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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think it wouldn't kill Strictly make an effort to have same sex couples?

199 replies

chronicleink · 13/09/2017 12:25

I know there a big row about the comedienne who 'chose' a male partner but Strictly really could make an effort - maybe something along the lines of - " If you do have a same sex partner we'll make sure that you aren't some novelty act, we have access to some of the best choreographers & musical theatre people and creative people and it'll be awesome. Not just a version of the 'straight' routines.''
I've seen boys dance with boys and girls dance with girls and it really shouldn't be a big deal...

OP posts:
PuppyMonkey · 13/09/2017 13:17

But Chronicle, I think no matter they put in place to ensure the same sex couple didn't end up a novelty act, it would inevitably cause controversy on this show.

Someone would say the judge was being more lenient just because there was a female doing the traditional "male steps", someone else would say the judges were unnecessarily harsh because the female celebrity couldn't lift her partner as easily as the male celebrity could lift his female partner...

And then the public would get cross that it was detracting from the enjoyment of the show and not vote for the same sex couple and boot them off.

GerdaLovesLili · 13/09/2017 13:17

Same sex couples dancing together in a social situation are obviously something to be encouraged because a couple that wants to dance together in a public space shouldn't ever be afraid to do so. But they're not in a competition which specifies a male/female combination.

I haven't seen an same sex ice dance couple, or a same sex mixed doubles in tennis (because there's already mens and womens doubles competitons) . This doesn't mean that ballroom dancing and ice dancing comps won't follow tennis in the future and have same-sex pairs (and indeed some ball-room dancing comps already allow for this, but there are issues when a male pair can be automatically marked higher for their use of the floor)

There's no real reason for tennis/ ballroom/ice dance couples to replicate sexual partnering so I'm baffled why it should be necessary for Strictly to pair gay dancers wit a same-sex partner.

This Indy peice form a few years ago considers some of the same issues www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/theatre-dance/news/potential-ban-of-same-sex-partners-in-ballroom-dancing-competitions-may-amount-to-illegal-9598661.html

And yes, Matthew Bourne's sublime Swan Lake sets out to subvert the norm and has very little to do with an argument for why Strictly should pair same-sex dance couples.

It's an interesting question; should dance competitions mirror sexual preference in partnering when the dance partners aren't also sexual partners? Why isn't this a factor in tennis mixed-doubles? Does the scoring for ball-room dancing (outside of Strictly) favour male same-sex couples? And how would the Beeb handle same-sex dance partners without tuning them into a novelty act?

Original poster
chronicleink · 13/09/2017 13:18

Lottey90 - you're starting to sound unhinged. You know this isn't about sex right? It's representation. That's all.
GherkinSnatch - it's not about SC. Altho I thing it would have been way cooler if one of the two gay dancers chose a same sex partner.
it's representation, it's acceptance.
My guess is that most of the people here have never had to be careful in public about showing affection, hold hands with their partner because of the reaction they might get.
Having a openly gay person on a show like this is a step in the right direction. The next step would be to let a woman dance with a woman and accommodate that properly.

OP posts:
GerdaLovesLili · 13/09/2017 13:18

Good grief! Apparently my fingers have lost the ability to type.

Borntoflyinfirst · 13/09/2017 13:21

Because it's a dance show, not a dating show.

Dancing has rules. Same sex couples probably couldn't perform things like lifts in the same way as mixed sex couples.

Would you expect a gay tennis player to refuse to play in mixed doubles?

^this!

Original poster
chronicleink · 13/09/2017 13:21

namechangefordummies -
'The fact that you are sexually attracted to members of one gender or sex does not mean that you may only dance with them, nor that you should want to'
AGREED - SO THE BBC HAS JUST CONSISTENTLY FOUND GAY CELEBS WHO'D PREFER TO DANCE WITH THE OPP SEX.
Wow. What a coincidence. And nothing to do with the fact they've done nothing to make them feel comfortable dancing with a same sex partner.

OP posts:
Kursk · 13/09/2017 13:21

It's a competition designed for a male/female team. People's sexual preference shouldn't come into it.

AlexanderHamilton · 13/09/2017 13:22

Annie - he (I will call him he) is not limiting himself any more than any other male actor only playing male roles unless you are talking about roles traditionally played by actors of the opposite gender.

CoolCarrie · 13/09/2017 13:23

Get over it OP. Both of the contestants this year who happen to be gay don't give a toss, and I bet most people who watch just want to see a man & a woman dancing and enjoying the show! Why does everything have to be pc ? !

PerspicaciaTick · 13/09/2017 13:23

Well, I just hope that the producers of Dancing on Ice are having a long hard think about all this before it returns next year.

