AIBU to think SAHMs shouldn't put this nonsense on a CV/job application

[windygallows]

In the last year I've recruited for numerous part-time jobs, receiving applications from many women who took time out to be with family and are now returning to work.

Many of the applicants have been straightforward and simply noted on their CV that they have been SAHM - simple.

But increasingly applicants, perhaps based on some guidance from career counsellors or MN, are finding more creative ways to describe their absence from the workforce.

One, we'll call her Mrs Jones, wrote that for 10 years she was employed by the 'Jones family' and that her work involved 'organizing international travel for her family.' Because organizing a holiday is similar to the tasks led by senior executives.

Another wrote a list of every task she did at home from getting groceries to cleaning the house which, while impressive as an exhaustive list, doesn't really mean much when applying to an office-based role. Especially as it's basically a list of everything most employees have to fit in outside of work.

More galling are the claims that women make about the critical role they played - with my favourite being the one who 'Spent 7 years looking after my two children who needed and deserved my attention.'

There is huge value in the work that SAHMs do but please, please don't put this kind of waffle on your CV. You never know if your interview panel will consist of a FT working, single mom like me who finds it pretty insulting that working means her children apparently lost out on 'the attention they needed and deserved.' Urgh.

@Want2bSupermum - The housewife I hired was for a Senior Cost Manager role in a large investment bank. She is a fucking natural despite not being a graduate - she has common sense and is a quick learner and really impresses our senior guys by the way she builds relationships. I would definitely trust her to make decisions in my absence. Similarly I also have a Junior Cost Manager who is a 21 year old accounting graduate - I would trust her to make decisions in my stead too. If you can't then what's the point of hiring them?

As someone who has shortlisted and interviewed numerous people for work with young people - safeguarding requires there be no gaps in the laSt 5 years, in terms of whereabouts or activity. Any gaps in an application are dealt with by admin on the day of the interview by asking what was being done. However this does not need to be part of the interview; the most frequent answers would be simple statements such as "stay at home parent", "travelling/backpacking", "recuperation after illness", "period of unemployment". No fluff!

Please do bear in mind some jobs require a time line for the last 5 or so years.

And thanks to government cuts, our excellent TAs are paid little, but use judgement and professionalism daily. So common sense etc is something sought after.

'And thanks to government cuts, our excellent TAs are paid little, but use judgement and professionalism daily'

As someone working in education, THIS. In spades!

Some of the patronising crap on here from people claiming to be managers - treating the people they manage as they would their own children, and not wanting Lower paid people exercising judgement... dear god.

Plant working as I do in a school, I have terms of WOHP followed by 6 weeks of SAHP. I'm not buying it that one develops loads of skill the other doesn't. 6 weeks isn't forever but I'm sure I'd notice if it was harder in some key way. Otherwise I'd have experienced a steep learning curve from one or the other surely?

I would say (and I'm not in this boat but 2 mates are) being a single parent does involve more skills than either WOHP or sahp with a partner though.

Well, I do agree with you but perhaps if society valued motherhood and staying at home to raise children more, then women would not feel the need to justify the gap in their cv

I agree with the problem, it's the solution that is the issue. It should be easier for SAHP to return to work than it is and there should be much more support for them to do so. Encouraging them to rebadge their time as a SAHP with all sorts of ridiculous job titles and claim they were accountants/negotiators/logistics managers is not the answer.

We need to find a way to improve the ratio of SAHDs to SAHMs so that it's not predominantly women that are bearing the burden. Reducing the gender pay gap will help there but perhaps we could come up with more, like training or support for dads who might like to do it but don't feel confident in their abilities and some positive propaganda PR to dispel the attitude that SAHPing is a woman's role.

We need to tackle the problem of de-skilling over time and either providing learning grants and/or training programs specifically designed for SAHPs. These shouldn't just be something that can be accessed as you're about to return to work but something you can utilise throughout your time as a SAHP.

We could be really bold as a society and establish something along the same lines as apprenticeships or government subsidised workplace training, not just for entry-level jobs but for semi-skilled, technical and professional people who just need a hand getting back up to speed and current in their particular area.

I dare say there's more that could be done but that's what comes off the top of my head. SAHPs provide a valuable social service and represent a substantial pool of potential resource for business and industry. It makes sense to invest in measures to get more out of them when they're ready to return to work and to make it easier for them to justify being SAHPs to begin with.

UKtoLA your post was excellent.

I agree with getting more men involved with child rearing..cause if you think there's stigma for SAHMs I can tell you there's far more for SAHDs. my ex was met with a barrage of comments about him being a "dependent little baby" "living off wifey like a little bitch" "isn't that nice mr mom, letting your woman go out and support you" when he considered staying home w our son. Our society needs a complete overhaul in how it treats fathers and what it expects of them.

I think you sound envious and slightly bitter about SAHMs.

Transferable parental leave. Cannot for the life of me understand why the take up is so low (and yea, I know a few people will pop up saying it was financially a bit more beneficial for the mother to take a whole year off rather than transfer a few months to the child's father, but that can't be the case for all couples. And anyway some things are more important than money... many of us older mums would have chewed are arms off for the opportunities which are available nowadays.

'But I breastfeed' is the other thing I hear on MN as a reason why more mums than dads stay home. Well- so did I bf, and many of my peers who had children 20+ years ago, back in the day when maternity leave was 12 weeks only.

