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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

DH in court over train ticket

263 replies

user1497444078 · 12/07/2017 11:54

Apologies is advance for an essay. More of a WWYD than an Aibu.

DH commutes to work via train daily. Train is at 6:15 so he always purchases a ticket off the conductor (no means of buying at station before 6:30) and always by card.

Several month ago the card machine wasn't working and the conductor told DH he would need to pay a fine for 'failure to buy a ticket'. He had no ID and was asks to write his name and address down (which he did), but after a month and no news we forgot all about it.

We then moved house.

On Monday this week we received a letter saying he failed to meet a court date for 'evasion and refusal to pay for a ticket' and now needs to pay £700. They must sent letters to previous address which we never received.

DH had to go to court today and was advised if he pleads not guilty to the evasion and refusal to pay charge he would have to go to court and pay court fees and most likely the refusal to pay charge. If he pleads guilty however he was told he would need to pay original ticket plus a small fine.

DH is fuming as he never refused to pay, the card machine wasn't working. He has proof money sufficient money was in the account on that day, and proof of change of address, but says he will have to plead guilty as it will be cheaper/less hassle. DH is also questioning why he was so honest to write to down his real name/address as it's given us unnecessary hassle.

At 19weeks into first pregnancy I can really do without this stress.

So WWYD in this situation? Is it worth contacting the papers to highlight the injustice? Maybe I'm just hormonal. I know some ppl will argue he should have bought ticket in advance, but he has done the same routine on daily commutes for 5years+.

OP posts:
Vermillionrouge · 12/07/2017 15:39

Don't plead guilty. It might seem minor but it it is a criminal conviction which might have repercussions in other areas. They have to show intention not to pay to succeed in a prosecution. He gave his real name and address (you'll have to explain why no post awarding from the old address but can argue that if had received the claim for payment in a timely fashion he would have paid it) so can use that as evidence that he did intend to pay.

ProseccoBitch · 12/07/2017 15:39

@witsender the OP said that they have moved house since he gave his address.

Giraffey1 · 12/07/2017 15:41

Could he not have bought a ticket at his destination? I've had to do this a few times when the station ticket machine wasn't working and there was no on-train inspector. But he can't respond to letters he didn't receive, so I'd follow e advice others have given on challenging this.

kw1091 · 12/07/2017 15:44

I had the exact same problem. Happened in my last year of uni and so I moved home and didn't receive letters. I even tried to purchase the ticket at my destination and they wouldn't let me. Ended up in court and because it was such a huge hassle I ended
Up paying the £500 just to have it over and done with. I'm still pissed off about it 3 years later!!!!! It's ridiculous the situation couldn't be avoided and I ended up in trouble for it.

PurplePeppers · 12/07/2017 15:46

giraffey RTFT
because there are no ticket office on the other station either.
Small stations, small trains.

PurplePeppers · 12/07/2017 15:47

wits because the address he gave was the right one but they MOVED house in between so never received the letter.

OlennasWimple · 12/07/2017 15:47

It's crazy that I can buy a plane ticket to another country online and get a mobile boarding pass sent straight to my phone, but I have to buy a bit of paper to travel 10 minutes down the line on the train

wheatchief · 12/07/2017 15:49

PurplePeppers if there are absolutely no ticket facilities at either station it's unlikely it would be a penalty fare area.

ExConstance · 12/07/2017 15:50

When the ticket machine isn't working at our small rural unmanned station ( regular situation) and the train manager doesn't get far enough through the train to sell me a ticket I go straight to the office at the destination station and explain the situation and buy one there. You can't get through the barrier at that particular station without doing that. Your DH did evade the fare unless he tried to pay at his destination.

Original poster
user1497444078 · 12/07/2017 15:53

Notanurse

He was told today if he plead not guilty he would have to go to another hearing and potentially face paying the whole charge and most likely a fine of some sort, but if he plead guilty he would just pay original ticket, a small fine, and it after a year there would be no trace of it on his record.

That's his understanding but tbf we received the letter Monday and desperate to resolve this he was in court today and working in between so not sufficiently clued up as we should be. Think he panicked a little.