Lottey90 · 13/09/2017 13:24

Last post was sarcasm op. The contestants on the show don't understand the uproar about this, so why do you? Your not on strictly come dancing.

The whole point of the show is male/female couples competing.

NO-ONE gets to choose which male partners they want. So why should one female be able to pick who they are want.

It's the rules of the show, aside from the fact that, yes as most people have pointed out, they are judged against fellow male/female partners.

Quite frankly they should be happy to dance with an orangutan.... they are getting paid enough.

MumW · 13/09/2017 13:25

Gay actors must only play gay characters and only have on screen relationships with only fellow gay actorsHmm

Precisely, Lottey90, it's ridiculous. It all strikes me as PC for the sake of it.

Glumglowworm · 13/09/2017 13:26

I think it's unreasonable that a lesbian is getting grief over choosing to dance with a man when several gay men have been on the show and danced with women (presumably they weren't forced at gunpoint to do so) and didn't get the same level of negative press

AlexanderHamilton · 13/09/2017 13:26

I don't know much about ballroom only ballet but dance is gender based. You have male & female steps & roles. The examination syllabi reflects this. A transgender dancer can (with the RAD at least) choose whether to dance as a male of female.

myfeetarealwayscold · 13/09/2017 13:26

Brilliant BuckinhamL !!!

Gemini69 · 13/09/2017 13:29

OP you sound unhinged....

Londoncheapo · 13/09/2017 13:30

I think it depends on whether you see dancing as more of a social thing that reflects the actual relationship between the two people, or as something more like a sport.

If it's more like a sport, then potentially awkward questions could be raised relating to the differences in physical strength and stamina between the sexes. A male-male pair could be capable of more dramatic acrobatics than a male-female pair, for example. Would this be fair? We do not allow two men to form a side in mixed doubles in tennis for this reason.

CaveMum · 13/09/2017 13:31

Although the professionals will know both the leader and follower steps and footwork for all the dances (in order to be able to teach) they will obviously be stronger in their own "role". You can't expect them to just "switch" roles as it will put them at a disadvantage against other male/female partnerships in the competition.

I've no problem with same sex partnerships in dance, or otherwise, but dancing partners have nothing to do with sexual preference. An awful lot of professional dancers start out dancing with their siblings for goodness sake!

rosieroses · 13/09/2017 13:32

As a pp mentioned, Camilla Dallerup was talking about this on to this week.
Same sex couples do dance competitively in the UK, but compete in a separate class to mixed sex couples because of the nature of their dancing. Mixed sex couples dance with the male partner leading and the female partner following. In same sex couples, both partners will lead and follow during a single dance, so the styles need to be judged separately.
The Strictly proffesionals have learnt to either lead or follow, because they dance as mixed sex couples. Camilla's take on it was that couples dancing as a same sex partnership would be at a competitive disadvantage, as the pro dancer would need to learn to lead/follow, rather than performing their traditional role, which obviously as pro dancers they have many years of experience in. She did say though that the group dances could be a good place to incorporate it, being inclusive without putting any couple at a disadvantage within the competition.

RestlessTraveller · 13/09/2017 13:32

I'm not saying that same-sex dance partners look ridiculous, but same-sex ballroom partners look ridiculous and technically it's quite difficult.

There are dances were the 'look' of the dance is governed by the outfits. Think feathers for quickstep, floaty for waltz or tassels for samba. Same sex partners could also mean men in dresses or women in suits which they may not want to wear.

Physicality also poses a problem, lifts for example. Plus there are dances where it's important that the woman has a smaller frame, also think of two sets of boobs which can ruin the hold (or be particularly problematic during the Charleston)

Tazerface · 13/09/2017 13:33

How many professional female dancers have trained their whole lives to lead rather than follow? How many have specifically spent time building up muscle to lift another person?

Plus - she didn't want to? How many of the gay men have been targeted like this?

myfeetarealwayscold · 13/09/2017 13:34

CaveMum - So you have a male professional - he knows the steps, correct? Then a male celeb - newbie doesn't now much. Where's the problem there? The celeb isn't switching, as he doesn't know the steps. The professional dancer would, being a professional dancer, I assume know the steps and how to learn new ones???

natwebb79 · 13/09/2017 13:35

I don't see the issue here. When I was a ballroom dancer it was pretty standard that to compete aged 16+ you needed to dance in a male/female couple. Under 16 could be same sex (well, two girls or boy/girl as there's generally thousands of girls for every one boy). Of course many professional couples consist of a gay man/straight couple or vice versa. It's an art form, not a Tinder match.

SlothMama · 13/09/2017 13:36

It's a dance show for gods sake, some people find the weirdest things to get upset about