To ask if you decided not to vaccinate your children

[Mintpepper]

Do you regret it? Did they catch any of the diseases that they could have been vaccinated for and what was the outcome?

And anyone who did get their children vaccinated - did they catch any of the diseases anyway? And do you regret vaccinating for any reason?

This isn't intended to start a debate for or against vaccination generally as that's been done many times, I'm more just interested in your personal experiences if you'd be willing to share them. Thank you.

Compulsory vaccination would just take choice away from poorer families

It would take away the choice from all families to put their children at risk. There is no amount of money you could pay to get away with not vaccinating.

And again, shame on you for using poor families as a propaganda tool. IME they aren't the ones "researching" bullshit and refusing vaccinations.

"Petals. No. Post whatever it is publicly."

No right back at you. I'll not bother answering your questions in future.

"There is no amount of money you could pay to get away with not vaccinating."

Yes there is. As has been demonstrated in countries that already have compulsory vaccination - Australia, USA, Italy (although new in the last one.

"shame on you for using poor families as a propaganda tool."

No one is doing this. We are giving you valid examples of why compulsory vaccination does not work, and has not worked in other places.

DD is vaccinated. I blindly do whatever the NHS tells me to... Seeing as they're the ones I will be trusting to look after DD if God forbid she does catch any diseases.
I always wonder why people who don't vaccinate trust doctors for some things (say treating their kids for measles), but not for other things (advice to prevent measles).

"It would take away the choice from all families to put their children at risk."

No it wouldn't. Families with money would just send their children to private schools and find other work arounds.

For interest, this is what Petals pmed me. It is from 1994.

Families with money can afford to go without the financial incentive (Australia) and pay the fines (Italy).

In both cases - neither vaccination schedule has targetted the populations that need it most - TSI&A in Australia and GTR in Italy. Australia has not seen 100% vaccine uptake in the year it's happened as wealthy people don't need the financial incentive and the TSI&A population find it incredibly difficult to access health care (though most desperately want the financial incentive - they rarely have health records, and when they do they are often chaotic and across clinics).

TSI&A children in Australia are 16 times more likely to die from pneumonia - that's the population we should be targeting for vaccinations.

No it wouldn't. Families with money would just send their children to private schools and find other work arounds

Don't exempt private schools. It's not hard.

What about children that don't go to school? What about child immigrants who can't access services? What about refugees?

In the case of Australia, don't you think it would be better to have used the financial incentive that's being dished out to provide additional health care to reach TSI&A populations so they could have the chance to vaccinate their children?

Private schools get to chose who they take. It's not based on vaccinations. Even in Italy they can accept non-vaccinated children (as can public schools too actually).

I also, personally, feel very strongly about denying a child access to education for a choice that is not theirs, when research has shown us that education is the single biggest indicator of health in later life.

We are talking mothers who receive longer periods of education having healthier pregnancies and births, we are talking decreases in the rates of diabetes between having a high school education and going to university, we are talking a huge increase in life expectancy for people with university degrees.

Compulsory vaccination is not the way forward (its not reccommended by the WHO); particularly when we deny those that need the biggest helping hand in life (the at risk populations for VPDs) a chance to engage in an education system.

Ah, libertarianism, empower poor people with the right to make shit anti social decisions as well as rich people.

Most fervent antivaxers I've had the misfortune to meet can't afford either private school or home school.

Why would you not want to give poor people the same choices as rich people?

Talk about inequality. You can educate and inform both parties without resulting to name calling and insults.

Clalpolly

Petal - prove it.

I know you aimed this at petal, but I have medical records for myself and for my DD (not my bio child) showing how close we've both come to death due to vaccine induced allergic reactions. I spent days by my child's bedside in ICU, wondering whether my decision to follow the science was going to kill my child.

No drug, vaccine or procedure is 100% safe - why are people so much more willing to accept that penicillin can have death as a side effect than a vaccine? Thankfully it's rare, but that's cold comfort to those of use facing the hard truth that vaccines are dangerous to us and/or our children.

The BMA recently published a report on compulsory vaccination and concluded that compulsory vaccination should not be introduced in the UK. While they agree that vaccination should be recommended to parents they felt that the doctor-patient relationship in this country is based on "trust, choice and openness" and that compelling parents to vaccinate would undermine this. Given that the UK already has high vaccination uptake rates, this seems like a pointless risk to take that is fairly likely to backfire (quite apart from all the ethical questions).

Andro, I am genuinely very sorry that you had this experience. It must have been terrible.

Why would you not want to give poor people the same choices as rich people?

You appear to have missed the point, which is to give neither rich or poor people the choice to neglect their children by not protecting them with vaccines.
Nothing unequal about it.

My DC was adopted as an infant from an orphanage in an African country. There was a measles outbreak and a number of other babies in the nursery room died. By some miracle my DC did not catch it. Vaccinated as soon as possible and feel very grateful & fortunate to have done it.

So we have now got "Autism or Death", "Akin to drink driving" and "Child neglect" ... Lovely. Pretty disgusting to now minimise child neglect.

Not vaccinating a child is not child neglect, unless it is in a wider provision of not providing / accessing health care for a child.

I can't think of one case where children have been removed from their parents care due to their parents not vaccinating them (solely, actually I can't think of one case where it has been named as a contributing factor).

It doesn't minimise it all. It IS neglect to deny a child medical access and protection.
Sorry you can't see that.

"The BMA recently published a report on compulsory vaccination and concluded that compulsory vaccination should not be introduced in the UK. "

This is exactly what the WHO say too.

, actually I can't think of one case where it has been named as a contributing factor

You not knowing about it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

Interesting that some seem happy to take the advice of medical experts when deciding which vaccinations to have for their children, but happy to dismiss their advice when it comes to compulsory vaccination.

Much as I hold unreasonable anti-vaxxers in contempt, I am not in favour of compulsory vaccination.
Not sure children who are unvaccinated (for no good reason) should be allowed in state schools, though. I opt out of society apart from the bits I opt into