To think DD isn't bright enough for university?

[AlisonJD1975]

There's lots of university threads at the moment so figured I'd ask.

DD is getting her results this week (Maths AS Level and Psychology and Sociology A Level). She failed her AS Level Maths so they said she could retake it as she was doing okay in the other subjects. She is expected to get a U in the AS Level Maths and Cs in the A Level Psychology and Sociology.

She has a conditional offer for an extended bachelors degree so it's 4 years long and she needs to get 2 Ds for that.

I'm just a bit worried that she won't really cope and I actually just feel quite sad. In life I really just want her to be happy and in a good job.

Psychology degrees can be varied, with some more science focused and other more theory minded. If her course is psychology with counselling, it is more likely to be the latter and she might be fine. If the first, it will be more oriented towards statistical analysis.

I struggle with maths for my A levels. I really enjoyed maths and was always the first to understand it, but when it came to exams, I would forget it all and then make stupid mistakes. I did manage to do quite well on the actual exam though.

I started to study business and then took a course in psychology and decided to change. I absolutely loved it! It was a science course though, so a bit anxious, but I had no problem at all and really enjoyed my statistics classes.

My biggest error was not to continue on to do a Masters. I tried, but finance need got in the way, started working and then couldn't get back into it. I'm now late 40s and so wish I'd become a psychologist. I tried to get back into it, but by then, I was earning a very good income and as a single mum couldn't afford to drop it.

Let your daughter do it. It's very common to see students really finding themselves as Uni because they feel under less pressure and enjoy the course work much better.

If it's a decent course at a decent uni then the foundation year could be good for bridging between a level and uni.

But, there are some degrees that aren't worth the paper they're written on. Some of my friends from college went to not so great unis to do courses that weren't professional & lacked academic depth and they're back doing the same college job so will never pay the loan off. Sort of annoys me.

Psychology degrees that have status are accredited by the BPS (British Psychological Spciety). For postgraduate training in specific fields you need BPS recognition or you have to pay postgraduate fees to do a conversion. Crucially, quite a lot of joint honours degrees in Psychology don't meet the criteria for BPS recognition. So she needs to see if the course has it otherwise she's wasting her time.

I got Cs and Ds in my A levels. I chose something I enjoyed at uni and was in a better place with nicer people when I began. I got a first because I actually enjoyed the subject

I got U's at A-level, left school, got experience and started a 4 year nursing degree with foundation year. Going into my 2year of under grad now without having failed a single module.

As long as she works she'll be fine.

I got A D N at school and went on to just miss getting a 1st at uni and now have a good job in my field at a managerial level.

This is not in psychology though, so couldn't comment on the course.

Psychology degrees that have status are accredited by the BPS (British Psychological Spciety). For postgraduate training in specific fields you need BPS recognition or you have to pay postgraduate fees to do a conversion. Crucially, quite a lot of joint honours degrees in Psychology don't meet the criteria for BPS recognition. So she needs to see if the course has it otherwise she's wasting her time

This is the most important thing on this thread if your dd wants to continue on to further training as a psychologist, make sure this course really does accredit her as a BPS member so she can go on to further study. To be a psychologist is a long path and that's the first step. Without BPS accreditation of your UG degree, then you can't become a chartered health psychologist or a clinical psychologist (which is what CAHMS would be)- all of which require many years and usually a further PhD. You can do, as the other poster said, a Masters in Psychology which gives you the accreditation after an UG degree but be prepared then that you would be paying for 5 years of study to achieve what most people are doing in three years.

That said, I don't believe in writing people off based on A levels, Maths A level is hard and you don't need to be brilliant at Maths to do Psychology, just competent and willing to work hard at statistics.

Dd1 got 2Cs and 2Ds in her A levels 5 yrs ago( she has dyslexia so found A levels v tough)....however got 2:1 in Philosophy, at top Uni last year ...just completed MSc in teaching English as foreign language at top red brick uni....she's off to teach abroad for a year the coming back to do a PhD in Linguistics ....she has blossomed at Uni .....give them wings and they will fly

You have to let her do this.
otherwise her whole life she will be Mum told me not to do it, if only.

University learning is different to A Level learning. Certainly when I did my undergrad, there were people at my uni with crap A Level results who did really well, and people with a clutch of As who couldn't cope with not being spoon fed anymore mainly from private schools who dropped out or got thirds.

That said, if her ultimate goal is clinical psychology that's incredibly difficult to get into and I'd definitely be encouraging her to keep an open mind about that.

I'd also try to find out how much maths is involved in the Psychology element of her degree, some involve a lot of statistics and the less mathematical students struggle.

In our local camhs there are psychogists, psychiatrists, nurses, speech and language therapists, occupational therapists and family therapists. Speech and language and occupational therapy are more vocational degrees. Maybe she could contact your local camhs and speak to someone about the options?

