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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be frustrated that we can't live on our own land....

97 replies

DoggyDay1 · 17/06/2017 14:58

Simply that, very much first world problem of course, but getting planning permission to live in any type of dwelling on our land is just ridiculous, yet all around us housing developers seem to sweep aside all the rules and do as they please. We farm the land, live self suffienctly off it, we're up there all the time and back and forth twice a day every day to see to animals, but not allowed to build there. I keep looking at different options but unless we plough 1000s in on a high risk of no success we've little hope. Basic message was if we were richer we could buy ourselves round the rules but as we're a normal family, who just happen to try and live in an environmentally friendly way, we've little hope.

OP posts:
MovingOnUpMovingOnOut · 17/06/2017 15:00

Can you get permission for a "temporary" structure.

MovingOnUpMovingOnOut · 17/06/2017 15:00

?

Original poster
DoggyDay1 · 17/06/2017 15:04

We're seeking more advice from a specialist person now but planning consultants at local authority were so unhelpful and charged us 150 for the privilege!!

OP posts:
jayho · 17/06/2017 15:07

You need to look at your local development plan, if your plot is in an area not designated for housing you'll struggle

Floppypotato · 17/06/2017 15:09

Presumably you've looked into a temporary dwelling to prove your farm requires full time presence which may in turn lead to PP for an agricultural dwelling?

AnnieOH1 · 17/06/2017 15:10

I may be imagining this but I think there is some sort of planning loophole (or used to be) allowing you to live where you have animals for the sake of their husbandry.

LucieLucie · 17/06/2017 15:16

Stick a cabin or caravan on it then re-apply in a certain number of years.

Speak to other landowners and find out all the loop holes. There's plenty

pigsDOfly · 17/06/2017 15:20

Are you saying that property developers in your area are bribing the people in the planning department in order to 'get round the rules and do as they please'? Has someone in the planning department told you if you paid lots of money you could buy your way round the regulations?

If you honestly believe that that is the case you need to make complaints in very strong terms and try to get it investigated, otherwise I imagine that they are building on land that they have been legally granted permission to build on.

The land my house has been built on was formerly farm land. I very much doubt that the huge company that built it has been greasing palms down at the planning department. Some of the land around the development is not suitable for building and has been left as fields, can't imagine they'd leave acres of land empty if it was just a case of paying to get round the regulation.

Are you sure your land is actually suitable for building?

SylviaPoe · 17/06/2017 15:24

We've had this various times where I live - people buying up cheap farm land and then thinking they should be allowed to live on it.

They're not, nor should they be. It's not for housing.

Legma37 · 17/06/2017 15:31

Floppy potato is right, but is it an agricultural business or is it a hobby farm? How is it self-sufficient?

ExplodedCloud · 17/06/2017 15:35

I assume OP is referring to the fact that large developers have money to pay solicitors to fight every step of the planning process.

BewtySkoolDropowt · 17/06/2017 15:35

Has there ever been a property on the land? Someone I know got round regulations because there had been a previous house on the land, although it was ruined by that point. Precedent had been set.

Legma37 · 17/06/2017 15:35

Planning Officers do charge for pre-application advice. Why should they not, they are professional and you pay for their time. You have to pay an agricultural specialist, do you begrudge that? Was it unhelpful because it was advice you did not want to hear?

callmeadoctor · 17/06/2017 15:40

Why should you be allowed to build on green belt when I can't ?

pigsDOfly · 17/06/2017 15:43

That may be the case Cloud but if the land is not suitable for building it won't be built on.

Also, I maybe wrong, but I imagine taking farm land and making it suitable for use as building land is not that cheap. Surely it's not just a case of digging up land over and plonking down a house. What about access to utilities, sewage etc?

TheMisterMac · 17/06/2017 15:43

My former home overlooked a barn, very old, falling apart, barn in the middle of a field. Over the years a number of people bought it and the field it stood in and all those lovely people sold it on because planning permission for change of use was not forthcoming.

Until...

A not so local MP bought it and surprise surprise, planning was given for his utterly hideous, totally out of character for the area, steel and glass eyesore.

NettleTea · 17/06/2017 15:54

in order to qualify for temporary housing on some agricultural land you need to be more than self sufficient, you need to be earning an income from it, roughly £15K I believe, from agriculture and working on it full time. even then its not easy.

SootSprite · 17/06/2017 15:56

Poor you, OP, not being able to build on green belt land.

Who needs green spaces anyway? Future generations can just enjoy looking at a photographs of the past, green and pleasant land eh Hmm

UrsulaPandress · 17/06/2017 15:56

Someone I know built a fabulous log cabin to get round pp. hot tub and everything.

SleightOfHand · 17/06/2017 15:58

I've seen a few temporary structures, mobile home/cabin type dwellings. Would you consider a temporary type? I don't think you should expect to build on greenbelt though, if there was a free for all, where would it end.

SilentlyScreamingAgain · 17/06/2017 15:59

If your conveyancing solicitor didn't explaine that you were buying agricultural land, I'm sure the Law Society would be interested. However, if you bought land at a third of it's residential value, what else were you expecting?

SylviaPoe · 17/06/2017 16:01

Even if you put up a temporary structure you can't always legally live in it.

RoseVase2010 · 17/06/2017 16:06

If you are running a profitable business farming the land that requires some on site all the time you can build a temporary structure and then apply for planning to build a permanent home after 5/8 years, I can't remember which.

NettleTea · 17/06/2017 16:16

yes RoseVase thats what Im saying. The only way is to have an agricultural business on farm land is to show its a viable business and then you can apply for a temporary structure. from what our planners told us (we run a business on PILs farm, but cant live there as PIL in the only, tiny, house) the income level is around £15K profit, not turnover.
Then, if you carry on, you can apply for a permanent structure.

if there is a barn there which has been used for agriculture in the past, you may be able to get a change of use, but that depends upon how much land you have, how long its been used/unused and if you are in an area of outstanding beauty. In theory its supposed to be easier now, but is still very much down to the local planning dept.

in any case there is no way on this earth you are going to be able to just build something without spending out for a planning application and all the other documentation that you will need for your application. Im no fool but it still took me nearly a year to get all the different surveys and reports done, produce all the plans, all the environmental surveys, the historical searches, etc and that was just for 4 yurts, not even a house, because we chose to do it ourselves. 2 failed applications, an appeal and a public hearing. In the end we hired a planning consultant to do the final bit. Its not going to be cheap.

tleaf · 17/06/2017 16:20

Could you check if the Tourist Board have any advice/ influence to help you set up a new business, including a building. It may be nothing you want to do, but this is how we saw a farmer apparently 'work' the system.

On holiday in Scotland, we admired a 'bungalow' being built on a farm, in an idyllic spot overlooking the bay. Locals explained that planning had been refused for a residence, but subsequently, with the support of the Tourist Board, permission had been granted for the farmer to diversify and build a Tearoom, with animals nearby in pens and a small play area. It proved to be very popular....But...

When we visited several years later, we were disappointed to find the business had 'failed' and the tearoom was deserted. The following year however, we were told that planning permission had recently been granted for a change of use to Residential!

Good luck!