To consider cutting off a friend?

[thishousewontcleanitself]

Truly interested in your opinions here.

Following on from emkana's 'perfect' thread, I have a friend who is currently driving me up the wall, and I would love to not have to see her or her dd anymore, but I feel very guilty about it.

We were pg together and our children went to the same playgroup. She's lovely, we get on very well as adults, but when it comes to our dcs, well...

Basically, she has a 'child genius' daughter. Now, I know we all think our dcs are the best, but she shoves it down my throat the whole time. This kid is 3 months older than ds (2.1) and yes, is very advanced - can speak 'proper' sentences, draws circles, squares and triangles, knows all the letters of the alphabet and their phonic sounds as well, can count to twenty...

I don't think I'd mind any of this if she was a nice child, but she isn't and, tbh never really has been - we visited this week and she spent the entire time taking toys off ds and slapping, pushing and shoving him away, then screaming for her mother if she didn't get her way. She has no social skills whatsoever. She also slammed ds's hand in the door (okay, I'm sure that wasn't on purpose but she wouldn't open the door either while ds was screaming so I'm sure you can see why I'm a bit biased!).

They don't have stairgates or door stops in their house as dd is 'beyond all that' but ds isn't and I was constantly on edge after that.

My friend's reaction to this behaviour was to say 'well, they don't really play together at that age, do they?' and not once telling her off for hitting and shoving except in a very laid-back, 'now then, dd, we don't do that, do we' from her sofa across the room. I really felt like showing her how my ds and his other friends play, they totally interact and have a great giggly time playing chase, tea parties etc.

I think I could probably forgive all of this if it weren't for the constant parading of her dd's brains - the child was shoved in front of me and asked 'what was the name of the special doctor that nanna had to go and see, dd?' to which she replied 'podiatrist' and my friend beamed at me as if to say 'look! Isn't she fabulous!' to which I was very tempted to reply 'wow, she can parrot well, can't she?' DD was also prevailed upon to tell me the alphabet, draw me a circle and sing me a song.

As ds is entirely normal with no outstanding characteristics whatsoever (barely says a word, draws like a scribbling loon, is convinced that pigs are sheep) except a very sunny personality, I was left feeling a bit inferior. I made a jokey comment about his not being up to her levels and she said 'well, we can't all be intelligent, can we?'

Also - and I'd love to know what you think of this - she made lunch and it was pasta with rocket, black olives and some kind of italian ham (the stuff that looks raw). No sauce. Huge bowlfuls of this were plonked down in front of the dcs. Ds is fussy with his food at the best of times and this just puzzled him - he started playing with it. Of course, dd ate it all up whilst my friend beamed at her 'of course dd has a refined palate, we took her to Umbria a few months back and she adored the antipasto there' - is this just so much middle-class twattage or what?? (perhaps I'm , I don't know...)

So of course ds was hungry (no other food was offered) and got a bit agitated. I said I'd better take him home and friend got really distressed, 'oh, no, do you have to go?' and I felt really bad.

I think she's probably lonely and possibly a bit insecure - her dp's job has moved and she doesn't really know anyone in the area, there aren't a lot of other children around in the tiny village they live in.

My friend is a sahm, her dd has never been away from her, they've moved quite a long way (50min car journey) away and I don't think her dd has been to playgroups etc since then as there aren't any in the area.

She has actually said to me that she isn't going to send dd to pre-school as she can't bear to let go...

So I feel awful about even thinking about cutting her off as a friend, but I also felt incredibly aggrieved that I'd driven for 50mins to be patronised, have ds pushed about and ignored and then get fed some godawful dinner party food that no normal child would eat!

So, I like her, but I hate her attitude to her dd and I'm beginning to heartily dislike her dd into the bargain - for which i feel even more guilty as she's only a child...

What would you do?

[earlgrey]

Would drive me up the effing bend, tbh. I couldn't stand it.

Had a similar thing with my best friend, who I've known since I was 18. Her dd was 3 months older than my dd1. Thing is, she wasn't that clever, just 3 months older than dd.

Had to stop seeing her while this was going on. Still meet occasionally but it's never been the same.

Why do people do this? Are they insecure?

[flibertygibbetplus2]

Think I would certainly keep my distance for a while. If she tries to make arrangements I'd mention that they don't play together very well. Could you meet up without the kids and keep her as a friend for you but not for DS?

[KristinaM]

i woudl see her in teh evening for a drink and say " oh lets not talk about the kids, lets have a night off"

[grannycracksopenabottleofwine]

can you invite her out with a few of your friends and their dcs? if she's lonely she'd probably be pleased and it would be good for her dd.

your ds sounds very advanced socially. none of mine have played properly with other children when 2 years old

sounds like the sort of lunch i'd like but maybe a bit salty for small children

[powder28]

Just talk to her on the phone or email and maintain the friendship that way.

[webmum]

I think ou're spot on when you say she's probably very insecure. It depends how much she annoys you, and how much you actuall enjoy spending time with her, how long have you know her before children as well...

