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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To ask how I best support this friend who is marrying a functioning alcoholic who makes her miserable?

26 replies

BasinHaircut · 06/08/2017 21:11

Just that really. I can't say 'what the fuck are you doing, this is a mistake' and I struggle to get excited about the wedding because I don't think it's what is right for her. I also struggle to get on with her fiancé because of the things she tells me (how he treats her).

I think if I am honest it's a psychologically/emotionally abusive relationship but I think that it's unintentional IYSWIM because it's because of alcohol.

I don't know what I'm trying to say really but I'm struggling with this because I need to be there for her but hate it.

Not sure if this is even making sense

OP posts:

Bagel88 · 06/08/2017 21:17

Maybe he makes her happy. Why be so judgemental?

pigeondujour · 06/08/2017 21:21

Ignore that, OP.

I would say that first sentence in slightly politer words. I really would. She might need 'permission'.

TheEgregiousPeach · 06/08/2017 21:35

If you are her friend and think she is making a bad choice then please tell her. It's better to say it now then wait for it all to go tits up and then tell her you had misgivings.
I get that it's a hard position to be in though as you don't want to hurt her. But then you don't want him to either.

FusionChefGeoff · 06/08/2017 21:42

Does she think he's an alcoholic?

I think it's definitely worth trying to say something to her to ask if she's really willing to get into this and all it will involve.

If there's any way you can get her to go to an Al Anon meeting - they are there to support family of alcoholics and it could give her a) some identification to help realise if he is or is on the road to alcoholism and b) show her what lies ahead as alcoholics get worse, much worse usually, before they are ready to ask for help and c) give her some coping strategies / techniques

Flopjustwantscoffee · 06/08/2017 21:49

I think you should tell her, once, and then continue to support her regardless of what she does, I had a similar situation with a friend (not an alcoholic fiancée but there were other issues and there was a lot of drama before the wedding). I did, as nicely as I knew how, remind her that it wasn't too late to call of the wedding and ask if she really wanted to go through with it because I knew she had complained about x,y,z. I later found out other friends had said similar to her. It didn't make any difference and they did marry, although were divorced within six months, but I would have felt bad if I hadn't said anything. And if she is a good friend I think you should say what you think in a once and forever hold your peace kind of way...

Flopjustwantscoffee · 06/08/2017 21:52

ANd re-reading I've realized how incredibly judgmental my post makes me sound. It wasn't like that at all, all of the reservations I (and it turned out others) had came from things she'd said/hinted at (e.g. His philandering, getting jealous of her etc) plus the really fast pace of their relationship. I think so long as you don't say "I told you so" later if (when) it all goes tits up it's fine to say your piece once.

CockacidalManiac · 06/08/2017 21:55

She has to make her own decisions, but you're within your rights to warn her about it. That's what supportive friends do. It's difficult, though. People generally don't want to hear it.
Serious at Bagel88

Loopytiles · 06/08/2017 21:58

Fine to tell her you are worried, think she is making a mistake. Also, don't assume the emotional abuse is due to the alcohol problem: he might be an emotionally abusive person AND have an alcohol problem.

BamburyFuriou3 · 06/08/2017 21:59

I married someone totally unsuited to me. noone said a word to me as they didn't want to interfere.
10 wasted broken years later I wish they bloody had, and had cared enough to voice their concerns.

Probably you will do wrong whatever you do so go with what your conscience and gut is telling you to do.

Original poster

BasinHaircut · 07/08/2017 07:05

Thanks all.

I'm not sure I can say anything outright to her. I don't want her to stop confiding in me as I think she needs the outlet (I'm not sure who else she tells this stuff to, it's possibly just me), and I want to know if it was to get to a point where I thought she wasn't safe.

I have gently asked before if she is actually happy and she is very vague. I think she is happy that she is engaged, and that she is getting married and can therefore have a baby soon (not that I think you can't have a child out of wedlock, but this is her plan), but in an ideal world if she is honest she wouldn't be marrying him, and also that she would have been married 5-10 years ago and wouldn't be the last in our friendship group to do marriage/kids as that definitely bothers her.

It's so hard, they have been together for almost ten years and whist he probably hasn't changed much in that time (I.e grown up, drinks the same amount etc), the rest of us have lives that are not compatible with being out socialising (drinking) more nights a week than not. she has wanted to move on to the next phase of her life for years and he has always resisted.

Now he has proposed and she is happy about that but I think she expects that he will become a run of the mill mid-thirties guy who wants to parent, have dinner parties, stop going straight to the pub from the office, not have to guess what time he will be home and what state he will be in etc. But thats unlikely isn't it?

I think she knows he is an alcoholic but won't admit it to herself. We have had a chat about that before (sort of).

OP posts:

Littlecaf · 07/08/2017 07:28

As others have said, mention it once, then be there if it breaks down later. That is all you can do.

redsquirrel2 · 07/08/2017 08:46

You really do need to say something. You're not being judgemental, you're being concerned for her welfare. And the welfare of a possible future child/children. If he's emotionally abusive now, imagine how much worse it could be with the pressure of children too. And more than just her life being messed up. If he really is an alcoholic and doesn't do anything about it, alcohol will always be the most important thing to him. Not her. Not their children. I know, I've seen it happen. She shouldn't marry someone who makes her miserable anyway. It's a recipe for utter disaster.

redsquirrel2 · 07/08/2017 08:47

You're a good friend to be so concerned by the way. Good luck.

