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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Is euthanasia a crime or panacea?

39 replies

beats95 · 01/10/2017 10:34

Yesterday I have watched the movie "Solace" with Anthony Hopkins and Colin Farrell. On the screens since 2015. I have missed it at that time. Euthanasia-this is the idea of that movie. It has really shocked me. Just the approach. Is it an act of grace or a crime? It does not touch me or any of my closest people yet. But who knows? I want to hear the opinions. My own is that it is an act of grace. I am not sure. Need some more comments. My grandparents have passed away at near 87. They have been wishing to die during last year. I remember that very distinctly. Their lives were a bunch of problems for everybody. So?

OP posts:

Sirzy · 01/10/2017 10:37

Personally if I was in a situation where I was left with what I deemed as no quality of life and “trapped” in a body I would rather my family be able to make the decision to end my life.

I think though it’s a personal thing, and why such conversations are important when you are fit and well.

araiwa · 01/10/2017 10:45

Up to the individual

But if anyone has not made their view known before the situation arises, noone else should make that decision for them

Beerwench · 01/10/2017 10:49

I think it depends entirely on the wishes of the person whose life it is, and the medical facts. I do believe that if someone has a degenerative illness, that is only going to worsen and lead to death, they have the right to make that decision and someone should be allowed to assist (Dr nurse family) when that time comes, without fear of being a criminal, or having to travel to a different country to achieve it. My GD begged to die in the last 2 days, I still have nightmares about it, he was a strong and happy man but his illness took its toll and he could not fight any more and couldn't take any more, but was forced to because no one could help him and he couldn't do it himself. He said he wishes he'd had done it while he was still physically able. To watch your grandfather beg your mother to end it all because of the pain is heartbreaking. Effectively it's what happened though because his body couldn't cope with the level the pain relief needed to ease the pain he was suffering and so he slipped into a coma and died. But it would have been a much more dignified and pain free death if legally that could have happened a few days before. The outcome was exactly the same, sometimes I feel he was made to suffer just because, and that's not right.

Gileswithachainsaw · 01/10/2017 10:55

I think it should be allowed. The way people are left ( pain killers etc are controlled ) is horrific and inhumane. I know staff do their best and doses are given when possible but it's often not enough but no more can be given or it's harmful etc

Shit all round. Let people choose and let people say good bye.

I certainly wouldn't want to be left like that and I also wouldn't want to be taking up a bed and thousands of pounds a day that could be used on someone else where there's nothing that can he done for me

Chasingsquirrels · 01/10/2017 10:59

Towards the last few weeks of his life DH wanted to die, he was dying - it was just a matter of when and his quality of life was decreasing rapidly, the last few days he had none.
We wouldn't keep animals like DH was for the last few days of his life.
In such circumstances, it would be a mercy to all concerned.
I remember my grandma being similar as she died.

Longer term circumstances, where someone isn't close to death but doesn't want to live, are much trickier.

MatildaTheCat · 01/10/2017 11:02

I strongly believe that well legislated euthanasia should be introduced. But I'm very wary of the idea of advance directives because the bottom line is that people do change their minds.

Fine if someone is of sound mind and able to clearly communicate their wishes. Less fine if they said they would want to die if x, y or z happened but cannot actually give the final ok.

MIL has a very horrid condition leaving her almost physically incapable. She can no longer feed herself even. She's 88. I recently had a difficult conversation about the eventual possibility of needing a feeding tube if she cannot swallow. I genuinely thought she would say, no, never. But she didn't, she said of course, she'd have no choice. So there you are, even in the direst circumstances the human will to live is very strong.

GinIsIn · 01/10/2017 11:04

We don't let our pets suffer so I don't understand why we are forced to let our loved ones. I grew up in one of the countries where it is legal and it's so much more humane to allow people who are dying to choose their own passing and to cling to a tiny shred of dignity.

HostaFireAndIce · 01/10/2017 11:22

I think the biggest issue with legalising euthanasia is one of consent. There have been several big cases where it's very obvious that it is what the individual wants, but there are many cases where it could potentially be a bit hazy and people could be open to manipulation by relatives to say that is what they want when really it might not be.

Lockheart · 01/10/2017 11:28

It's a huge ethical mine field of consent and being able to give said consent.

It would be difficult but I think it should be made legal - how long that would take to put all the right safeguards in place, I don't know. But I'm of the opinion that if we wouldn't allow an animal to suffer then we certainly shouldn't force a human to.

averylongtimeago · 01/10/2017 11:33

Some cases it seems so straight forward, no of course someone should not be suffering in dreadful pain.
But is this an argument for ending their life or for better pain relief or care?
If euthanasia is legalised, how long before the old sick and inconvenient are pressured into "choosing" to die?
Would you trust a cash strapped politician to make that choice for you? Or an estranged relative who didn't like you but liked the look of your money?

