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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

#refugewomen. Ceiling collapse in womens refuge.

78 replies

HelenaDove · 31/07/2017 01:51

I think this may have been partially resolved now but am sharing it here so MNers on twitter can retweet if they wish to .

HelenaDove Mon 31-Jul-17 01:43:20
From FB but is on twitter #refugewomen

"Need help from my journalist/blogger/legal friends. I am currently in a women's refuge in central London managed by Notting Hill Housing Trust. Last night our ceiling crashed in. Luckily no one was seriously injured but there are 7 vulnerable families living here who have fled domestic violence (8 children in total) and we have no electricity and cannot access our rooms/belongings due to flooding. Kensington and Chelsea are attempting to move us out of London tonight. We are all refusing to leave because we know that it means we will out for good. Can anyone help/advise/spread about what is happening here. From 7 desperate women."
Add message | Report | Message poster HelenaDove Mon 31-Jul-17 01:44:20
" We have been told that if we stay here and die (due to fire) then it is our fault and housing association will take no responsibility, despite the fact that where they are trying to house us is a danger area for a few of the residents here"

OP posts:

CosmicPineapple · 31/07/2017 07:12

13 surely it is the council that are endangering the children and the women?

They have a duty of care towards these very vulnerable people and all they (women and children) are asking for is accomodation in the same area. Considering the horrors they have already been through I can completely understand why they are desperate to stay where they are.

sparechange · 31/07/2017 07:17

I don't understand why this is K&C's fault?

If the women are originally from Barking, but are temporarily in K&C (refuge suggests not a long term-solution) then how do they have such strong links to the borough that they can't move elsewhere?

Notting Hill Housing is a HA totally independent of K&C council, so it also makes no sense to blame the council for the state of their housing stock

sooperdooper · 31/07/2017 07:18

Aren't their jobs, support network and children's schools likely to be in the same areas as their alleged abusers?

I'd have thought it quite likely that you leave the area and 'life' behind or not. Which one is it?

This, surely being moved elsewhere is going to be safer in the long run? Surely the area they've known is the same area the partners they're fleeing from are in

13ReasonsWhy · 31/07/2017 07:22

CosmicPineapple

No. The council want to move them to a safe building and the women refuse to leave.

Maybe someone should have been responsible for ensuring the collapsing ceiling problem shouldn't have arisen but who knows. Certainly not you and I.

I can see that moving them back to an area with the alleged abuser is an awful idea but blaming the council and expecting a range of emergency accommodation is as ridiculous as refusing to leave an unsafe building. The difference is that these women have been through a lot and are unlikely to be thinking straight.

TheWitchAndTrevor · 31/07/2017 07:26

Aren't their jobs, support network and children's schools likely to be in the same areas as their alleged abusers

I'd have thought it quite likely that you leave the area and 'life' behind or not. Which one is it?

They have already left everything to go to a refuge. They are starting their lives again. But are now under threat of having to do it all again and some of them in the area the abusers are.

They are shit scared for their lives and their children's. They am feel safe from their abusers where they are .

CosmicPineapple · 31/07/2017 07:28

No. The council want to move them to a safe building and the women refuse to leave.

Where is this safe building?

despite the fact that where they are trying to house us is a danger area for a few of the residents here"

The council will of course know this ^^ yet the safety of these women and children is clearly not their concern. They do not want the responsibility of them dying on their patch but care not if they are murdered as long as it is out of their area.

13ReasonsWhy · 31/07/2017 07:36

CosmicPineapple

Where is this safe building?

I think it would be quite stupid for addresses to be posted but the OP says "Kensington and Chelsea are attempting to move us out of London tonight.". Isn't it safe to assume that these buildings are likely safer than the one with collapsing ceilings?

They do not want the responsibility of them dying on their patch but care not if they are murdered as long as it is out of their area.

Quite an assumption to make based on what little we all know. Do you have extra information you're keeping from the rest of us or are you just guessing?

CosmicPineapple · 31/07/2017 07:43

13 obviously i do not expect to know the location of the building if you read the next part of my post it was a quote from one of the women pointing out that the new building is in an unsafe area for a few of them.

As for my assumption well its just that. MY assumption. Given that the new place is in an unsafe area and the council have not offered an alternative i can only assume it is because they do not care about the safety of these women if they did they would not put them in danger would they?

Notreallyarsed · 31/07/2017 07:49

I really don't like the undertone that women escaping abuse should just be grateful for anywhere they're given. Surely as a society we should be making sure that the level of upheaval to families escaping abuse is as low as humanly possible, and be doing everything we can to ensure that the women and their children feel safe and protected.
I despair at the lack of empathy.

CosmicPineapple · 31/07/2017 07:51

13 it is quite clear you have little experience of DV and even less sympathy for the victims of DV.

I have seen what these men do and I have seen the fear they create. It is very real. Ask yourself what horrors these women are running from if they would choose an unsafe building rather than risk being sent back to an area where they can be found?

Do you not think the council should be supporting them better or is taking them from the lions den and dumping them in a viper pit acceptable and all they deserve

Notreallyarsed · 31/07/2017 07:53

Well said Cosmic! I was lucky in that my family were in a position to finance my escape, and make sure DS1 and I had somewhere safe to be. These women don't have that luxury, and it is a luxury. You clearly have no idea of the strength and courage it takes to escape, and to have the little security they had whipped away and arbitrary decisions made based on funding rather than human need is awful.

