Why do people fear Home Educators so much?

[sebumfillaments]

Not a TAAT but inspired by the other thread, I was stunned by the level of vitriol aimed at home education. Is it all borne from fear and ignorance?

Home Ed isn't about replicating school. And education isn't (in our case) about gaining qualifications from an institution to increase their value in the workforce!

So why so much animosity?

I think part of the issue for many is that the school system isn't particularly flexible. Which is understandable as to provide mass education it can't be really, and for the majority (across society and areas) it does an ok job. In some areas, and some sectors of society it does an awesome job, and in some a mediocre one. But again, that is a feature of a mass education. (That's not a derogatory 'mass' by any means.)

But there are lots of kids and families for whom that doesn't work. So it's good that there is the alternative, even though it may not be for everyone.

I've known one girl who's come out of HE without any qualifications and she's sorely behind her peers. It's so sad and she has little self-esteem about her abilities
Only one? There are blooming thousands come out of schools like that. 😂

I've just been reading the thread by teachers about why they're leaving the profession. And after reading about some of the little shits they have to deal with and that 90% of lesson time is behaviour management of the bad ones while the good kids get ignored, HE my dc is starting to sound a lot more attractive.

Hmm....reading more of the thread though; off course home education is the best/only option for some kids. But, that isn't how this discussion started off. You said it's used because education shouldn't be about certificates and value in the workplace blah blah. I agree that EDUCATION isn't about this and SCHOOL is. But education extends beyond school. Part of raising your kids is preparing them for getting a job in order to live AND tolerance of people you don't like.

Most parents extend education beyond what the kids get at school, in terms of following interests and passions in particular

I blame the bad education I got at school for my spelling actually (and auto correct haha), maybe if my mum had home schooled me it would be better! I am not a teacher... But I know many teachers whose spelling and grammar are way worse than mine. I actually left school without many qualifications, I went to a grammar school. I then a few years later went to night school and got A levels. Then to uni to get a degree, masters and PhD from a Russel Group Uni. I am now actually an academic in a STEM subject. I think sending your kids to a state school is a gamble actually. Who knows how they will get treated and if in a class of 32 they will get the education they deserve. If you hear how the teachers talk about your kids you might think twice as well. If school works for your kids great, but It fails many and we should be praising the parents who recognise this, not calling them and their children all sorts of names.

I know a fair few teachers who home ed, no because they have the skills but because they don't rate the school system particularly.

I have a lot of friendswho HS and as a teacher l have no problem with it. Their dc did full range of subjects and went to university to study quite demanding subjects.
My dd always says she feels sorry for them as she had so much fun in school and made so many friends.
Also l notice they are quite judgemental about schools. One said she didnt want her dc there as too much time is spent on choir/ sports etc. Surely that is part of an education too.
So l think go for it if it suits your dc but do t act like you have made the superior option and try to put other parents choice down.

It's right for some.children and families. When done well, it's good and successful.

Obviously not all home Ed is equal and equally prepares children for the next steps.

I think there's a group within home Ed who are very much 'formal education is awful and damaging' and love to get on their high horse about how they know so much more about education and pedagogy than anyone with training. (They also get quite defensive when teachers suggest that it's hard for us to teach out of specialism because specialism matters because apparently we know nothing and all kids need is encouragement and google)

All but 1 of the families I know who home educate spend a disproportionate amount of time putting religious studies at the heart of the education. The other lets their children direct learning and is very much 'let them follow their interests and they'll magically gain qualifications'.

As has happened a lot on this thread by those who chose school surely? 😂 And tbh most parents believe they have made a superior choice, otherwise they wouldn't have made it. Very few will turn around and go 'hey ho, I knew there was a better option for my children but opted for mediocre regardless', surely?!

Sorry, that was to June.

I've only met one mum who was going down the home ed route. She was a convert and it was for religious reasons apparently (not entirely what she was getting at there). She talked quite a lot of nonsense about her new religion (half of my family are if the same one).

Disagreeing with your choices and possibly your smugness is not 'fearing you'.

I have 3 degrees, 5 masters, 2 PhDs and am actually Queen of the World.

I'm not sure what point you were trying to make though Deluded other than you didn't do well at school, or did ... I'm confused.