I know there's always a feeling that more could be done to redress the balance and get more men taking caring responsibilities and more women taking their career seriously. But honestly, things are way better than just a couple of decades back. People have to buy into these ideas though. I sometimes feel as though all the things me and my peers were wishing for back in the day- paternity leave, shared parental leave- aren't maximised as much as they could be. This is where it starts- get dads involved hands on during the early months and years and then we'll go some way to redressing the balance

It's the same for men in childcare roles Dustbunny. So many people who can't comprehend that a man could do a "woman's job". Just as much as we need to see more women in traditionally male roles, we need men in female ones.

You also have the flip side btw - the folk who treat men who SAHP or work with children like a fucking saint.

In my field (law) every day of my life I read a judgment, article or new case. Youc an do that whether you are at home or at work and you can do it on line for no charge so stay at home mothers not currently practising law can very easily spend part of the working day reading all the new draft and issued legislation and cases actually.

Dbro is a stay at home dad and dh works for himself so does more childcare.

They both get shit for it.

Also every woman who have worked for me while they were pg laughed at shared mat/pat leave. They dont want to share it.

People keep saying society needs to change their opinion. Thats starts at individual levels.

I do think sahp seem to find it eaiser to return to work. But i have never known a man take more than 4 years.

As an employer I don't want my lower paid employees making judgement calls. That is what managers and supervisors are for.

I'm guessing you work in a very different environment to me then. Personally I don't have the time nor the inclination to micro-manage my staff in this way. I hire people who are already competent and who can make judgement calls and decisions by themselves, and can use their common sense as to when they need to seek another opinion or authorisation. I have worked in organisations with very hierarchical management structures and IME it stifles creativity and initiative. I want my staff to feel inspired and to be able to contribute new ideas to keep our service at the top-notch level it is and that is best done by employing a flat management structure where everyone feels that they are an equal member of the team.

'Also every woman who have worked for me while they were pg laughed at shared mat/pat leave. They dont want to share it.

People keep saying society needs to change their opinion. Thats starts at individual levels.'

So true.

I also can't help wondering whether these mothers who don't want to transfer a few months leave to the child's father are the same women who a few years down the line are whinging that their husband doesn't do enough with the kids, or bemoaning that the child won't be put to bed by anyone other than mum.

Imo whatever societal norms or obstacles there may be, we all have a personal responsibility to create the kind of partnership we want. If you want genuine balance in your roles, then go for it- don't accept being the one whose career goes down the pan, While your husband jets off round the world and is too important to change a nappy or scrub the toilet

Yes society needs to change but I'm not prepared to be the fall guy for that.

For us jacking in my career gave my OH the support that allowed his career to develop, and gave me huge freedoms to do as I wanted to.

I have worked with a woman whose DP SAH. He simply tried to ring her all the time to ask what to do, management put a stop to that. Then she complained that he never did any housework.

Cringe. Working mums manage to do all that too 😕 Its called life not work "skills"

If you see it as being a 'fall guy' then of course you're not going to do it.
I'm talking about couples who genuinely want an earning/ caring/domestic balance for each partner.

'We need to find a way to improve the ratio of SAHDs to SAHMs so that it's not predominantly women that are bearing the burden.'

Why is this important?

Obviously it's great if men who want to get to be SAHDs.

But having equal numbers of men and women having issues in the workplace due to a period as a SAHP does not actually improve the position for SAHMs!

arrghh ... I SO agree with you!! CRINGE, CRINGE, CRINGE... I just could not keep a straight face if I had to interview these women. How do you do it? (Keep a straight face??) !!!

I'm talking about couples who genuinely want an earning/ caring/domestic balance for each partner.

We do have a balance.
It's not just about everyone doing an equal share of everything though.

We play to our strengths, our likes, our capabilities.
For OH he works long hours.
I take care of family finances and housework.
I have more free time than him, but I need more.

I don't know why you seem to need to justify yourself cailleach. I didn't say you don't have a balance. I am talking about couples who want a balance of work/home life each rather than balancing things by taking on separate roles

What prospective employers expect to see on a CV is going to vary. So, the best advice is to try and research the organisation and perhaps also those who will do a first cut of CVs (HR departments, senior management in the fuction concerned) and then make a call on what would be most pertinent information about SAHM status while also seeking to demonstrate your own character. In some cases the detailed description may make sense, in other cases a single sentance may be better.

It's the age old MN argument ... which is better. Reality is neither..
But having the choice is a good position to be in.

I am currently a SAHM looking to get back into work PT I went back to work after DS was born but when we had DD we couldn't afford childcare for both because it was more than my wages. Honestly all I put on my CV was a note saying having spent a couple of years at home as the main caregiver of my children I am looking forward to getting back to work now.

I dont blame these mums for trying to make themselves look better though. It's practically impossible to get a job when you've been out of work for a few years especially if you're a mum. Despite having 7 years office experience prior to my 4 years out of work I am not what any of the office jobs I apply for are looking for. I even thought getting any job for a start would be better than no job and make it look like I was really committed to getting back to work but got turned down by Tesco and Sainsbury's because all my previous experience was office work related so they said they didn't want me leaving the minute something better came along. So really I can empathise with these women for wanting to sound more important or seeking advice for their CVs.