should me more than sufficient for a 4 week old baby And with my first son, they signed him off at his 6 week check as having two testicles and then it transpired at 18 months he only had one and had only ever had one

If I speak to them about neck misalignments, lactation consultants and chiropractors they will also think it's 'woo' and tell me his neck is fine.

Even if the GP says the neck appears fine and just to "monitor
it" I will still see take DS to see a cranial osteopathy person or chiropractor because I would rather hear their opinion than a GP's.'

Your HV/GP can recommend you to a hospital specialist if there's a problem, start with them.

Silky - your midwife may have recommended it but the NHS doesn't. The first link on the NICE evidence database links to a study which concludes: "Our results demonstrate, consistently with those of previous reviews, that methodologically strong evidence on the reliability of diagnostic procedures and the efficacy of techniques and therapeutic strategies in cranial osteopathy is almost non-existent."

OP - please go to your GP if you think your baby has spinal problems or is in pain. Really worth trying the rugby ball hold again with a cushion under your baby too

I definitely had faster let down and a lot more milk with DC2 than DC1 - there was a lot of choking and she wouldn't initially comfort feed either. As she got bigger, she got better at coping with it. It was a gradual transition but at 11 months she definitely comfort feeds now she's teething! Unless you want to give up for you, don't assume your DS won't ever love it just because he doesn't love it now.

The only other thing I can think of to try when you are out and cant do different positions, is a nipple shield on the bad side as a temporary solution. It can help slow down the milk flow and can help get a better latch.

I tried nipple shields and ge can't feed from them because as he twists his head to feed it means he drags the nipple shield off the nipple.

FWIW - I don't think there's anything wrong with his spine, he just always turns his head to the left

His sleep is pretty rubbish when laid on his back but when he's on his side he lies on the side his head naturally falls to and he can sleep for hours, he went 5 hours the other night compared to waking every hour of on his back which is so difficult because I know for safety we are meant to lie then on their back. I'm going to look into buying one of those safety wedges where you can lie baby on their side within it and it prevents them from either rolling forward or backwards.

I had cracked bleeding nipples on one side with DD who was CS for breech position. She was colicky and miserable for the first 4 months. I was chatting to a midwife a few weeks ago (pregnant with #2) and she asked if I'd ever taken DD to an osteopath. Looking back it seems obvious that misalignment could have caused the preference for one breast - she actually required ultrasound for some hip issues.

See the osteopath and don't give up, first thing is address your baby's neck as the weight seems very good and otherwise he's thriving. Ignore your brother.

Was it a posterior tongue tie? I had to go to a dentist who found the tongue tie (thankfully a friend) and she solved why we were struggling - I then found a consultant surgeon on the spire hospital network who snipped the tie - he said it was very thick.

Finally I was in special care for 11 days and not one person spotted the tongue tie.

I was in hospital for 5 days post c-section and feeding felt fine then but a few days after I got home things went rapidly downhill. My nipples, especially the left one was really damaged and bleeding all the time. Feeding was agonising, I was in tears at every feed, I can't even describe how bad the pain was. I had a peer supporter come round and after observing a feed she suggested I get him assessed for a TT. I paid to have a LC come to the house the next day and she found quite a severe posterior tongue tie and said he had very, very limited tongue function. She performed the division and feeding was pain free immediately. She told me it would take a few weeks for feeding to be correct but as things still weren't right at 6 weeks is why I had him reassessed. I basically assumed his TT had grown back but the LC I saw said this wasn't the case. She said my problems were TT related then he wouldn't be able to feed correctly on both sides but this wasn't the case.

Since I saw her and she pointed out his preference to turn his neck to the left I've really noticed how much he does it and how he tenses up when I try to straighten his position for feeding.

I do think you should go to your doctor / health visitor. They will take you seriously.