Notreallyarsed · 31/07/2017 07:54

Sorry the you I meant was 13 not you Cosmic

CaoNiMartacus · 31/07/2017 07:59

Hopefully once this becomes more widely known about, there will be a similar outpouring of public generosity as there was for Grenfell.

But there won't be. Because women are at the very bottom of the pile.

BabsGanoush · 31/07/2017 08:07

I work loosely with Womens Aid in the North, and they often get women and children from all over the country when their local refuge is full, It is an absolute priority for all (WA, SS,Police etc) to get the children back to their areas, or as close as possible when a space becomes available.

K&C and neighbouring authorities are going to be short of accommodation obviously, but these women will not be dumped and forgotten. They WILL be in a place of safety.

They aren't doing themselves any favours.

CosmicPineapple · 31/07/2017 08:21

They WILL be in a place of safety.

But according to the tweet the new safe building is in area that is not safe for some of the women. So how can your above statement be true?

I imagine their reluctance to leave the area is not just down to safety. They will all be on that councils list for housing and the second they move out of that area they will be off the list and lose their place/priority. They will then have to register on the new areas housing list potentially given a lower banding/be further down the list and will have to start the bidding process again.

They will also have to access new healthcare services, support networks, schooling and inform their work places/benefits office and banks of the new address.

These women are already under immense amounts of stress and are trying to put their lives back together. Imagine having to do all of the above while fearing for your safety and coping with the mental trauma of domestic violence.

user1497557435 · 31/07/2017 08:23

Cos they're generally flipping terrified?
Ever been systematically bashed about OP?

13ReasonsWhy · 31/07/2017 08:23

CaoNiMartacus Yes. There were only men living in Greenfell. Middle class, white, CIS, straight men.

Cosmic You know what they say about assuming ...

Notreallyarsed I don't think there are arbitrary decisions being made. As someone rightly guessed, like most of us I have no direct experience of domestic abuse. I don't have a lack of empathy for these women but I do doubt whether they are best placed to make decisions as to if the building is safe to stay in.

It's good that someone who actually works with women and families like the subject of this thread (BabsGanoush) says that they will be returned to the area (perhaps not, given that posters here say they shouldn't be) and that the women aren't about to be dumped and forgotten.

I am still confused though. Should these families be rehomed near their 'areas' or moved away from their alleged abusers?

Strugglingmumbot · 31/07/2017 08:30

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Notreallyarsed · 31/07/2017 08:30

They've been moved to K&C area, where they will have accessed health services, schooling, MH/DV services. Are we really saying that they're to be expected to start all over again in a completely new area? I cannot overstate how distressing, disorientating and difficult that will be.
Having just started all over again in a place of safety, for that place to become unsafe, and to face the prospect of having to do it all over again.
13 you said you have no experience of DV, which means anything you are saying is an assumption. I'm glad you have no experience of it, I only wish more women could say the same, it is a truly horrific experience. And I had a hell of a lot of RL support, which many women don't.

Strugglingmumbot · 31/07/2017 08:33

like most of us I have no direct experience of domestic abuse

Actually I think you'll find most women DO have direct experience of domestic abuse.

CosmicPineapple · 31/07/2017 08:39

13 no what do they say?

If you are going to quote the very pathetic childish saying don't bother it will only make you look worse.

Should these families be rehomed near their 'areas' or moved away from their alleged abusers?

They are already away from their abusers the term their areas is most likley the new area they now live in and have started to rebuild their life. See above my above post regarding housing and healthcare.

The women know the building is not safe to stay in but the alternative is much worse as far as they are concerned.

You have alluded twice now about these women being unable to make decisions themselves but you are saying they should trust a council whos idea of support is to put them in an area that is deemed unsafe as it is back with their abusers for some of them.
Would you trust sonebody that wanted to knowingly put you in danger 13 ?

13ReasonsWhy · 31/07/2017 08:41

Strugglingmumbot

Not sure why you resorted to childish insults.

Womens aid (a charity who's existence depends on domestic abuse so we need to acknowledge potential bias) says that 28% of women have direct experience of domestic abuse.

I have no idea why you're trying to suggest a majority of women are abused but it certainly doesn't help the minority who are victims.

Notreallyarsed

It's a terrible situation and it's being made worse by the problems with the refuge. All I have said (and been told to piss off for daring to have a different opinion) is that staying put with your children, in a dangerous building, doesn't seem like the right move.

CosmicPineapple · 31/07/2017 08:51

Not sure why you resorted to childish insults.

Maybe because struggling is upset and your ignorance at the suffering and fear surrounding DV caused her to lash out.
PAs are against mn rules but I can understand why she said what she said. Its a shame you lack the empathy to do so 13.

Strugglingmumbot · 31/07/2017 08:52

What you've said on this thread is much more offensive that what I said to you, however much you might dress it up as simply a difference of opinion.

Report me if you want

Oriunda · 31/07/2017 09:08

In our local area we have a Facebook page set up by an amazing friend of mine (who herself experienced life in a refuge when she was a child). We source items for families who arrive at a group of refuges in London, run by Hestia, often with nothing. Clothes for women and children, toys, buggies etc. Other items are bought for them via Amazon wish lists.

Often it's the small things that make a difference between them staying in the refuge or returning home. Having new underwear, for example.

Hestia do an amazing job, but with very little resources. I hope they manage to sort something out for these ladies.

If anyone would like to support the work my friend does, she has a range of t-shirts and sweatshirts which are both fabulous and totally not for profit, with all proceeds going to this group of refuges so they can support these ladies. womeninneedlondon.com/

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