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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU to be angry and confused that my friends wife, ABDUCTED the kids?

30 replies

Val1969 · 18/06/2017 15:49

My friends wife, who turned out to be an illegal Kenyan immigrant has abducted his two kids. They are 5 and 8, girl n boy.n

Social Services were involved, but closed the case.

It seems that she wanted, ONLY a Visa, and sadly duped my kind, placid friend. He did everything. My partner and he would take kids to park. She, his wife, ran a business from home and stashed thousands as he worked full time.

I think she wants to send the kids back to her African family, as she stays here. She accused him of beating her. As she had no evidence, she then tried to accuse him of sexually abusing them.

As they were asked questions by Social Services, no disclosures about him were made, but the kids talked of her cruelty and how she locks them in cupboards.

She appears to have got some kind of permission from the school and/or Social Services? Also the police appear to be treating it as a civil matter? Again, surely a child abduction is just that?

How and why would their regular school allow this? He has equal custody?

Also - the children are securely attached to him. They are his world. None of it makes sense.

She is also after a Council House he says? To go about it whilst terrorising the children in this way is so saddening.

What are his rights? My son 8 has been their best Park friend since he was 4 and she has taken them, it appears to a domestic violence shelter in order to start her Council House journey.

This is wrong. Surely she would need to PROVE domestic violence before being allowed to take kids from regular school? Am so confused. Please advise...

OP posts:

DixieFlatline · 18/06/2017 15:53

I'm sure he's doing everything he can and is far more aware of the facts of the situation, OP. Not sure what you think you can or should do.

LittleMyLikesSnuffkin · 18/06/2017 15:58

As someone who is enduring an ongoing family court saga to sort out access with between my kids and their dad post DV and a long stay in a women's refuge I can honestly say unless you know for certain and not just "my friend says..." don't be so quick to judge. My ex modelled what he thought was the perfect dad to our kids but was vile to them behind closed doors as well as to me. Some people fell for it but not all. He has accused me of beating my kids, being an alcoholic and only moving to refuge to "get a council house quicker".

Has your friend appointed a solicitor yet? That should be his first port of call if he really truly wants to his kids. What does he expect the police to do anyway?! Or the children's school? The school has to follow the law so if he can't go and pick them up from school because there is say, a prohibited steps order in place there will be a very good reason why.

LittleMyLikesSnuffkin · 18/06/2017 16:01

Just to point out if you think someone goes to a refuge just to get a council house you're deluded. There are waiting lists for a place in most refuges. There is a panel of experts that decides if you need a place in one and if so how desperately. No one takes the decision to place a family into refuge lightly. Really.

unlimiteddilutingjuice · 18/06/2017 16:03

Its not an abduction...its a custody dispute.
Your friend needs to deal with it through a solicitor and you need to mind your own business.

StaplesCorner · 18/06/2017 16:10

Well, lets take the Op at face value first shall we, OP is only trying to help and if you have never come across this situation before then it is pretty shocking, especially when the only recourse is to a solicitor.

If you friend cannot afford legal advice Val, he can start with the CAB.

LaurieMarlow · 18/06/2017 16:12

OP, there are at least 2 sides to this story as I'm sure you know. Your friend should get legal advice and apart from that, butt the hell out. It's nothing to do with you.

Chillyegg · 18/06/2017 16:18

Wow . My ex was violent to me in front of dd. I have no proof. Still doesnt mean it didnt happen. I thinkk you need to acknowledge that there is your frieds truth his ex wifes truth and the actual truth whuch could be a combination of both to whichever proportion.

AdalindSchade · 18/06/2017 16:21

He has to engage a solicitor and apply to court for contact asap.

CremeBrulee · 18/06/2017 16:21

Charming friendly men who take their kids to the park are very capable of committing appalling acts of domestic violence.

Frankly , OP unless you were there at the time the DV took place you would never know.

Osolea · 18/06/2017 16:25

If your friend is on the birth certificates, then he has exactly the same rights as the mother.

He can apply to the court for a child arrangement order and a prohibited steps order to prevent the children being moved out of the country, and if the children are still in school, then in theory he could just go and collect them. He needs good legal advice.

I'm glad my friends or family don't 'butt the hell out' when I'm having problems and need their support. Good on you for supporting your friend. Anyone who thinks women don't cry domestic violence when what they really want is a council house, or want one in a new area is sadly deluded in my experience. They can, and do, and they are often very well supported by the authorities. Wrongly of course.

AmenacingWhistle · 18/06/2017 16:27

In my recent experience as a support worker it's incredibly hard to find places in refuges.

