to still be angry with MIL?

[newmomma9]

Sorry for the upcoming rant.

OH is an only child and has always been close to his parents, despite living an hour's flight from them. They're really good to us, helping us move, giving us loads of nearly new furniture from their house sale, having my family to stay with them, etc. She is a financial adviser so also does our tax returns, while he came up to paint our flat before DS was born. When DS was a month old, OH had to go away for a fortnight with work, and since my own DM refused to come and help me, I took baby and went to stay with them for 2 weeks, for which I will be forever grateful.

However. She's really tough going. Over the years I've been constantly insulted, belittled, blamed for OH's fertility problems, and criticised for EVERYTHING you can imagine, while at the same time as being told she loves me and I'm a good mum to DS. She says I'm lazy because I don't clean her house, cook or do her ironing when we stay with them (she constantly refuses my help when I offer, and says she will never ask or tell me what needs to be done - I'm supposed to know instinctively) but she goes nuts if OH or FIL lift a finger, because it's WOMENS' WORK! She can't understand why I find it tiring being a sahm (he's brilliant but I have no help except for OH, so it's very full on) as she did it 36 years ago and SHE managed.

OH's friends and family have said to me in the past that I take a lot of cr@p from her, and she has a track record of losing friends for FIL and alienating her own family with her domineering ways and uncontrolled mouth. She's shouted at me in front of my baby, smoked in front of me while pregnant and driven me to a point where I dread being in the same room as her. She decided when baby would stop taking his bottle at night, not me, and actually cornered me away from the boys to insist we do it her way.

Sometimes I feel afraid to open my mouth for fear of being put down, told I'm wrong, and just made to feel inferior. She can be very clever and the insults go straight over OD and FIL's heads.

I've spent FIVE WEEKS out of the last 8 in their company - OH wanted six but I said no way. Last year I did nearly 3 weeks with them while pregnant and at one point actually looked up the cost of flights to go home early.

When we arrived here 12 days ago, I told her I had a bit of work to do while here and would it be ok to have some help with the baby as it's impossible to do anything at home. She said fine. So on the Monday, I gave the baby to OH while I fill in applications for part time creche places and swimming lessons. Tuesday I dared to go and see a friend for an hour and a half. On Wednesday afternoon, I did a couple of hours' work to pay for the swimming lessons. But she'd invited OH's friends over for dinner and I was supposed to help prepare it, without being informed what was on the menu, and I once again got called lazy.

This time, I snapped and told her I've had enough of being spoken to like that. Then over the next half hour, I got accused of dumping my little boy on other people all week while I went off "working and enjoying myself", even though I'd only given him to OH (who spent the whole time with her and so she probably ended up holding DS). She said I'd abandoned him all week. I hit the roof and said the work I'd been doing had been to organise and pay for the creche/swimming lessons. She hit back with 'I can't work AT ALL while you three are here as you're so idle, I'm too busy looking after you all'.

This came 3 weeks after I told OH to give them 500 quid in exchange for our board and as a thank you gesture for the furniture because they're having work/money troubles (although FIL intends to buy a £1450 shed next week... WTF?).

Argument went on for a good half hour (I got 'stop shouting, you're hysterical and ridiculous' and 'aren't you the martyr'), I gave back and it felt like YEARS of pent up anger on my part was finally getting some release. We tried to clear the air after dinner and things started getting heated again, so we left it at that and haven't broached it since.

I've tried to sort things before - last year I told her nicely that I find her rude, arrogant and insulting, but nothing changed. She is the way she is, and I'm not the person she wants me to be, so I don't see how we can ever get past it.

Thursday morning I told OH I wanted to check into a hotel and fly home ASAP, but he wouldn't hear of it and said we'd spend as much time out of the house as he could manage. Meaning leaving DS with them, ironically! But felt I had no choice. She has been fawning over me since Thursday, telling me I'm pretty and basically being the kind of MIL we all hope for. But I'm still furious and have told OH that I'm not putting up with her attitude any more and that I don't want to see her. I'm being civil because we're here for another couple of days but that's all I'm prepared to do.