The answer is, I don't know.

BarbarianMum · 01/10/2017 11:39

I think the need for it is the unintended consequence of using medical advances to prolong the length of life without maintaining quality of life.

TinklyLittleLaugh · 01/10/2017 11:42

Euthanasia will eventually be legalised though. We have an expensive aging population. Sooner or large a government is going to do the sums and decide to go for it.

Elendon · 01/10/2017 11:51

Chasingsquirrels

I understand. I've had a similar experience with my father, who would have liked his life ended if he was so incapacitated - he once asked me to please ensure it happened. I told him I would do all I could within legal boundaries. In the end his death took about two weeks. Similar with a good friend whose death was described to me that you wouldn't have put your beloved pet through it. He was the same age as my dad, about 70.

specialsubject · 01/10/2017 11:53

Neither. A common sense approach is stopped purely by religion.

Show me an anti choice campaigner regarding abortion or euthanasia who isn't a religious believer.

FindoGask · 01/10/2017 11:55

I think 'panacea' is a bit strong, unless you meant the word differently to my understanding of it. But I do think it could have a place in medical care, as long as there were proper protections.

Gileswithachainsaw · 01/10/2017 11:55

I think the need for it is the unintended consequence of using medical advances to prolong the length of life without maintaining quality of life

Yy agree

Just because we can.doesnt mean we should.

And relying on grieving/exhausted/confused relatives to make the decisions means that often treatments are taken up.as they just need time to come to catch themselves up a bit...

Not helped by the fact the supoort afterwards is not always available

60percentbanana · 01/10/2017 11:59

I would want the option for myself if I were diagnosed with a condition which was potentially degenerative or unrelenting. There are many things that are worse than death, and I don’t believe that we should sanctify life above all else - above autonomy, above dignity and above the alleviation of suffering.

Clearly though there are some very difficult issues surrounding ensuring that an individual is making a free, unpressured and informed choice. However I don’t think the difficulty in working out those issues warrants maintaining the status quo.

SilverySurfer · 01/10/2017 12:00

I am terrified at the thought of getting dementia. At the first sign I will be taking myself to Dignitas in Switzerland where euthanasia is legal.

It is entirely the choice of an individual and should be made legal here in the UK, with the appropriate safeguards, of course, to ensure that unscrupulous relatives cannot bump off a relative who has become a burden.

PlayOnWurtz · 01/10/2017 12:01

I think it's a simple human kindness to afford people the right to die how they choose

Elendon · 01/10/2017 12:04

You can make wills that say DNR. But what use are they within an emergency situation or long term care situation?

KurriKurri · 01/10/2017 12:05

Well both those words are extremes - it's obviously not a panacea - because it isn't a solution or even desirable in all cases. But assuming carefull legislation surrounding consent and all the necessary protection against abuse in place, I am very much in favour of it being an option available to people.
What is hard is when circumstances are such that people are no longer capable of making an informed consent decision (such as in cases of dementia) but as a close family member you know they would not have chosen to live with such a horrible disease, Instead you have to watch them suffer.

I feel if I am ever diagnosed with alzheimer's I will have to take the decision to end my own life before my quality of life actually becomes unliveable with, because by the time it does I won't be capable of making that choice. The best that my family would be able to do for me is do not resuscitate/ no treatment.

But ultimately I think it has to be a choice in the hands of the sick person, not their family or there is a risk of abuse.

KurriKurri · 01/10/2017 12:07

I have sadly been in the position of having a close relative begging me to help them leave their life, and it is utterly heartbreaking and I feel a huge sense of guilt that I wasn't able to do the ultimate loving thing for them.

Elendon · 01/10/2017 12:07

I think that when it is quite obvious that someone is going to die, then it should be done sooner rather than later. It seems to me to be the humane way of treating dignity in death.

LittleCandle · 01/10/2017 12:13

SilverSurfer I am entirely with you. Dignitas all the way for me. I have seen my MIL, FIL, DF and a friend's DM linger with dementia and other horrible things and I do not want my DDs to be faced with dealing with that. I lost my DM in a car accident, which was horrible, but I at least remember her as she was, not as a poor thing who had no quality of life. I would rather go before I become incapable and before my DC have to endure the horrors of someone who no longer knows who they are.

marcopront · 01/10/2017 12:22

My Mum was in a coma for three years following a car accident. I felt she had negative quality of life. Her chances of a normal life if she came out of the coma, which in itself was unlikely, were small. It was a horrible time.
If euthanasia was legal, yes I think I would have wanted it to happen. Having said that I think she choose when to die, my Dad was in the right place for it to happen and various other things would be too much of a coincidence for her not to have planned it.

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