Why can't I fix all this?

[Thepersonineedisnannymcphee]

Regular lurker/poster, NC for this.

I could not be failing more if I tried and believe me I'm trying so hard not to.

I'm starting to resent my children massively. They've had a fair bit of upheaval recently so I understand their behaviour being a bit off but this is like nothing I've ever seen before. Bedtime is the worst. They used to be asleep by 7.30, now it's always past 8 and often nearer 9. This isn't usual for them at all and it's really getting to me because it's now so stressful. My youngest Dd in particular is really struggling and she is just so horrible and often violent towards me. I'm at my wits end trying to deal with her temper tantrums and manage my other children.

Every day there's more arguments and a total disregard for anything I say or ask. It's just like walking through mud up a mountain and I find myself wanting to run away all the time. I do have support but it's not full time and my partner is their stepdad so although he does help I feel like he shouldn't have to wrangle my wayward offspring. I'm trying to remember that they're young and struggling and I need to support them but I'm losing a grip on my will to live. I find nothing about them enjoyable and I don't want to feel that way.

How old are they?

I know it will sound like a total non issue about their bedtime but we've had that routine for so long and it worked perfectly. Everyone went to bed happy. Now I just want to cry at every moment of the day because it's so hard.

9, 7 ( with SEN) and 5. I also have a 14 week old Ds with my partner.

When does school restart? Could you use that to return to the bedtime routine and new rules about behaviour? Is dp dad to all or just youngest, what does he do to support you?

That doesn't seem very late at all, especially for a 9 and 7 year old?

Just the youngest. I'm hoping school will help, but my youngest Dd has some issues surrounding school which have come to light over the holidays and I'm not sure if going back will shake her more.

My 7 year old has sleep issues so he needs to go to sleep earlier to allow him to get enough through the night. My eldest has always had that kind of bedtime, 8 at the latest and it's what works for her as she's quite active during the day.

I mean it may be that you need to adjust their routine a little and roll with it, as they get older their needs will change.

School starts Tuesday. My partner will often take over the bedtime routine to give me a break and we try to spend time with them each one to one to give them time to talk to us in private and enjoy special time with us. It's never really enjoyed or appreciated by them though so I'm losing all enthusiasm for being around them knowing they don't really care.

I would agree if this had happened naturally but it was literally overnight and only since we moved house and had the baby. It's not working for them at all as they're all not getting enough sleep in the way they're used to.

Are you trying to put them all to bed at the same time? It might help to stagger their bedtimes, especially for the 9 year old as 7.30 is probably too early. 8.30-9.00 would be better for the eldest.

Honestly, she doesn't like going to bed that late. By 8 at the latest she's tired. They're all up by 6 and have quite active lives so they're ready for bed at 7ish. In winter it's usually 6.30 for the younger two because they want to sleep then. The girls share but that's only since we moved and they're adjusting. I settle my 7 yr old in the next room as he can't settle alone yet. He often wakes in the night and roams the house (currently trying to find methods to deal with that) so if he doesn't get to sleep early he loses a lot and his school life suffers.

They sound unsettled which isn't surprising if you have recently had a baby.

My 9 year old goes to bed between 8 - 8.30, it does seem like you are trying to get them down too early.

Has your partner recently moved in? You say they have had a lot of upheaval - are they being supported through this?

Partner has lived with us for more than four years, we just moved house. Honestly my 9 year old really isn't going to bed to early for her as I've said. She and her sister wind each other up a bit but she's the only one who does actually go to bed properly atm. It's mostly my 5 year old disrupting everything.

See someone called 'Andrea Grace' - well worth the money.
She's a sleep/bedtime expert

Having a new baby may be making them feel jealous and more desperate for your attention. That's totally normal.

Maybe if the 5 yo is the worst offender, start with sorting her out, the others might settle then. Can you go back to the routine you had pre new baby?

A nine year old asleep by 7.30, however active they are, sounds wrong. Maybe you have to adjust your expectations of child free evenings.

However, all you can do I think, is persevere and or change your routine, be consistent.