They were supposed to come to us next week while I took a 4 day job in another city but I've cancelled, because I won't leave DS with someone who accused me of dumping him on them while I go off to work. OH told them the job fell through, rather than the truth, because he wants to "protect" them.

Last night, as we were heading out, OH said he wants me to be "nicer" to MIL. Told him to stop sticking his head in the sand and to support me more, especially as none of this is happening in English and I'm on the backfoot. Fat chance.

Today FIL asks quite sternly if I'm still giving MIL the cold shoulder.
She was due back any second and having had gastroenteritis all weekend, I'm not in the mood for another argument, so I just said that I'm very angry about the unforgivable things that were said to me on Wednesday. At that point DS started crying so I escaped.

Since I've had DS I've stopped putting up with toxic relationships in my life but I'm going to have to put up with this one for OH's sake.

AIBU to still be angry and to not want to have anything more to do with her? Knowing that this woman is going to be in my life for as long as OH is, and I'm going to have to see her whether I like it or not?

Okay firstly you don't HAVE to see anyone. It's your life and your choice, if you don't want to spend time with someone who bullies you then you do not have too, regardless of what anyone else says.

Secondly you don't have a mil problem, you have a dh problem. Why is your husband forcing you to spend time with someone who is unkind to you? Why is he not protecting you from it?

^what Smithison said
You have my sympathies OP - very best of luck!!

So I used to have a similar problem with my MIL. I was terrified of being on the same room as her because the effort it took to keep my mouth shut when she went off at me was overwhelming. But then about two months ago I called her out on the verbal abuse after finally snapping. She didn't talk to me for a month or two but since coming back a month ago she has been good as gold. I'm hoping that it will last, I am having visions of her moving in with us when she gets older and coming on holidays with us.

You don't have to see her. Tell DH it's not going to work, neither of you are going to change, so if he wants to stay married and keep his relationship with his mum, he needs to come up with ways to make it happen. Other than you doing what you are told and taking all her shit! Make it clear that it is not up to you to make it work as you really don't care if you never see her again. Put the onus on him.

Over the years I've been constantly insulted, belittled, blamed ... and criticised
I got 'stop shouting, you're hysterical and ridiculous' and 'aren't you the martyr'

Tell DH that your MIL has become your abuser - and that if he does not support you, then he is just as guilty.

Do whatever you need to, to protect yourself & your child.
A show of unapologetic strength might just make her back down.
Do it now - before this behaviour becomes the norm.

This sounds like my best friend's family. They're very traditional Indian Sikhs and believe the men shouldn't do any housework and that there's something wrong with her for wanting to work and not just be a SAHM

She sounds awful but I don't really get you living an hr flight from her but having to do creche and swimming lesson forms in her house, and also don't see why you need to use her for babysitting a lot when you and your dh are both visiting?

Also I don't get a) why you need someone to help when your dh went away for a week, and especially b) why you'd ask her to help when you clearly don't like her and she's rude?

And then finally, you and dh agree to keep away from them , out of house, post argument, but you have to leave her babysitting your ds? Mixed messages tbh no matter awful she is ...

They're really good to us, helping us move, giving us loads of nearly new furniture from their house sale, having my family to stay with them, etc. She is a financial adviser so also does our tax returns, while he came up to paint our flat before DS was born. When DS was a month old, OH had to go away for a fortnight with work, and since my own DM refused to come and help me, I took baby and went to stay with them for 2 weeks, for which I will be forever grateful.

They are NOT really good to you though, are they? Because you went on to do describe all the horrible things they have done to you and vile things said to you. YANBU at all it sounds like a nightmare. And I would also stop her doing any tax returns or any favours from them in general actually. Distance yourself from them. You are "not going have to see them whether you like it or not" everyone has the right not to see someone if they don't want to.