We both home educate and send the kids to school, they are normally at home for about a third to half the year, and the rest of the time they are at school (this is to do with our professional obligations, not our educational choices), I feel both have their advantages, but that is because my kids fit in school very well, are happy there and have lots of friends, this is not true for all children.

Academically, I find they do much better at home with us, particularly my eldest. In school he fools around quite a lot and is much more interested in his friends than in his lessons. At home he concentrates better and has more choice about what to do and therefore progresses much faster. the HE periods also allow much more scope for extracurricular activities because we are not constrained by the school routine (also, we travel a lot more in those periods), so in general, those period are culturally richer.

The socialisation process is also very different, school has the advantage of providing time with a group of friends on a regular, daily basis, which is nice IF the child has a good circle of friends (it is dreadful if they are bullied, no escape!!), the socialisation during HE is much more varied, freer but less constant and intense, both can be good.

I also like the fact that my kids experience what it means to have to follow rules and fit in, but also get a period when they don't have to do that (well, apart form home rules, of course!), I hope this will give them a good critical sense and distance but also the ability to fit into "the system" when they have to, and like or not, they will have to at some point! but hopefully the system won't crash them if they can reflect about it critically and realise that not fitting in doesn't necessarily mean that there is something wrong with them, if you see what I mean. I feel like we get the best of both worlds and I am very happy with this set up (and realise we are very privileged!).

I live in Sweden which is probably the most child led society in the world. The rights of children are at the forefront of a lot of stuff. The attitude to children here is quite different to the uk. They are seen as little people with rights who should be listened to Physical punishment is (quite rightly) illegal and the thought of shoving kids into classrooms with testing so young is anathema. And yet...

Home ed is illegal here.

It's illegal because the child has a right to an education and interaction with society.

I do not doubt that there are some absolutely fantastic home educators out there. I know a few out in very geographically remote locations in the Pacific Northwest who link up via satellite and their kids are taught brilliantly.

But... there's too much risk of it being hijacked by religion, or being done badly, or being used as a cover for neglect. I know one here who would probably do a great job home edding and she was quite shocked she couldn't. I had to point out the awful case in South Wales a while back where the kid died of scurvy and neglect - this is why you can't have nice things, etc.

I've pointed this out in other threads and been called a 'schooler' which seems to me like the kind of term cults use to disparage 'The Outsiders'.

Home education can be done well.

It isn't easy to do well. I'm an educated person, dh and I have eight degrees between us, and have both taught. He has a teaching qualification and neither of us would feel up to teaching a full curriculum from start to uni.
I'm with the Swedish ban to be honest. Kids being in school is a valuable thing for them. It teaches them how to interact with others. It puts them in context with professionals daily - I'd be interested to know what proportion of neglect and use is picked up by teachers, id imagine a massive proportion.

And the idea of being a free spirit is lovely, but in the real world must of us have soul crushing jobs involving SOPS, deadlines, reports, pitching up on time and having to interact with other people who can range from delightful to utter shits.

Not rtft but I have a few questions. I couldn't home educate as I am the queen of procrastinating and on a lovely sunny day I'd hit the beach with dd.

The main thing I don't understand is that legally my dd must attend school. If I take her on holiday during term time I'll get fined. If I don't send her I'll be in big trouble.

The OP has said that HE kids don't sit exams and are not formally educated. I have no moral issues with this - you don't need bits of paper with grades on to establish self worth but how do you not "get into trouble" with the authorities? If I suddenly took dd out of school I'd have Ss at my door quick smart.

So why not with HE? Do home educators have to meet a certain criteria? Must they teach to a syllabus?

I actually admire people who can do this.its not for me but I can see the attraction.

I don't know any home educators who do for religious reasons.

By far, most I know do so for medical reasons, including mental health

And some who do because of the opinions expressed in the OP....School is so restrictive/want kids to be free to pursue prions/education should not be about certificates. There is definitely an air of superiority about these ones. Inevitably they have a partner who works and supports them financially so they can mince about at home making dream catchers and egg box sculptures. It's not most people's real life is it. Kids do need to be able to compete for jobs when they get older. As much as you may dislike the system, that involves qualifications etc

We had J W around not long ago, together with two small, hot, black suited little boys, around 8 and 10. It was in that stuffy heat wave. They were being home educated, she told me. They sat in the shade in the garden for a few minutes and the beautifully mannered boys had lollies. Then they plodded on. They seemed so repressed and unhappy. What would they have been learning, that hot afternoon?