He is an honest man. If he was the regular fair dodger as many suggest why would he give his correct name and address in the first place? If he'd lied nobody would have chased this up and he wouldn't be in this pickle.

OP posts:
OnionKnight · 12/07/2017 15:55

You can't get through the barrier at that particular station without doing that. Your DH did evade the fare unless he tried to pay at his destination.

There was no barrier or a way to get a ticket at the destination.

Mulledwine1 · 12/07/2017 15:59

If he pleads guilty he will have a conviction on his record. Yes things get spent but they never completely disappear and for certain jobs/volunteer roles you would have to disclose it.

If it really is an issue of letters going astray, plead not guilty.

And contact Passenger Focus as I suggested earlier.

Starsandwishes · 12/07/2017 16:03

I just want to know the out come ?

ExConstance · 12/07/2017 16:04

Sorry, hadn't twigged that he couldn't have bought at the destination. Surely the ticket collector on the train would have offered some advice about what to do?

maddening · 12/07/2017 16:11

Note to self - if.in such a situation get a signed statement from the train guard

sheldonesque · 12/07/2017 16:12

My tin hat has slipped over my eyes.

So instead of being able to type out what you could do, all I can manage to type is 'stop being such a nippy bonbon'

Love, Maigret. x

lalalalyra · 12/07/2017 16:16

If the OP's DH gets a significant discount from something like a railcard then that would make buying a season pass pointless. Here a season pass saves you about 10-15% whereas a disabled persons railcard saves 30%.

I think some posters forget not everyone lives in a big place. Our station is only manned from 9am-1pm and the ticket machine on the platform rarely works. Before you get to bknow r next big town there are another 4 stops with no office and just (very) temperamental ticket machines so most people buy on the train still.

OlennasWimple · 12/07/2017 16:18

Surely the key thing here is that if you hadn't moved house, you would have received the original letter asking you to pay the ticket + fine

I would be going to court to say that I didn't intentionally evade the request to pay up. Because I would want it done and dusted and can afford it, I would pay the ticket+fine, but not the huge additional fine for failing to cough up when requested by letter.

What exactly is he being asked to plead guilty to? Not paying in the first place, or subsequently failing to pay?

MrsF1 · 12/07/2017 16:20

Roomba and TshoTsho are absolutely correct. He needs to go to the Magistrates Court and make a Statutory Declaration. He didn't give any false details, nor did he try to evade the fare. He was unaware of the initial court proceedings so a Stat Dec is the correct way forward.

CeeceeBloomingdale · 12/07/2017 16:41

You moved house and didn't redirect mail so missed the original correspondence? That's your error.

However how did they know your new address to send the letter that arrived on Monday?

reetgood · 12/07/2017 16:57

@floggingmolly these mythical stations tend to be surburban stops in large cities. The one near me, in a city of 750,000, doesn't have a ticket office at all. It has been turned into offices. It does have a ticket machine (on the opposite platform which means a dash on the underpass), but if that's out of order you have to buy on the train. I've never had a problem as the ticket inspector recognises that the route runs through several unmanned stations.

@exconstance when I had a similar experience the ticket collector's card machine was broken and he couldn't seem to take on board that whilst I had enough in cash to get a permit to travel, I was expecting to be able to purchase a ticket on card as I did every other day. It took about 5 minutes and other passengers intervening before he decided to comprehend that under the conditions of travel I wasn't liable for a fine. This was a suburban London station years back.

BambooSticks · 12/07/2017 17:03

So what happened when your DH attended court today, OP? Did he plead guilty? If so, to what offence and what was the fine imposed?

It's useful to know about the Stat Dec but it seems unlikely that is available to anyone who has already appeared in court and pleaded guilty.

guinea36 · 12/07/2017 17:32

Not everyone can afford to buy a season ticket upfront.
I think that's a bit of a red herring anyway.

PigletWasPoohsFriend · 12/07/2017 17:35

However how did they know your new address to send the letter that arrived on Monday?

Good point.

Pipkinhartley · 12/07/2017 17:35

OP, just go back up thread and take the advice provided by @Roomba and @mrsF1.
See here: www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/criminal/docs/october-2015/tsm001-eng.pdf

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