To ask you all about your minds eye?

[GrampieRabbit]

I've had a really long running thread about this a few years ago, but I wanted to revisit it - firstly because I find it really interesting, and secondly for dissertation ideas

So I don't have a minds eye. I couldn't picture a tree in my head, or a house, or my baby's face. I couldn't tell you 100% which colour my room is painted in, or what colour my dads car is. I literally think in words.

This means I have trouble with directions, even to places I've been several times. My memory is absolutely terrible - my long term memory is practically non existent.

Does anyone else experience similar? There's a test you can take here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-340390544*

I know I want to do my dissertation on this condition. I'm so fascinated by it, and have been ever since I realised it was actually a thing (on Mumsnet!)

But I want it to be on aphantasia AND something. I was thinking aphantasia and memory.

But I remember that last time I had a thread on this, Mumsnetters with aphantasia (and myself) read extraordinarily quickly, and always had done from a young age. So I was thinking maybe I could test the strength of participant's minds eyes (couldn't work out the grammar for that phrase!), and then timing them whilst they read something. But might have to include some comprehension questions I guess to check they've actually read it.

Then I started thinking about the fact that people said they had always read quickly - so is this something we're born with? Could I figure out a way to test kids for it? Maybe a little too complicated?

My dissertation proposal's due in a couple of days. It can be really vague - I could probably just get away with writing 'aphantasia', but I want to get paired with the most appropriate supervisor, hence the forward thinking. Am waiting on DD to go to bed then I'll research some more, but these are just some initial ideas.

Please, please share your experiences of aphantasia and thoughts on interesting dissertation ideas

this is interesting. marking place to return tomorrow.

Would those of you with aphantasia say you have a degree of face blindness?

Yep, I hadn't seen my DP for a month and had to meet him in a public place, I didn't recognise him although I thought it might be him based on his colouring and how he was dressed and then it took 10/15 minutes to get used to his face again.

I have this and didn't know it was a thing. I am also a very fast reader (and I get bored and can't follow long action led parts like chases and fight scenes) with hopeless sense of direction, spatial awareness. I need to read up on this a bit more, it's interesting!

There is a weird aspect to this which is probably similar to the places/songs mentioned above but I sometimes say I'm picturing something in my mind but I'm not really 'seeing' it I'm sort of experiencing a memory or flash back. It's not a picture just a strong flash of something I've seen, experienced or read.

I'll add my ability to remember song lyrics is second to none (and suffer earworms). Faces I really struggle with, if I knew you from work but met you in town it would throw me.

This is fascinating! I had never heard of this but definitely have it. I also have zero sense of direction and read extremely quickly. I do have a very strong imagination but it's more to do with feelings than visions, if that makes sense? I'm also very (overly, I would say) empathetic and completely freak out at the thought of cruelty or violence, not because it looks awful-I don't particularly care about blood etc-but because I immediately go to how terrified the victim must be. I wonder if that's related?

Sorry everyone, I was writing my proposal!

To answer some questions, I can't smell or taste things in my head either. Or hear voices.

My facial recognition is awful. I work in a customer service type role, and if I ask someone to take a seat whilst I sort something out for them, I won't be able to remember which customer they are a few minutes later it's really embarrassing.

I just read some research whereby facial recognition takes place in a different part of the brain to imagery, which I guess could explain why I recognise my best friend and my family etc. But I have to do the same as a pp, consciously think of a new person's characteristics to remember them.

Also thought about the hypnotherapy link before - I considered it to give up smoking, then realised it was unlikely to work for me.

My dissertation is undergrad. My proposed hypotheses are:

*People with aphantasia have decreased visual recall skills compared to people without aphantasia.
*
People with aphantasia have increased word recall skills compared to people without aphantasia.

^ both backed up by literature, but there's not much of it (so fingers crossed for getting published ).

I'm going to do the study online, as I think it will be too difficult to find a good number of aphantasic (new word learned!) participants. Would you guys, especially my aphantasic brethren, consider participating? It wouldn't take long, and I'd reaaaally appreciate it.

Oh yes, and no spatial awareness. Cannot parallel park or reverse into spaces to save my life.

I don't have face blindness. I'm a teacher and I learn names really quickly and bump into kids I haven't taught for years in town and still know their names. Even though if you asked me what they looked like I'd struggle to tell you.

I have (self diagnosed) aphantasia and some degree of face blindness.
I had a facisnating thread on this a while ago on here. Will try and find it.
Would be happy to help with study and interested in reading more about it.

I think am oscha's twin!

I have this. I only realised a few months ago that a) it's a thing and b) most people actually see things in their mind.

I am a very fast reader and was reading by age three. I have a fantastic memory for song lyrics and book/film quotes but struggle remember what I had for dinner last night, and really struggle with memories from longer ago.

I do however dream really, really vividly. So much so that on occasion I'm not sure whether something really happened or if I dreamed it, I have to give it some serious thought before I remember which it is.

Just looked it up and it says since I can't see an apple in my minds eye, I would need to look at one to draw it...
Great with details on things and colours can see about 300 shades, and yes to the not remembering people I don't know...

I have a really bad memory for names (I can quite literally forget as soon as it's been told to me), a great memory for places but not faces.

I read really quickly but never visualise the picture, (except with Harry Potter, where I visualise the films).

I can't visualise faces, but if I have to visualise colour (eg when redecorating) I can do it absolutely no problem provided I close my eyes, and providing it's not people. I also have no problems visualising a situation if someone else is describing it to me. but not if I'm reading it.

I absolutely loved the invention of digital camera because I no longer had to tell people that "the bride was wearing white, I think".