Original poster

BasinHaircut · 07/08/2017 13:57

red I hear you. I really do. I've been thinking.

I think next time she tells me that something has happened (I.e. There has been a drinking related incident/argument) I'm going to say something like 'I'm going to ask this only once because you are my dear friend and I love you, and I will accept your answer, but are you happy with him?'

I just need to make sure that I don't shut down that avenue of communication for her. She does vent to me and I need her to keep doing that so I know (sort of) what's going on.

OP posts:

Zaphodsotherhead · 07/08/2017 14:03

Is there anything you could give her to read that might help her? I've never been in this situation so may be talking rubbish, but I've often found that words and advice go in better when someone can process them in their own time.

So, for example, if AA do a booklet on coping with an alcoholic partner or WA have something, do you think she might take it better if you gave it to her to read? So she could, sort of, 'pretend' she hadn't read it and didn't need it, but might just take a look and see that she has options? You could put it to her in a 'oh, I was just reading this and there's some good advice on dealing with (a situation that you know she's had) and hope she reads the rest?

KimmySchmidt1 · 07/08/2017 14:14

I think rather than expressing your opinion (dear God I shudder to think what some of my friends would say to the question "would you like to marry my husband") but focus more on asking her questions about how she feels and why she does things. that will help her work through her feelings and is more likely to bring her to own conclusion one way or the other than you expressing your view of him, which is ultimately personal.

so next time she mentions any of these problems, ask her "why do you stay with him?" "where do you see this ending up?" "do you want him to change?" "have you raised these feelings with him directly?"

It is how a therapist would help someone talk things through, and is much more relevant and fruitful than expressing your view. Plus it cannot really backfire on you or your friendship with her.

echt · 07/08/2017 14:19

When is the wedding? Advice here seems to lean on when she next mentions his fuck-ups, which she may not.

Hang on. Read the updates. Fuck it. Tell her. You are not responsible for her reactions.

jeaux90 · 07/08/2017 14:21

Ask her a different question.

What kind of father do you think he'll make?

Original poster

BasinHaircut · 07/08/2017 14:59

I have tried asking questions but I try really hard not to be too direct and give the game away.

I know partly why she stays with him already. She thinks that she has invested too much of her life in the relationship to walk away. She questions where she would live, or how group social situations would work if they weren't together.

kimmy I think some of my friends would've horrified at the thought of being married to my DH too. But for all of his faults (the sock destroying, wet towel leaving, important document mislaying idiot that he is), he is 100% behind me and puts me and DS before everything.

I don't dislike her partner because we have had a disagreement or anything like that. I only struggle to like him because of the things she tells me. Of course I don't know the good bits of their relationships, but to me it speaks volumes that there doesn't ever seem to be anything nice to say!

OP posts:

JessicaEccles · 07/08/2017 15:05

This happened with my best friend. I ended up blurting it out (under sever provocation) - and she chose to go back to him. It really dented our friendship.

And then the bastard died. . Which made things even worse- as she knew what I really thought of him, and she was grieving him. Along with all his pub mates, who went on about what a great bloke he was. (He wasn't).

Neutrogena · 07/08/2017 15:24

No-one really knows what goes on in anyone's relationships. They have their own dynamics which is impossible for an outsider to decipher.

I'd have a 'serious' chat with her, tell her you love her and support her no matter what, and then say "I could well be wrong but I don't think X puts you first. X puts alcohol first and that concerns me. Do you adore him and do you truly believe he adores you?"

Then shut up and listen.

insurmuntable · 07/08/2017 15:40

You may want to think about how to avoid becoming a dumping ground for all her dp-related issues and incidents. It is a hard line to tread when you want to be supportive to avoid being the pressure valve that allows her to continue in this dysfunctional relationship. After being that person for her for a while you may become resentful and sad because you hear all the worst things about this situation, you're dead set against it but you're utterly powerless.

My mum had a friend who was having an affair. The friend was always waiting for this arsehole to become her partner so she stopped doing anything constructive for herself and her future. After years of hearing about how miserable it made her (biological clock ticking, no partner on the horizon, this bastard gave her genital warts etc etc) my mum got tired of being a sympathetic ear/advice giver/emotional dumping ground and decided to reply with 'How can I help?' as often as necessary. The friend didn't know how to answer as she had been ignoring/rejecting my mother's help for years.

I know you want to be a good supportive friend but give some thought to at what point you become her enabler, just as she is enabling her dp.

It's hard to watch the people we care about make terrible mistakes. Good luck.

Electrolux2 · 07/08/2017 15:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

VladmirsPoutine · 07/08/2017 16:05

Tell her exactly what you think and be prepared to be shot down. It might make the end of your relationship with her but you can't just say nothing. If she chooses to ignore you and cut you out then so be it. If it actually works out with them then so be it but you can't stand back and say nothing and watch the train crash unfold.

I've been in this position twice. Once I said something and just like I'd told her it all fell apart when she was 2 kids in and pregnant with the 3rd. She was also in a different country and couldn't come back home because he'd forbade her from leaving the country with his kids. The second time they did work it out and even though she's still abused - he's a millionaire so she can live with all his shortcomings.

It's hard to watch but only you can decide where your own lines are drawn. Is it worth losing a potential friend?

Loopytiles · 07/08/2017 16:06

You could suggest Al Anon. The relationship could be codependent. Allowing her to "vent" with no challenge might not actually help her.

The question isn't just whether she loves and is happy with him, it's whether she wants to be married to and have DC with someone with an unacknowledged, serious alcohol problem.

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