I would really be letting your nine year old have a later bedtime tho.

Not fussed about child free evenings but there's no point keeping a child who's tired up for no reason if she wants to go to bed. My 9 year is happy with her bedtime. She's usually up in between 5-6. That's just how my family has always been, even on occasions when they have gone to bed later. My 5 year old is the only one who is really disruptive and winds the other two up which has knocked things out of whack. It's just that making bedtime a battle really.

My son is also an early riser and very active and I've tended to have earlier bedtimes. At 9 he had to be in bed by 8 but could have the light on and read up to 8.30. Generally that meant that at about 8.15 i'd go in and read a few pages to him and have a cuddle then turn the light out and it was sleep time at 8.30.

Could you at least try saying to the 9 year old that they go to bed at 7.30 but don't have to sleep till 8 - can read or do whatever they like quietly in their own room till 8 and it also means you can have 10mins alone time with them when the others are hopefully asleep.

That then also means the child who is most difficult to get to bed at the minute can have your fuller attention without you feeling bad about neglecting time with the 9yo. Maybe with the non settlers you take their 'go to room/no more screens etc' time back half an hour with the sleep/lights out time remaining at 7.30. They don't have the pressure of 'now you must sleep' but they do have to settle down in their rooms whether that's to read or drawer or play with pokemon cards (no idea what they're into) and get used to a bit of self settling time and no interaction with siblings to wind them up.

I think it helps to take the pressure off of being in bed - that first half an hour there's no expectation of sleep just of settling down and being in bed. Then there's the cuddles etc and lights out.

Realistically going forward you cannot have the same bedtimes for children of vastly different ages - 'it's not fair' will come up at some point plus they don't each get a separate bit of mummy time in their beds easily.

Routine at the old house was bed at 7ish, could be half hour either side for the younger two who used to share. Normally both asleep in 20 mins and I stayed in the room. Eldest was usually bed at 7.30, once the other two were asleep, and she listened to cds as she dropped off.

The girls now share and are both quite different so are bickering constantly at bedtime. My youngest has become active naughty throughout the day but often meltdowns at night and physically attacks me, kicking, punching, biting me. This seems to be stemming from issues at school adding some jealousy about the baby ( who she idolises, it's only me she struggles with, she is very hands on with him and spends lots of time playing or singing to him). It's only me she attacks. This disrupts the other two, my other Dd who can't even get in bed, and my son who needs me with him to settle to sleep.

Basically my eldest is fine to settle. My son needs me with atm. The only problem is the youngest who is either acting as above or generally refusing to get into bed. This disrupts eldest, and dealing with her takes me away from my Ds who settles quickly with me there but can't cope without me nearby yet. We are working on this when school restarts as he's very routine based. We're also waiting on a request for a bed alarm for him as he's disruptive in the night.

hmm wondering if there is a way to use her adoration of the baby somehow. does the baby sleep with you at the minute? anyway to put the baby in her room in a moses basket whilst she settles and say you need her to be extra quiet and good for the baby whilst you settle ds? possibly naff idea but i'm thinking her love of the baby can be used in some way to improve her behaviour? also lots of praise for how good she is with the baby and how proud mummy is of her for that and how much it helps mummy. definitely getting attention for the positive might help deter the negative more than head on wrangling. not saying you are wrangling but i would be lol.

and aside from all the ooh let's try to fix it stuff i've been spouting i want to say how i feel for you and it must be such hard work. want to say a big well done for coping thus far and remaining hopeful and looking for solutions.

i have one 10yo boy without sleep issues so am aware i don't know i'm born really.

I think you are right that they have had a lot of disruption and tiredness will not be helping their behaviour.

HoneyBadger. The only thing that's calmed her down during those melts downs has been the baby, but I never thought of popping him in there to see if that would calm her enough to settle nicely. He usually settles in between 8-9 and sleeps until 6-7. He hasn't woken up in the night since he was 6 weeks old. He tends to be fussy right on bedtime which might be a distraction for her, but I can certainly try! Thank you for the idea!!!