To think that every person above age 10 at least should know that the moon affects the tides?

[HateSummer]

I was working with someone aged in their early 20's recently who had never heard of this and were really shocked. I was really shocked they didnt know.

Isn't this basic science taught in primary school? Along with the moon cycle and seasons?

Fucking Hell so because I didn't know about the moon and the tides that makes me thick?

No, I knew but I'm not so smug and self absorbed as to think that everyone automatically knows what I know.
Some people seem to get off on "OMG, how can you not know THAT?!" attitudes.
Must make them feel clever or something.
Learning is much more conducive to educating than mocking. There, there's a chink in some superior's knowledge, as it's a fact that seems to have passed them by....

I knew a doctor who thought for years into adulthood that tuna fish were the same size as the tins that it comes in.

4691 - plenty of four-year-olds are at school in the UK. Some will have done a whole year of Reception.

My son did a topic on space in Reception, but not sure if they learned about tides. This kicked off his interest in space, and he's since watched a lot of videos and we've looked at books about space. I have learned more about space in the last year than I ever knew in my whole life before! His younger sister (4) has probably picked it up some of this knowledge from him. Then when we've been on the beach and seen the tide coming in, I've told them that it's because of the moon.

On a side note, I knew someone who needed to add 20% VAT to hire fees. She decided that it was too difficult to work out 20% of £4 so just said that the fee included VAT. She was otherwise quite bright and capable.

but the tides aren't 'caused by the moon' ....won't anyone think of the science

and my somewhat obvious point is that there is no point defining random nuggets of information as valuable or indicative of 'education' because there is always more to it. What's valuable is the interest and ability to find out more about the information you have and add to it.

just in case anyone would like to update their knowledge from 'the moon causes the tides'...

So the tides are caused by the gravitational force on the water, which can move and hence respond to the attraction more than the rock can.

There are 3 main sources of gravitational force in the system. The largest force comes from the planet Earth. It isn't the biggest gravitational body, but its certainly the closest.

The next biggest source of gravitational force is the Sun. Its very far away but fecking huge (to use a technical term).

The third biggest source is the Moon. Its quite small but much closer than the Sun.

So a calculation of the force on a bit of water on the surface of the Earth shows that there is 3000 times as much force from the Earth than the Sun, and 100 times as much force from the Sun than the Moon.

However, the net force doesn't matter for the tides. What matters is the difference in this force for water in different places on the planet, as it is this difference in force that causes the water to actually move. This wipes out the influence of the Earth, which is independent(ish) of location...leaving the Moon and the Sun.

Calculating the difference in force for water on the near side of the planet to the Sun and the far side, and the near side of the planet to the Moon and the far side, shows the difference in force from the Sun is about twice that of the Moon.

So if either the Moon or the Sun dominated, we would have tides, but they would be basically the same throughout the month. The fact they are close in size allows the relative positions of the Sun and Moon to become important and leads to spring tides, when they are aligned and neap tides, when they are not.

So its more about the Sun than the Moon, and all about the planet rotating (or they would just be water bulges, not tides). If anyone wants to know why high tide isn't at midday, or why there are two tidal bulges on opposite sides of the planet, then I can certainly explain but it will be as long as this again.....

Morphene, thank you, that is really interesting! I would love your next-stage explanation, but will set my mind to Googling.

Does this come under Geography?

Irradiatedhaggis, of course it doesn't make you thick. It also doesn't make you a smug, arrogant arsehole like those who would call someone thick for not knowing.

Truthfully, I can't think of one time where my life has been disadvantaged because I can't recall the details of the relationship between the moon and the tides.

Still, if acting Superior makes some people feel good about themselves they're more to be pitied.

Sorry my last post was to Flybe!

I know a man, a Cambridge maths grad might be verging on brilliant this man but he tries to convince me that he can prove that an aircraft cannot fly. I have offered several times to take him up but he says that until i come up with some math's to prove they can fly - he's not boarding.

Well he should know about complex numbers and poles being on the left.

I've known adults who can't read analogue clocks, work out change in a shop or change a lightbulb

I think the 'basics' change over time, I could just about work out old money but I don't need to. Most people under the age of 25 use their phone for the time and may have never been taught the analogue clock. Now we are getting hybrid watches that might change.