It doesn't seemm like yyou'll see a lot of her anyway if she lives so far apart, so if you think yyou can bear it just once ina while....

I used to knoe a little girl who seemed a genius, and perfectl behaved too, compared to mine, but in time their differences evened out and she started being less of a genius and more like a'normal' child, but luckilyy her mum, though obviously proud, was never so much in yyour face about it!

[IdreamofClooney]

I would be inclined to "phase her out" to be honest. I have some friends that seem to serve purely for the purpose of making me feel shit about myself and I do think why bother?

If her DD is so wonderful why does she need to keep forcing the issue, the child is 2 fgs what she needs is love, stimulation, social interaction and a bit of discipline etc so she can grow up to be a nice decent person not a super intelligent freak with no social skills!

I would not want to hang out with her and I wouldn't want my DS hanging out with her or her daughter where he is being constantly judged and bullied - well that is how I would feel. I personally would rather have a happy kind sociable child than an intelligent one!

[danceswithaSPRINGinherstep]

Oh, she sounds insufferable! Quite honestly if you have plenty of friends anyway I'd just let the friendship slide..be busy when she invites you over, if you feel too guilty doing this maybe have her over to yours more often where you can feed the children 'normal food' (my dd bizarrely likes lettuce/rocket but ds - 2yrs wouldn't have touched any of that lunch!) and be a bit more forceful about rules of not hitting ie 'oh no, we don't hit in this house etc'.
It's taken me almost 30yrs to realise that some friendships just aren't worth it. Now I'm only friends with people dc and I really like to spend time with and I'm much happier for it.

[staceym11]

my dd does sentences etc but i have friends whose dcs the same age dont, iv never gone on like that!

same as most of their dcs walked early dd didnt till she was 18 month, but they didnt go on!! would have made me feel bad!

i think your friend is inseccure about her parenting, and is trying to show you she can be a good parent.

maybe sit her down and explain that you cannot see her if her dd continues to be horribel to your ds, and also you find it a bit demeaning when she parrades her childs 'brilliance' while at the same time dissmissing your childs 'normality'.

hope you get this sorted! it sounds distressing!

[Cappuccino]

oh junk the woman already

[powder28]

Actually my sister and her husband are the same as your friend. We lived with them for a while [a year!!!], me and my dh and my ds1 [ i was pregnant with ds2] and my sister and her dh and their two kids. Although my sisters DH is a nasty manipulative bully.
My niece would push, bite, scratch my ds constantly and never seemed to get properly told off.Then one day my niece was playing with some polystyrene on the floor and mh dh picked up my son and who was 10 mnths and took him in the other room so he wouldnt pick up the polystyrene and eat it. Next thing my bil went off on a tangemt about how
'we always held him, didnt let him explore things, etc'

Then he said that if we didnt keep holding him then he would be

'walking by now like his kids' and that if we werent careful he would be

'mentally deficient'

honeslty becasue we wouldnt let our child eat polystyrene!

[staceym11]

powder, your BIL sounds like a loon!

[Tortington]

why do you like her? its not rhetorical, pleae answer.

is she a friend ebcuase ...you know her becuase i have a more narrow definition than that


if she has somehow helped youin your hour of need. if she is great for a laugh, good to go have a beer with, someone you can confide in. maybe she has redeeming qualities
qualities which cannot be present with parent posturing and angel children.

if she is a nice person dont see her with children

[kittywaitsfornumber6]

I would say also that if you like her as adult company then continue to do that.

As a mother she sounds absolutely awful. You mustn't subject your child to that anymore. She is obviously very insecure this 'friend' and has hot-housed her poor child, rendering her incapable of any decent social interaction. She will not be a popular child and will not have friends if this continues. Your friend seems to measure her worth and success as as a mother by how well how child can count. That's crap.

[powder28]

I know stacey, I was really angry about it because before hewent off on one he took both HIS kids upstairs first and then came back down and shot his mouth off in front of my ds!

I have some shocking stories about this guy, he really is a freak!

[Babyramone]

I have a friend like this too, except her chiild and mine actually play really well.
Her ds walked at 10months and mine at 15. This she said was down to me using pram or sling and actually taking him places. Apparently if had been at home he'd have walked sooner. He has flat feet and according to her is due to being in cloth nappies.
If my ds does something hers has been doing for longer, better and is on next stage (they're the same age exactly 3yrs just days apart)
When my DS learnt to do somersault, her's was doing handstand in to a crab. Funny thing is you never see this though.
I'd would have moved on infact did for a while but the two do play nice.
I say phase out and be pleased you have a sunny happy boy, to me that's much more impotrtant than anything else.

[thishousewontcleanitself]

To Custardo - I met her when I was pg at ante-natal classes. We sat together and found out we shared the same sense of humour, taste in books etc, and kept in touch afterwards. I suffered mildly from PND and she was really great at getting me out of the house and doing stuff at the time.