Next time don't go, let your husband take your son for a few days and then go and collect him.

You're an adult, you decide who's in your life, no one else.

Book the hotel, and go.

Yes you need to start putting more distance between you. She sounds hard work but at the same time, seems to want a good relationship. It means that maybe (and I mean maybe) if you can be very forceful about your boundaries, your relationship could improve. You will need to stop receiving favours though and pull her up or leave every time there is unacceptable behaviour.

That sort of attitude isn't anything to do with Sikhism winosaurus, it's a very backward village outlook that's treated with scorn by the Sikhs I know. It does happen but it's nothing to do with the religion but their lack of education.

I feel for you but stop being a doormat but do it maturely and calmly next time. How could you let anyone dictate when you stop night feeding your own child?
agree you need to tackle OH or you will resent him and it becomes a serious relationship threat. And he needs to support you and stand up for you in front of them when she criticises. Maybe don't go with him when he visits them and ensure they know why.

She sounds awful but why do you spend son much time with her? Why do you need her to look after your baby so much?

You spend far too much time with them, and accept far too much help from them, this us why she feels she has s right to judge you and speak to you like crap.

Stop staying with them so often and for so long, stop letting her do you favours. Create better boundaries.

She sounds like an utter nightmare from hell.

hi all,

Thank you SO much for the replies, I really appreciate you all taking the time. I've always thought I was a relatively strong person, but reading my post back I sound like a total doormat who's too afraid to stand up for herself. I'm determined that DS shouldn't see me that way.

There are a couple of points I want to reply to - which I would have mentioned earlier but my post was already ridiculously long. I hate the idea that I've annoyed or upset people, and obviously that has contributed to getting me into the situation I'm in now.

Saoirse - I've only done the forms here because of timing. We've just moved house and I'm finding my feet in a new town where I don't know a soul and all the creches/pools are already fully booked. I needed time to ring round and email different places that might accept DS. I didn't actually ask her to babysit, as it were - I was upstairs on the computer and DS was in the garden with OH and herself. But in her eyes, that's "babysitting". Same thing happened on the other days.

I stayed with them when OH was away the first time because I didn't feel ready to be home alone with a 4 week old. It's my first child and my parents didn't even come for the birth or when I had complications at 37 weeks (we live abroad and they've never been). As mentioned, I don't have any help or other family nearby and I am finding it difficult being a sahm with no support.

The second time OH was away, I thought it would be mutually beneficial - the grandparents get to spend time with DS and I'm not completely on my own with him for a week. It was actually mostly ok, but I hadn't seen them for 3 months.

Totally agree with you about the mixed messages, and I'm very annoyed with myself about it. The main reason I didn't fly home on Thursday was because a very close friend was getting married down here on Saturday and I didn't feel I could miss it. DS came too, and it had already been arranged that the PIL would babysit in the evening while we stayed in a hotel because the wedding was 45 mins away. As it turned out, I started vomiting with gastroenteritis right after the ceremony, so it was just as well that he was with them.

Last night we went to eat with another couple of close friends and normally I would absolutely have cancelled rather than leave DS, but these two have long known how I feel about MIL (they were ones invited on Wednesday and knew something big had just happened) and I really needed to talk to somebody supportive, rather than just OH. Also, I have no idea if or when I will ever come back here, so it was a chance to say goodbye. They haven't visited us before but might start now.

Mumsgonetoyonderland: I know. She'd offered to do the night feeds that weekend to give us a rest, OH agreed and by the point I was too exhausted to argue (11 weeks postpartum). About an hour later, I'd found some energy and got so angry I told her he WAS having a bottle that night. In retrospect, I should have said 'F You, I'll feed him tonight then', but I was beyond tired. She grudgingly said fine, but in the end decided to do it her way anyway and dress it up as doing what I'd asked ("I offered but he didn't want it"). The only good thing was that we then discovered he was indeed capable of sleeping through the night.