Not rtft but I have a few questions. I couldn't home educate as I am the queen of procrastinating and on a lovely sunny day I'd hit the beach with dd

I think that's the point though, YOU CAN.

You only need a couple of hours a day on academic education, with 1:1 /smaller groups

Many on this thread have said their children can't flourish in the schools provided. Try not to be quite so insensitive to others situations.

Did you bother to read my post zzz, including the bit at the beginning where I took pains to point out how supportive I was of those who had genuine social, learning or medical reasons why mainstreaming schooling isn't for them? I was referring in my post to parents (who seem to make up rather a large cohort of HE'ers) who are jumping on the HE bandwagon as a bit of a fad rather than because of a specific need.really they just hang out all day with other tedious white middle class arseholes who look exactly like they do*

This is exactly my experience of HEers too. Much as they bang on about how marvellous and enriching they are and how wide their children's social circles are if they spend time with any other children it's the children of other HE'ers who are from HE groups who are the same class, race, have very similar politics and parenting philosophies and these groups would actively drum out anybody who doesn't conform. For a 'non-conformist' movement an awful lot of them seem deeply conformist to their own norms. I can always spot the HE groups in the park from what they're wearing. Especially the overpreponderance of goretex, home knits and cheesecloths and general unfriendliness towards anybody outside the coven.

I home educated my kids to age 9 for the eldest the others a bit younger..no pre school or whatever either...they've all sat a levels now and done exceptionally well, so at least I didn't hold them back in any way...we had/ have a child with a disability so he wasn't going to go to school.so we joined home ed groups for him,and it ended up with all of them home ed...they loved it,but I was totally burnt out.mental health down the toilet..so they had to go to school..I didn't give any time or attention to myself or my husband.i was mentally on my knees by the time they went to school.... and to various issues ,well their behaviour,I couldn't find a school to take them...we did eventually...once there ,they were bored in lessons ,as I'd already covered it at home.so the school was having to set them extra work to keep them busy..or...well anyway all turned out in the end..they have fond memories of our home ed time...but me ? No I never got a break in nearly 10 yrs..I just think..Christ I must of been mad

Of course if you sign up to school you have to follow their attendance guidelines, that's a no brainer. But you don't need that many hours at home, one on one.

Tbh if I lived in Sweden, I would probably feel very differently about school.

From another perspective, I was home educated. I was taken out of school at 7, returned at 11 for 2 years and then was removed again at 13, there were many reasons for my mum's decision, some in my best interests and some not. I'm now 30 so home Ed wasn't so common back then. In some respects home Ed was brilliant for me but in others it wasn't, mainly for the social aspect as if you are not part of any groups etc it's quite isolating. With regard to the level of education/possible hindrance to career/qualifications etc, I have never struggled to get a job. I began Work at 14, by 18 I was in pub management. At 20 I went back to retail management, had thirty staff and got flown to Spain for a year to launch the company over there. With regard to qualifications etc, I Sat gcse's at college a year later than others and then had a break from education although I was accepted for a levels. At 22 I did an access course and got into one of the top universities in the country.
For me, my home Ed wasn't structured and it suited me although that wouldn't necessarily be for everyone. The most negative aspect was the lack of social interaction. For that reason it isn't something I would choose for my daughter although there are clearly benefits.
All that really matters is that people do whatever is best for their children. I do firmly believe that there should be a lot more guidance for home educators and more checks should be made on parents at regular intervals but this is just my opinion.
Apologies for the essay!

I am the queen of procrastinating and on a lovely sunny day I'd hit the beach with dd

That would be a marvelous opportunity to build sandcastles, explore the coastline, go crabbing, eating a picnic lunch, buy an ice cream, the journey to the beach, read a book or colour on the beach etc.

Can you really not see ANY learning opportunity there?! HE doesn't mean you are tied to a desk for 5 hours of the day with half hour lunch and an hour's PE lesson (you know, how they are at school)

What could of made life easier ,was if home ed groups were more kind and considerate.my child's disability impacted greatly on his behaviour,and effected the younger one too...people saw his behaviour and judged ,without getting to know us ,or seeing what we had to cope with..they managed to make the odd friend at these groups.we went to about 3 all together over every 2 weeks....I often look back and think why did I keep going when they were so un friendly ..