We were on holiday last week so tides were a 'hot' topic especially as the beach we were at disappears under the water at high tide. (And didn't become usable for almost 2hrs after)

But i don't understand how they work. I don't understand how they know the time of every high tide, why did last year when we were there high tide stopped about 6
feet from the wall one day but this year it was right up. I remember being on holiday in Devon and there being the occasional super low tide which meant we could walk round to the next cove which was usually unreachable by foot. Tides amaze me and I found quite an innate pull towards them last week.

Thank you morphene, for that in depth explanation. Very interesting.

Morphene,

I think you got that the wrong way round. The moon has twice the gravitational effect as the sun.

See here;
oceanservice.noaa.gov/education/kits/tides/tides02_cause.html

But a good point, the gravitational effect of both bodies has to be taken into account to understand tidal behaviour.

My just gone 4 year old knows.. but he is a massive science fanatic and can tell lots of adults stuff they don't know (different shark species, solar system stuff, different types of volcanos, and weather systems)

Would be a stealth boast, but I take no responsibility for his interests! Its all him and I
as astounded as anyone as to why/how he has this knowledge . (he does have access to an iPad alongside toys and LOTS of books, he voice searches on google.. SUPERVISED (gotta be supervised as he once set of Siri looking for cunts on my phone, he ment buns, after I told him he couldn't have one...))

I do wonder what kind of sheltered lives some adults have, in my GCSE geography class a girl questioned Iceland being "abroad" because it wasn't hot. She then got a C grade. Take from that what you will.

ARGH - I calculated my value from first principles...got the physics right .....and fucked up multiplying numbers in excel. Total genius....

Ah well.

The timing of the actual tide in a given location tends to be more controlled by water viscosity and flow. IF the flow was frictionless the bulges would just pass over the earth and the tides would peak at midday and midnight....or mid moon day and mid moon night. But water is viscous and the tide lags behind to an extent that depends on semi-local geography. It takes a lot of time for water to pass through the English channel for example...hence the tide is delayed anywhere after that. You can experience a high tide at any time of day if you chose the right place on the UK coast.

No worries Morphene, from your explanation I knew you knew what you were talking about and assumed it was a simple arithmetical hiccup. I once messed up a calculation in a finals paper but got the marks as I showed my workings. Trying to convince my teenage son to always show his workings is proving difficult ('cos I'm like a million years old and what would I know...).
My youngest (10) did know about the tides so education isn't being wasted on him at least.

Does anyone understand the tides in the Solent properly?

Sorry my last post was to Flybe!

Ah right, just seen this and glad I did as was just re-reading my posts thinking "eh? Where did I say that?!" lol

I remember having to use an alamanac and a chart to work out the best course to get across the Channel Involved dividers and vectors!!

Nowadays they'd use these modern fangled computers

If it's that information or how the indicators on their car work, I know which I'd rather they kept in their head into their 20s.

"Does anyone understand the tides in the Solent properly?"

Certainly not me! I remember having to do a calculation on tides up the river severn...but it was all 'assume a perfect uniform width channel' BS....so probably not close to reality.

I think the 'basics' change over time, I could just about work out old money but I don't need to. Most people under the age of 25 use their phone for the time and may have never been taught the analogue clock. Now we are getting hybrid watches that might change.

I've never seen a primary school classroom without an analogue clock and telling the time is definitely on the National Curriculum. One of our most famous national symbols is a giant clock- it would be very sad if analogue clocks became a relic of history like sundials.

With regards to change I mean how many change would you get from a fiver if you spent £3.69 sort of thing.

I sometimes get a 😱😵when I do stuff like hand the cashier £10.01 for a shop costing £5.01 so I get £5.00 change. I've been told I'm lucky to get a round fiver in change.

I have a sister in law who remarked when the clocks changed to BST that we would be getting more money for the electricity generated by our solar panels (both households had them installed a few months before). I asked how she worked that out and she replied. "Well we will be getting an extra hour of daylight".

Surely no one can actually be that dense!