AIBU to think that "blacking up" is never acceptable?

[CoolRunnings2017]

story here

I appreciate that the people on the float probably didn't mean to offend, but surely common sense would tell you that this wasn't in good taste?

Slight derail but I'm amused to see how many Morris people there are lurking around and not only that, Molly people.

Up until recently I thought Molly was a reasonably obscurish thing limited to mostly East Angelia but now I know there are sides all over the shop.

DH used to dance Molly and FIL is a Border dancer (I think).

How is it racist , it's fancy dress. It's not done to mock . PC gone mad.

Read "Underground Railroad", or even just the chapter called "North Carolina", which relates a "show" given by blacked-up white people. Trigger Warning - it's really grim and made me feel sick, and then cry

If you don't get why it's wrong after reading that, you have no empathy whatsoever.

I love Morris dancing, gives me chills. The local festival is full of all types of Morris dancers and their bells and hobby hosses, bloody brilliant.

Not racist at all. I do wish the professionally offended would concentrate on serious issues.

AldiAisleOfCrap Thu 31-Aug-17 13:15:35
It is PC , as a black woman with mixed race dc I do not believe it is racist. Context is everything.
To call it racist discredits really racism.

Thank you.

Wow, the song lyrics add a whole new angle. How on earth was that allowed?

I suppose it did take some time for professionally offended to make an appearance

User149 you have articulated very well exactly what I was thinking! I know not here but America has an actual racist president. People are killing each other on the street because of the colour of their skin, a black person lives in fear of being stopped for jumping a traffic light because the POLICE might kill them! This is terrifying racism -the ppl on the float exercised bad taste but is it comparable. I think Britain changed when the Stephen Lawrence debacle came to light. We all have a lot to thank is mum for in my opinion. There is still proper, horrible racism, of course there is, but there are also many more people who will not tolerate it and say that's not ok.

It is massively racist, even without the song.

In the crowd would have been a whole load of people who giggled, didn't think of it as racist as racism doesn't effect them. There would also have been real racists who bloody lap this thing up. Racism isn't an idea it's a real thing that makes peoples lives crap, takes away opportunity's, makes people feel small.

This adds to that.Our country is becoming more racist and more people are abused each day.

Now is not the time to black up and ride through a largely white town for shits and giggles.

I also think it's pointless trying to debate when if someone says "Professionally offended" or "PC", example, someone replies with
"didn't take long" or "there's always one" or openly calls them stupid. A debate requires opinion, why join in to be so dismissive of someone's view. Tell them why you think they're wrong!

ilovesooty Thu 31-Aug-17 18:23:25
I suppose it did take some time for the 'cool mum' to make an appearance hmm

User, the 'context' here includes the fact that the blackface was accompanied by a song about Jamaicans all living in huts, smoking dope, and having babies because they can't afford condoms.

Three, virtually the entire thread has been about why blackface is racist. Your only argument as to why this instance isn't is that worse racism is taking place in the US, which is just whataboutery. Can you not understand that unconscious/witless stereotyping of this kind feeds entirely conscious, violent racism?

In the exact same way if you're white and are playing a black character or vice versa then you need to put on the appropriate make-up No, Nike, you don't. As I've already said, actors do not do this anymore. Casting is mostly race blind nowadays, and nobody would black (or white) their face anymore.

I also think it's pointless trying to debate when if someone says "Professionally offended" or "PC", example, someone replies with
hmm "didn't take long" or "there's always one" or openly calls them stupid. A debate requires opinion, why join in to be so dismissive of someone's view. Tell them why you think they're wrong!*

Neither of those phrases are any kind of argument though. They're just bullshit buzzwords used as a blanket insult.

Oh ffs, bold fail.

Have thought about this a it because of the Dutch Zwarte Piet thing as it is kind of similar. The character is a kind person who gives presents but was based on slaves traditionally and is often portrayed as being a bit dim/subserviant.

I used to think it was PC gone mad (as it's a tradition, not intended to offend, incomparable to actual racism in the sense of insults or discrimination etc) and I also kind of thought it was nice for black people to have a role in the traditions of the country (santa is never portrayed as black so maybe black children feel excluded?).

However I realised that many black people do feel offended by it and they do also get negative comments based on this tradition. Also it's not black people who are in the tradition but white people in costume!

I often find it difficult to know what is racist and and what is just a harmless generalisation/tradition. This is because I'm white and am not affected by it. One way to tell is wait and see what black people (or whatever ethnic group is the subject) think and be guided by that.

I also think not all racism is equal. Obviously there are some things that are obviously not on - but sometimes milder things can be done with the intention to cause discomfort which is not ok, whereas other times it can be ignorance due to not being of that race ourselves. People shouldn't all be tarred with the racist brush just because they still have a golliwog toy hidden in a cupboard or are nostalgic about their childhood. A lot of it depends on whether things are kept private - people should think very hard before doing something that could be miscontrued in a public setting.

In this case I don't think it's a hate crime (more likely ignorance/thoughtlessness) but nor should it be allowed in future events

Gemini you are absolutely right, people dress up at Halloween as all sorts of things. And it's completely fine as long as you are sensible.

I haven't ever seen any white children with their faces made up to look like a black or Asian character though - have you?

YABU intention matters

This is like someone saying prisons should be abolished because illegal imprisonment is done sometimes. I saw a play recently where a chinese guy played an indian character, it didn't seem weird and offensive that he had darkened/browned up his stage makeup a bit to make the character more believable.

There are many very white parts of the country where people do not regularly come in to contact with ethnic minorities and have never stopped to consider racism as it is such a non-issue for them personally. Consequently, there are a lot of "stealing our jobs" and "muslims = terrorists" type of racists, but also a lot of accidental racists (can't think of a better way to describe them) who say some really disgusting things without ever considering that what they're saying might be offensive and racist because they are so fucking ignorant.

I'd imagine the men in the article thought they were being funny and didn't stop to consider they were actually being racist pricks.

So if you're pushing a bobsled & white it's not going to be immediately apparent that you're trying to impersonate the Jamaican bobsled team. It's called acting - you put on make-up, wigs, facial hair, costume etc. to play a part.

If you're pushing a bob sled and white but you have a massive Jamaican flag and the phrase 'Jamaica we are a bob sled team' on your float, people are going to know who you're meant to be. And if they're so unfamiliar with 'Cool Runnings' that those references mean nothing, then painting your face black isn't going to help them get it any better, You either know the film or you don't.

Speaking of the wigs - only one of the characters in the film (Sanka, played by Doug. E Doug) had longish dreads. All the other 3 either had very short hair or shaved heads - so if these men were honestly attempting authenticity then they failed miserably, can they not google image search?

So blacked up faces and unnecessary Rasta wigs

Add in the racist song and ...
I mean its not like Jamaica is famous for a particular style of music and has an extremely famous musician whose songs everyone knows that could have been played in homage, is it? oh wait ...

You know what would have been more authentic and not caused this debacle? If they'd worn crash helmets. Authentic to the costume - no need to black up, no hard of thinking onlookers unable to work out who they're meant to be, despite tons of clues, because their skin colour isn't right.

They made a conscious decision and spent money to do this. They put a lot of time and thought into this - how can it be that not one of those thought was 'isn't it societally unacceptable to black up? maybe we should have a rethink' ? They are either deeply stupid or knowingly racist.

They weren't being racist, but I can see why people would find it offensive especially with the connatations of black face. Not a good idea.

Why were they dressing up as cool runnings anyway?

(I think they probably are deeply stupid too)