She's always been a bit 'oh, my fab dd', but since she's moved away it's got much worse, which is why I can kind of forgive her for it because I think it's to do with being a bit isolated. She rings me and sounds really down and desperate for company so I go round to see her, but then in person she's so ott with the brilliant dd stuff that I just end up feeling annoyed.

I have asked her if she wants to go out of an evening, but she's not been keen on that. Unfortunately, of our circle I'm the only one who works part time (everytone else is back in full time work) so we can't all get together with our dcs, as we tend to be doing family stuff with dps at the weekend.

@ powder - your BIL!

[TinyGang]

God, she sounds awful on some levels, highly insecure on others.

At least you are a 50 minute drive apart which is a useful distance.

I don't think I'd cut her out completely but I'd be 'very busy' with toddler groups/other friends/infectious ailments etc and scale the meetups down to every couple of months and keep them short and sweet.

Sometimes meeting away from her/your homes can take the heat off. A park or soft play place, then you can take your own lunch and you won't feel so trapped in her house listening to it all. Could take another friend and her child along too to take out the intensity.

[powder28]

I have no way of talking to my sister now. Her husband told my parents that her phone was at the bottom of the canal.
To cut a long story short, none of us know where she is. The only people who do are his side of the family.
My mum is completely distraught but hwta can she do?
My sister and her dh were living with my parents on their own last year and my parents were the only ones who gave
them any help ie financial, emotional etc
My sister had an ectopic pregnancy. My parents were at my house and when they got back my bil was there
e said '** gone to hospital she collapsed in the bathroom'

My mum said 'my god why?'
to which he replied 'im not telling you, she doesnt want you to know and i havent even got your fing telephone number so i couldnt ring you and i suppose ill haveto take the kids with me'

My mum said she would watch the kids while he went.

When he got back he told them she had to have an operation and she nearly died.

My mum chose not to go to the hospital but did ring my sister before she came out.

A few days later when my sister was home my niece was saying to my mum that 'daddy is being silly, he wont let me do anything' and my mum just said 'never mind' and bil picked her up and said to his 3 yr old dd'its not me you need to be frightened of , some peopel dont even care if youre dying in hospital'

Sorry, this has nothing to do with the op, just need to get it offmy chest i think!

[Enid]

she sounds fine (the friend)

ok irritating about her dds achievements but nothing else you said sounds that bad

BUT it does sound like you have grown apart, and if she irritates you that much I would not bother seeing her for a while.

[Enid]

haven't we all done things that we cringe at now with our first baby?

just move on if she is driving you mad

fwiw I didnt send my dd1 to pre-school either - dont think that is a sackable offence!

you sound a bit jealous about the food - mine wouldnt have eaten it either BUT I would have felt secure enough to say 'ds doesnt like olives or parma ham, can I have some plain pasta or bread a butter?'

[BandofMothers]

[shock powder, think you should start your own thread. He sounds dangerous to me, you should try to find her and get her away from him asap.

House, Tell her you can't afford petrol for the drive, and she'll have to cvome to you. That way your ds will be safe, and get yummy food for lunch. Altho I like the sound of that lunch,, I know dd1 wouldn't eat it.
Also just tell her that comments like, we can't all be intelligent don't wash well with you and you'd rather she didn't say things like that about your ds, who is perfectly normal. Yes her dd does more than mine, who's 3.3yrs. But that doesn't mean your ds isn't smart too.

What have you got to lose by saying it straight. If she takes Umbridge then problem solved, if not, she'll visit YOU and stop being so annoying. Win/win.

[powder28]

sadly i know for a fact she will NEVER leave him and it seems she has already made her choice.

[ScottishThistle]

Sounds awful but if she's a real friend you should be able to have a word with her about the brilliant child stuff, but lets face it most Parents do that anyway!

Girls are generally more advanced than boys of the same age so if your ds is 3mths younger there will obviously be a noticeable difference.

In general 2yr olds don't actually play together (even the clever ones) so your ds & his friends must be very socially advanced.

[wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe]

I agree with Enid, you sound a bit jealous, and you are being equally comparing ? ?She has no social skills whatsoever.?, ?my ds
and his other friends play, they totally interact and have a great giggly time playing chase, tea parties etc.?

As for the lunch I see nothing wrong with it. If her dd eats that kind of thing then she has no reason to think that someone else?s child wouldn?t, if you don?t have a fussy child and your child is happy to eat everything you do it?s hard to understand how others? children can be fussy iykwim.

It can be annoying when people hold their children up against yours, I have a friend who does this, her dd is a year older than my ds, and she ?had the vocabulary of a three year old? when she was just one, was ?offered a place in school aged three? (yeh right), and friend even said that her sil?s dd ?just isn?t right somehow? when she still wasn?t walking at a year old as friend?s dd had walked at 9 months. It?s annoying, but it?s often a sign of major insecurity, my friend was adopted but was the middle of three and the two other children were her parent?s biological children and her mother never stopped telling her that so she has no sense of her own identity.

Could you tell her that ?there?s no need to compare the kids, they?re all individuals and two is still very young to know how your child will turn out anyway?.