To think that saying Idris Elba isn't suitable to play Bond because he's 'too street'...

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... is actually a racist comment, which - however 'jokingly' said - is absolutely not an appropriate thing to say in an office environment?

I'm on week two of a new position and between this kind of thing and other dodgy goings-on am debating whether to hand my notice in.

WIBU to mention my discomfort to line manager (who heard whole thing, laughed along etc.) or alternatively to just cut and run? Am I being a bit sensitive?

have you considered that his choice to do so was influenced by the racism in this country?

No. Because otherwise every BAME person would be a drug dealer, and no white people would, by that logic.

Also, everyone that had had hate crime committed against them would turn to crime, would they?

Returning to the posh factor, it isn't enough for any actor to simply "put on" a posh accent. Just as the reverse is true. John Thaw was - for me - far better cast as Morse than he ever was as Jack Regan. Just my opinion though and absolutely bugger all to do with skin colour.

Idris Elba is outstanding in Luther, but I don't rate him in the Marvel films. DH wasn't fussed about him in the Jungle Book but we all really liked him in Star Trek beyond. He's far better in some roles than in others, as are most actors. Horses for courses and all that, but trying to pin racist motives and white privilege where it is not actually there, onto the opinions of people you don't know is not reasonable.

The late great John thaw grew up in Manchester (burnage I think) and was from a solidly working class background. His dad was a lorry driver.

The late great John thaw grew up in Manchester (burnage I think) and was from a solidly working class background. His dad was a lorry driver.

I wouldn’t think it was racist. Sean Bean was turned down for the role years ago for the same reason he was too ‘rough’ for the role. Pierce Brosnan got it instead and Sean was given a ‘bad guy’ role. I think it’s the same thing with Idris Elba - his roles are usually tougher and more gritty.

Bond is meant to be lean and graceful. He's elegant and has an effortless glamour, naturally posh. This is why dc is not (for me) a good bond. SC had 'it', Scottish accent, yes, but he had the physicality. idris just doesn't, he's too big! Adrian lester could do it. LOL at 'He's an actor so he could do any part': idris as Eliazabeth 1, Glenda Jackson as Neil kinnock, Sean bean replaces Joey in friends?

Oh a Sean bean and idris Elba sandwich mmmmm

Right, I've been googling pics of actors, come to the conclusion that neck width is key here. If the neck is as big or bigger than the head it looks a bit too thuggish for bond (cf DC).

I love Idris Elba in Luther and thought he was excellent in Beasts of No Nation. Isn't the James Bond character written as white though? I can't see how it's racist to follow the description of the character by the original author. Could Adrian Lester play Sherlock Holmes?
I see a previous poster said Sean Connery was allowed to play him because he could do posh, and is white...but James Bond is written as white? I don't get it...

Maybe they meant his accent, though I saw him in The Wire first and thought he was American until I saw Luther.

I think he would make a bloody brilliant Bond, though possibly cos he's soooooooo gorgeous 😍 technically he isn't how the character was written (i.e. He's smouldering sexy rather than I think slightly cheesy in the books and older films) but I felt the same about Daniel Craig.

Don't quit. Not unless there's something else?

The late great John thaw grew up in Manchester (burnage I think) and was from a solidly working class background. His dad was a lorry driver.

Yes, I know. Either you and LazyDailyMailjournos missed my point, or I didn't explain myself well enough.

Background has nothing to do with it, as Connery proved. Casting Thaw as Morse, especially after The Sweeney, was a stroke of genius. He inhabited that role completely for me. It isn't just about "putting on a posh accent"; it's almost wearing the character as a second skin. I don't think Elba could do that. John Thaw could.

I don't think Elba could do that.

But you don't know though, do you? Plenty of people were outraged by Daniel Craig being cast as Bond and said he'd be rubbish.

Isn't the James Bond character written as white though?

He was, originally. But the whole point of continuing the franchise is that things change over time - so why should the character's skin colour matter? The original Bond wasn't making use of the internet, GPS locator chips and so on. The movies are not set back in the years that the novels were written - they move with the times, and so casting should as well.

*But you don't know though, do you?"

But you don't know he could, do you? Why do you want a black man to play a white character anyway?

"Too street" ...gawd I've heard it all now.

He's ideal for Bond, suave and debonair plus being an actor means he can adopt any character they ask him to.

plus being an actor means he can adopt any character they ask him to.

Sigh. So like somebody else said before, Elizabeth I? Sherlock Holmes? Harry Potter?

But you don't know he could, do you?

Nobody knows if an actor is going to be any good until they play the part.

Why do you want a black man to play a white character anyway?

It's already been raised that the Bond franchise has evolved from casting Bond as written by Fleming. The original Bond was of Scottish-Swiss ancestry. Bond wasn't Australian (Lazenby), he wasn't Irish (Brosnan), he wasn't blonde (Craig), so can you explain why there is any reason why he couldn't be played by a black actor?