Agree support her to understand the route to becoming a psychologist- it is tough and competitive. The accreditation is key. Does she understand what it is she likes about the idea of being a psychologist? Or is it that psychology sounds sexy and exciting? It is quite maths focussed with lots of statistics.
Get her some work experience in CAMHS or other services for people with mental health problems. Get her shadowing a psychologist, a psychiatric nurse, a social worker to see how they differ. Psychiatric nursing might be a better route and offer a more secure future.

I wasn't very well in my final year of a levels and got a C and 2 Es. I was offered a foundation year followed by a degree which I thrived on and got a 2:1 from a good university (entry criteria for the degree was ABB). I found university really suited me more than a levels and was better than retaking a levels! I think she should go.

No employer has ever asked about the foundation year, it certainly hasn't held me back.

I think it depends where she goes. I've taught kids who have struggled to hit c or d grades for two years, then are suddenly getting 2.is or 1sts. Different story ten years ago.

I did really badly at AS levels so opted not to continue, went on to a BTEC instead which I passed and went on to graduate university with a 2:1 - she may just not be suited to A levels. I was like a duck in water on my university degree - it was hard work and obviously very academic (unlike the BTEC) but I loved it and did well.

If she is hardworking and very keen to follow a career in her degree then she should be fine.
My friend didn't get amazing A'levels (B's and C's) but desperately wanted to do medicine. Did a course with a foundation year and now is a Gp.
Good luck to her.

It sounds more like bad advice from you and bad decision making from her than that she isn't bright enough if she is getting Cs. Why the hell didn't you advise her to do something other than maths in her second year if she is getting a U??????? Why not something more arts or social science that she would have more aptitude for ?

Psychology is a growth area and you can't do it without a degree so it sounds like a sensible choice from her.

For a start, it would help if she knew whether she'd rather be a counsellor or a psychologist. Does she understand the difference between the two?

I am not sure why, but for some reason everybody acts like all 18 year olds have only 5 years left to live, as if it is some absolutely horrific thing to take a gap year or even (heaven forfend!) repeat a year because there just is no tiiiiime!. I'm not sure what this is - peer pressure, parental pressure, whatever - but it's very, very, VERY silly.

16 year olds sometimes make bad choices about their A-levels. My DH did. He thought he wanted to be a scientist, signed up for a bunch of maths and physics A-levels. He got a year in and realised that he hated it. Instead of continuing down a disastrous path, his parents gave him time and space to stop, reassess and switch courses to social sciences. He sailed through those A-levels, then a degree, MA, PhD. He's now a field-leading academic, made professor at 40.

Just because your DD is not good at maths doesn't mean she's not bright enough to succeed in a different area. I see kids come to university all the time having been good at one or two subjects through school. They generally don't have all-As. But once they are able to study just the thing they are interested in, verging on obsessed about, they tend to find their wings - sometimes more than kids who have been hot-housed and don't really have much of an innate passion for anything once parental and school pressure is removed.

Please DON'T force your kids to get to uni at 18 if they've had a rough time or made some choices that haven't turned out for them. Just because their friends are going does not mean the pressure is on them to go at precisely the same time - this is not keeping up with the Joneses stuff, it's their whole future. It's better to sort out the grades and the disciplinary struggles and go a year or two later at 19, even 20 having made the right choice than to go to do the wrong subject for the wrong reasons.

Speaking as a mental health nurse, if she wants a career in CAMHs then I think she needs to re-think her career plan. Without sounding harsh even if she does the psychology and counselling course, if she's planning on then becoming a clinical psychologist then if I'm brutally honest I don't think she would get in, especially if she doesn't have any experience working in mental health. When I last checked there was 3 applicants to every place, and they rarely take applicants who get less than a 1st and the course is very maths heavy. She could do counselling but it wouldn't necessarily get her into a CAMHS team. I'm possibly biased but I think she may want to consider mental health nurse training. It is a degree but it's 50% vocational placements and once she's qualified she will find it fairly straightforward to get a job (there's a national shortage of nurses, and mental health nurses in particular) and she can request to do placements in CAMHS and make contacts in that service that will help her secure a job in the future.

I can't believe this is the second thread, almost identical, of two parents questionning if their child is clever enough for uni!!! How about being supportive??!!!

There was a LOT of maths in Psychology when I did it

I don't think comments about the amount of maths are helpful, what type of maths is it? Engineering maths involves a lot of complex numbers and matrices for instance which is a wold away from statistics.

I have no idea about the type of maths in psychology.

Wave her off with a smile of encouragement. If she's not up to it she won't be able to progress beyond the Foundation year, so a year of loans only. She may well surprise you and do great of course...

2 D's here (taken in 1 year) sociology and general studies

2:1 from a red brick and a masters degree ...

so yeah she might prove you wrong!

If she wants to work in CAMHS she doesn't have to be a clinical psychologist... There are many different roles. Clinical psychology doctorate's after very competitive and some do take into account A level results as entry requirements (she would not get onto those course with those grades). Those courses that don't use A levels often require a good 2i or some other indication of academic ability (masters). As others say make sure the course is accredited by BPS and then she's got options.