Chasedbybees: you're absolutely right. She DOES want a good relationship, but one where she is in control. She says I'm idle because it's an easy form of attack - I'm not in the habit of going to stay with people and insulting them by pulling out the hoover. Plus her house is always spotless, so there's nothing to do anyway! It is all about control and always has been.

FIL also said to me this lunchtime that I mustn't hold a grudge against her (it was an instruction rather than advice) and I feel like I could talk to him more openly if given the chance, though I don't expect he'll side with me. They know I'm still angry, because I'm being civil and nothing more. But they've just been asking what our plans are for Christmas, because obviously we're going to have see each other. I'm not the type to deny them access to DS, but I don't have to see her myself.

If anything, my relationship with FIL has improved a lot in the last year or two and I do feel that he will listen, but I'm not sure he'll rein her in. He'll also tell me to talk to her myself, but I've tried that. Last year, I laid down the law about their visiting the maternity ward (they didn't listen incidentally) and she was so annoyed about my dictating to them that she came back with 'yes, but you agree that you're idle', which I'd never heard much about before, but is now a recurrent theme.

We fly home the day after tomorrow and I'm tempted to tell them exactly how I feel before we leave so that things are clear. I've already started working on the boundaries but OH is resisting, especially about the tax return as it means him having to put his own arse in gear. I told him on Friday that I'm sorely tempted to move back to the UK, where at least I understand the way things work and I'm not beholden to ANYONE. We've just had dinner altogether and just because I bothered to participate a little in the conversation (i.e. what do I want for lunch tomorrow with my dodgy tummy), they're imagining that it's all blown over, but it hasn't. I'm just doing what I have to do to get through the next 36 hours without another scene.

Told OH quietly on my way to bed not to imagine that things are sorted because they are far from.

Thanks again for letting me rant!

It does sound like she looks after your DS an awful lot, this is why she judges you.

Hi rebel,

It may sound more than it actually is... As mentioned, she lives an hour's flight away, so it's not like I'm asking every week. When she has DS, I'm usually there too with OH and she'll just take him for a walk while I have a nap or something.

While OH is a very caring dad, he himself says he has no patience and when I ask him to hold DS at home while I go for a shower or whatever, I'll often come back to find DS plonked in his swing or playpen. So I suspect that those times I was doing other stuff last week, OH has gone and outsourced holding the baby to MIL, who blames me for dumping DS on her.

Sometimes though, it's her wanting the baby rather than us asking. When they had us plus my DB, SIL + 2 DC to visit, she insisted that the people carrier we hired wasn't big enough, and lied about our destinations not being child-friendly, in order to have my DS to herself for the day. She won and I cried at having to leave him for 8 hours and missing our lovely family outing.

We went to another wedding in the U.K. last month last month and she was insistent that we should leave DS with her for the whole weekend, but I refused to leave him, even though it meant a lot of travelling for him.

Just before the argument, I told DH I was starting to regret our asking them to help for my 4 day job next week, because she takes over everything. The first time we took DS to swim in the sea last week, I barely got a look in.

I know what you guys are going to say, but having put this all in writing tonight, I can see it has to stop NOW. She cooks DS's lunch and snack every day that we're here because a) she enjoys making food for everyone and won't let anyone else do it and b) because I'm British and so obviously I don't know how to cook properly.

Same with his bath - I let her do it the very first time that we stayed and she was so thrilled that she's always taken it upon herself to do it since. I let her because it gave her 'special time' with DS. However, I know one day she'll use it against me as soon as it suits her.

So yes, when we're with the PIL she does do an awful lot for DS, but I'm also very aware that she doesn't see him week in week out. Where I thought I was letting her stock up on as much granny time as possible, I've just let her take over, and she'll never stop taking more and more control unless I take it back..