PacificDogwod · 18/06/2017 16:27

YANBU to feel whatever you feel. And to want to support your friends is lovely.

I am quite sure the situation is likely to be very complex, more so than your OP suggests.

witsender · 18/06/2017 16:28

In essence, a woman has accused a man of abuse and moved to a shelter. I can't get worked up about her working from home, being an immigrant etc...I'm not sure what the relevance is. If she wanted to send the kids home, what is the rest of the fuffle about?

No-one goes to a shelter or refuge for fun. Have you ever been to one? I would consider the fact that as your sons are just 'park friends' maybe you don't know much about the situation and to just be there for your friend without getting further involved. If he is a half intelligent man I'm sure he will pursue all avenues.

Worth noting that she hasn't abducted them, that's a little melodramatic!

Footle · 18/06/2017 16:29

It's been quite a while since a non-EU spouse could get permanent leave to remain by marrying a UK spouse.

VintagePerfumista · 18/06/2017 16:29

So it's a custody dispute, as others have said.

Are you his new partner?

Because it sounds like the sort of tale abusive men spread about their "batshit ex" every day on here to justify why their wives kick them out.

SailAwayWithMeHoney · 18/06/2017 16:33

Firstly you don't just pop off to a refuge and get a council house, that's not how it works.

Refuge is a hard slog.

Also, unless you were there all the time you cannot possibly say that the abuse didn't take place.

Perpetrators of domestic abuse rarely admit they've done anything wrong, and very very often paint their victim as the problem/aggressor/plain liar. So much of the time there's not hard irrefutable evidence of dva, and that's why perpetrators are able to get away with it, or to claim their victim is lying. You may actually never know the truth.

I would absolutely stay out of it if I were you.

missiondecision · 18/06/2017 16:34

Not an abuction.
Yabu. Very .
What you say here is "hear say" what happens behind closed doors is often very different to what people talk about.
I spent 18 months in a refuge before being housed. It's not a fast track.

user1497480444 · 18/06/2017 16:42

What do you expect the school to do? It has nothing to do with the school. The school is for education

SailAwayWithMeHoney · 18/06/2017 16:42

different to what people talk about.
I spent 18 months in a refuge before being housed. It's not a fast track.

Absolutely right it's not, that's if you can find a space, very often the only space will be absolutely miles away from everything you know, most refuges operate an x-mile policy meaning they will only take people from a certain number of miles away due to safety reasons, most people don't get to chose a refuge in a new area of their choice, they have to go wherever they are allocated that has a room for them.
And average stay in refuge is 1-2years. Meaning you could be in there for two years before being rehoused. And rehoused into whatever the LA offers you first because some (if not most) councils add refuge families to the homeless as you're in emergency accommodation.

Just thought that reality might be pertainent to the discussion 👌🏻

Birdsgottaf1y · 18/06/2017 16:44

""I think she wants to send the kids back to her African family, as she stays here. ""

Then why is she desperate enough "to lie to get a Council House" by going into a refuge?

My ex was abusive in all ways, but i can't prove it and you can never tell how someone treats a partner by how they treat others/seems gentle etc.

Being an illegal immigrant puts you in a perfect position to have to stick in an abusive relationship, until you have enough money to flee.

So they were together around ten years but you can say without a doubt that she only wanted a Visa?

You are being fed cliche after cliche and are lapping it up.

He has all the advice he needs ,if he wants it, it is strange the way men need to involve the world and his wife in these matters.

Listen to him by all means but you don't need to do anything or get directly involved.

Natsku · 18/06/2017 16:44

You are only hearing one side of the story. Your friend needs to get legal help and I hope the mother has legal help too. If you want to give some advice to your friend, tell him to ask for a guardian ad litem for the children, they will represent the children and try to get this custody dispute resolved in the way that is best for the children, who are the only ones that matter here.

SailAwayWithMeHoney · 18/06/2017 16:44

to the register as homeless

Birdsgottaf1y · 18/06/2017 16:46

""What do you expect the school to do? It has nothing to do with the school. The school is for education""

Schools now are about the whole child and are a first and second tier in Safeguarding and work alongside SS.

So the school knows the full situation and are acting accordingly.

SaskiaRembrandtWasFramed · 18/06/2017 16:55

YABU, and your imaginary friend's story has more holes than an elderly string vest.

dinosaursandtea · 18/06/2017 16:57

If all she wanted was a visa, why wait until her eldest was 8? Either he's bullshitting you or you're bullshitting us.

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