When I imagine sounds or music I hear it super vividly, in fact when I read I hear what I'm reading more than see it. I can't imagine smells in any vivid way and taste is only slightly more tangible.

This is really interesting, OP, I remember touching on it during my degree.

In the BBC test I got 24/40 so I'm at the lower end of the population in terms of visualising but not unusual apparently.

Strangely, I picture everything in animation. So in that test, when it asked me to visualise a relative I pictured my mum but in cartoon caricature rather than real life her. I do that all time with everything. I can conjure up RL images, but it takes a lot of effort whereas cartoon versions are just automatic and instant.

This score suggests that your visual imagery is more vivid than usual. Scores at the upper end of this range are suggestive of ‘hyperphantasia’: exceptionally strong powers of visualisation. About 23% of people score in this range, the highest of our five bands.

Honestly I thought that everyone could "see" stuff too. When I was younger I'd struggle with the difference between reality and my day dreams. In a dark silent room I can "see" whatever I conjure up. It wasn't until dh said he had no idea what I was on about I realised it was weird.

Why is it so difficult to use your memory? Because you don't have visual clues?

I scored 18/40. I struggle with faces and names. I am a voracious reader and read quickly and have done from a young age. I am brilliant at remembering numbers and would make a great proof reader. I am good at recognising voices too.

I am rubbish at films, and spend my life irritating people by saying "So is that the bloke from the start who murdered his sister?"..." I genuinely struggle with films For this reason I don't tend to watch them because I am so busy trying to work out who is who that I miss the plot.

As a HCP I have learned to compensate . I can meet someone then have to work to recognise them. I can care for them all day in one particular bed space,but if they then come up to the nurses station to ask me something I have to use other cues to give me a clue.

I have got skilled at it now, and using techniques to embed them in my mind. It has never ever held me back. Once I have seen them out of context it becomes easier - like my brain steps up to the plate and moves up a gear.

The other side of the coin, is that they can be telling me about something and I am taking on board their words and the content, but I also pick up on their voice cadences and emotional subtext very very easily because it just jumps out at me. So I can tune into what they are not saying explicitly? Dunno if this makes any sense?

Mr Eve here.
Complete absence of visualisation without realisation for the first 60 years. Dawned on me when listening to a radio program.
Read very quickly until 17 years of age then taught myself to slow down (a lot).
Never been able to memorise from a book but very good to exceptional aural memory.

Suggest comparing memory retention between silent reading and verbalised reading. I have a sneaking suspicion that this could be useful.
NB nobody read silently until relatively recently.

Good luck.

Thank you James. That is so interesting!

Interesting too (to me!) - I had hypnotherapy about 10 years ago for a particularly stressful situation. Ultimately, other things came up and bit me on the arse . But if I want to relax now I can go back to imagining floating in a small boat on a beautiful lake. Surrounded by Pine Trees. I can feel the sun and can create a cooling breeze. I can smell the trees, I can hear the sail billowing. One of the tricks I learned was to hear and feel the sail billowing and getting out of control. That is 'Stress'. I calmly, in my head - I 'see' it - pull the sail in and secure it. I have NEVER sailed a boat in my life but this works every time.

I am an aphant. I am also face-blind. I read very fast probably as I skim descriptions - they don't add to the story.

My daughter is very visual, she sees full blown movies in her head. But she is also a fast reader (but slower than me!)

I struggle with my memory, have reasonable spatial awareness, think in words. Very few visual dreams - if I do, it's always in the same place, but the characters are blurred.

My reading of aphantasia suggests that we all experience it slightly differently and what holds for one, doesn't for another. The brain really is an amazing piece of kit!

I'm a visual learner and when I teach that is also very visual too - apparently it's why English as additional language pupils do so well in my class. When giving directions I usually describe features they pass and I'm rubbish at reading maps. If I'm giving directions I describe the route as I'm seeing it in my head - did it today with a friend we have just come back from holiday from a place they went to years ago - trying to describe a restaurant but couldn't remember it's name so described how to get to it and she knew where I was talking about.

I hate watching films after I read the book as they aren't how I pictured them.

I'm also a fast reader.

Oh, and when I do remember things, it's scenarios - but I couldn't tell you who was there, where it was, when it was etc.

OP this is such interesting stuff. I love how easy it is to assume the way our own minds work are 'normal' and when you find out it isn't, it's a shock!

I didn't realise I was unusual at all until I did my degree (psychology) when I realised I must have some form of facial agnosia because I cannot visualise faces at all (though I do recognise people after a few meetings).

For other objects, I can only visualise them in my mind if zooming in on really tiny detail (like the serrated edge of a leaf, but not the whole leaf).

My memory for colour is excellent, but I have some synesthesia for colour with sensation so that might be why. My memory for sounds and voices is very marked and I struggle to enjoy films for this reason (as I'll be recalling every other role I've heard every single voice in)

I have excellent memory for words, but I am dyslexic so I don't think my reading is typical.

I am poor at giving or receiving directions, but am very good at following my nose.

Reading that, I realise I sound rather askew. I promise I seem normal on the outside!

I can visualise pictures very well, I cannot visualise words at all. Whenever I picture things there are no words, say if I was picturing a petrol station, the name I of the petrol station wouldn't be there but everything about the petrol station would be.

I can visualise walking through a forest, a completely made up one and it's just as good as if I was there.

I'm a pretty quick reader but my comprehension is terrible. When I read it's like I'm watching a film and remembering the book I remember it like I remember a film.

For directions, I have to google street view it otherwise I'm not great at figuring out where I'm walking, street names are not useful. But if I'm remembering the route to somewhere I can run through it in my head as if I was driving it.