What's really worrying me now at this ungodly hour is OH. He's being extra sweet to me atm because he can see I'm not going to let this go, and I'm afraid of how badly this could end up between us if he doesn't strap on a pair and cut the apron strings as well. I don't want to make him choose between me and his mother but there will come a time when they will want to visit DS (Christmas if not before), or he wants to stay with them for 2 or 3 weeks, and I'll be a bitch for saying no.

I get what you mean OP. Just seeing it from her perspective it sounds like you both "depend" on her a lot, so she interprets that as you being useless parents. Perhaps your Oh likes making her feel valued by asking for her help even when he is meant to be looking after DS etc?

There appears to be a weird dynamic where on the face of it you get a lot of help but aren't very grateful for it. I get that that probably isn't the case and much of this "help" may be unsolicited but you need to basically politely draw boundaries and stop accepting all this help. Then you'll be in a much better position to not have to put up with the BS either.

I agree with pretty much everything suggested by pp, however I would add one thing - the length of time you spend with them. You say its an hour's flight time from your home to PIL's so why staying soooo long. Could understand the length of it was long haul, but it takes me about 2 hours to get to my parents' house and a weekend can be long enough.

One element of getting your boundaries in place could be to reduce the length of visits - remember visitors are like fish , they go off after 3 days...........

Your dh has been well trained to toe the line. It's training he received since birth. It's interesting that they're both being ultra nice. He's learnt this techniques from his mother so do be careful as it's just an offensive to reign you back in. Once you're back right where she wants you, she'll most certainly turn off her charm offensive. Don't ever expect fil to 'side' with you against her. Your dh is also included in this, I think. As already pointed out, you have a dh problem. Your husband would rather see his mother happy than his wife. In addition to this, he's a lazy arse, who will get away with as little as possible and you seem to as yet be willing to truly rely on yourself or him where your child is concerned.

You forget OP that some Mumsnetters believe that when you have a baby, you are not allowed to have any help at all

The three of them sound like bullies!

She decided when baby would stop taking his bottle at night, not me, and actually cornered me away from the boys to insist we do it her way
You mean you let her.
Unless they had you locked up away from your child you always had the power to simply carry on as you preferred.

Meaning leaving DS with them, ironically! But felt I had no choice
You ALWAYS have a choice - not necessarily the one you like or want, but you ALWAYS have that power to make a choice.
You could have refused to go, refused to leave your son, refused to let others overcrowd your people carrier and take your son's seat, or even booked another vehicle if that was really an issue.

I think you've allowed yourself to be manipulated by their wealth and the favours you get from them....you've also enabled your husband to be a shit partner and parent.

You're people pleasing and avoiding confrontation/upset is making a doormat of you.
Now that you've started to stand up for yourself - DON'T back down.
No apologies for the sake of an easy life.
No allowing mil to call the shots - no matter what the situation.
No allowing your husband to shirk his parental duties - go out for a few hours and leave him at home ALONE to look after his own child.
You missed the perfect opportunity to tell mil that you left your dc with his father, not her - and then pulled your husband up for being a lazy, idle twat when it comes to looking after his own child.
I'd have told mil to stop projecting her son's failings and faults onto you.

Start deciding how you're going to manage future communication with in-laws.
If they come to stay at your house - it's on the basis that your husband does all the hosting, cooking, cleaning, ferrying them about.
You don't need to be involved in it.
Your husband is allowed to take his dc to see his parents - you just need to decide when/how long....

I told him on Friday that I'm sorely tempted to move back to the UK, where at least I understand the way things work and I'm not beholden to ANYONE
Don't make threats or ultimatums that you can't follow through on.
You will need the fathers permission to take/move your child's residence to another country and i highly doubt he will give you that.

You also need to get your financial independence and security sorted.
Do you have savings/money in your own sole account?
Do you have easy access to joint monies/accounts?
You can't rely or trust your wet lettuce of a partner to look out for your best interests - he's a man-child who doesn't have much respect for you.