Sigh. So like somebody else said before, Elizabeth I? Sherlock Holmes? Harry Potter?

How ridiculously facile. James Bond is - currently - a part for an adult male, so I am not sure why you are using female and children's actor parts to illustrate your point.

It's rather over-simplifying to suggest that an actor can play literally any part unless the characterisation of that part is sufficiently wide that it doesn't matter who plays it. I suspect the intention is to suggest that as an actor why shouldn't he be considered for a part suitable for an adult male actor. There may be characterisation reasons why someone is not suitable - it's already been said, including by me - that Idris is unlikely to be cast as he is too old.

Nobody knows if an actor is going to be any good until they play the part. So why did you object to IHateUncleJamie's statement that he didn't think he could do it, when you admit you don't know he could? This is what a casting director's expertise is all about.

It's already been raised that the Bond franchise has evolved from casting Bond as written by Fleming. You still haven't answered, why you want a white character, which as you admit is of Scottish-Swiss and white ancestry, to be played by a black actor?

BTW is there any reason why Idris Elba - or Adrian Lester or any other BAME actor couldn't play Sherlock Holmes? It's another story which has been adapted for the modern age (last time I checked, Conan Doyle wasn't writing in text message exchanges between Holmes et al.).

So why did you object to IHateUncleJamie's statement that he didn't think he could do it, when you admit you don't know he could? This is what a casting director's expertise is all about.

I agree it's what a casting director's experience is all about. My point was that Jamie's comment was to say they didn't think he could do it. Mine was "why not"? Elba's a talented actor with experience playing a variety of different characters and parts, so I see no reason why he wouldn't do justice to the part. Why isn't that a valid challenge?

You still haven't answered, why you want a white character, which as you admit is of Scottish-Swiss and white ancestry, to be played by a black actor?

I haven't "admitted" anything The point about Bond's ancestry (as written by Fleming in the original novels) was simply to illustrate that Eon's casting over the years has not stayed faithful to the original - so to suggest that casting a BAME actor as Bond would be departing from the original characterisation is a non-argument, as the departure happened decades ago. As for your final point, I'd like to see Elba play him because he's a bloody good actor and I think he'd do a good job. The colour of his skin is irrelevant - as covered off in the characterisation points above.

How ridiculously facile. James Bond is - currently - a part for an adult male so I am not sure why you are using female and children's actor parts to illustrate your point.

Why do you now maintain is it a part for an adult male only? I thought you said the franchise has evolved from casting Bond as Fleming originally created him. Which, following what you have said yourself, means he could be a woman or a child.

His suitability has been considered for Bond. After consideration he was deemed unsuitable. Do you mean you want his suitability considered by expert casting directors, or you demand he plays Bond? Or you demand a black actor plays a white character?

But you don't know though, do you? Plenty of people were outraged by Daniel Craig being cast as Bond and said he'd be rubbish.

For sure; I remember. And IMHO he proved them wrong. No, I don't know, just as you don't know that he could inhabit the role of an old money, public school naval commander who is completely at home in Jermyn Street tailoring and drives a supercharged Bentley. I just do not see Elba being able to do that. And that opinion is absolutely nothing to do with his skin colour.

Franklin You were the one who raised the examples of Elizabeth I and Harry Potter - but you're now talking about the evolution of Bond into a female - or a child - character?! Your original point had nothing to do with Elizabeth I's - or Harry Potter's relevance to Bond, which was the basis upon which I responded.

You then challenged me about why I wanted to see a black actor playing a white character. I responded on the basis of the characterisation evolving so that skin colour was no longer a relevant issue. Your latest point about me "demanding" that Elba plays Bond is just ridiculous. I know that Elba is not going to be playing Bond. I am not "demanding" that anyone reconsiders. I am simply pointing out that there is no reason why a BAME actor couldn't play Bond.

I am trying to engage in a reasoned debate but every time I answer your question or respond to a point, you post something which appears to be designed to bait or provoke. I'm not sure what your intention is really.

Ahhh John thaw... can I admit to a tiny tiny morse crush? He was fabulous .

I probably didn't get your point uncle jamie - apologies if I misunderstood- I assumed you'd meant he was posh to begin with rather than how well he inhabited the part.

I will be very interested to see who they cast. My money is on tom hiddleston, although I wouldn't cast him per se. I know fassbender is in the running too and I think he's got that icy posh thing going on but he's still not quite bond for me. Both have the feline grace, not sure either has the slightly unique edge that's needed.

Inpersonally think it'd be good to see someone completely new make the part his own. I wasn't sure about Daniel Craig either - not my type, but I think overall he was an ok bond, perhaps because of the tone change in the films.

He always comes across as a bit of an arrogant knob to me. Don't like him.