to think that end of tenancy inspections are just yet another way of ripping tenants off?

[Thisarmingman]

I mean, really, you can lose money from your deposit which afaik is supposed to cover damage because your extractor fan isn't taken apart and cleaned or the inside of the kitchen cupboards aren't pristine? Since when was that damage?

Seems like landlords aren't happy enough getting tenants to bankroll their lifestyle - they want tenants to prepare the property for the next person too which is surely the landlord's job.

People who own houses and sell them don't have to do this on pain of losing several hundred pounds. It's just a rip off.

You do realise that there are dozens of reasons why people become landlords? It's fucking infuriating when ignorant, judgemental people go on about how landlords are selfish, arseholes, unethical blah blah blah. Poor tenants always getting the shit end of the bargain to "bankroll the landlord's lifestyle" whatever the fuck that means.

I rented my house when I had to move for work and wasn't able to sell it. Couldn't afford to pay the mortgage plus my own rent where I moved. So I rented it for significantly less than market value just to cover my costs. Did as many checks on the tenants as I could but they still fucking trashed the place, paid their rent late leaving me in the shit and left me with a repair bill of around £4k. But yes, I was the big bad wolf and they were hard done by

My grandma is now in a care home and we rent out her home to pay the care fees. I suppose she is selfishly tying up housing stock as well.

To be honest, pensions are so shit nowadays that I find it difficult to condemn somebody for buying a rental property to provide them with an income in old age. Most landlords are just normal people who are trying to do the best for their families. It's the ones who build up huge empires and HMOs that I think are greedy and exploitative.

I'd say non-payment of rent should get you tossed out quickly

Oh how funny. It takes months and a very expensive procedure.

There are good and bad landlords, tenants and letting agents.

I rented for around 4 years, in the same house, never had any issues with my LL whatsoever (he didn't use an agency). However I treated it as my own home, whereas I do believe that some tenants have the attitude of 'it's not my house so why should I look after it'. At the end of the tenancy, not only did I get my full deposit back, but the landlord bought all my furniture off me (I didn't need it) so that he could rent it again but as furnished.

I've also been a LL for around 15 years and I've got a couple of tenants who have been there for over 10 years

There was an awful car accident a couple of years ago and one of my tenants had to leave his home for the day until a structural engineer had confirmed that the building was safe! My agent rang me immediately to let me know what was going on, I told her to give the chap £40 (the rent was only £80 pw) so he could get a good meal etc (although I think it was spent on whiskey!). When I went down there a few days later, he was so grateful, it really was quite touching .... it's the little things that make a difference, from both the LL and tenants

I've also had tenants who, after not paying rent for several months, just before they were evicted, have completely trashed the place, ripping out electric sockets, smashing the bathroom fixtures, ripping out the kitchen, costing me thousands in repairs before I could let it again. Obvious that's an extreme case but it hasn't been unusual to find the tenant has maliciously caused some damage before they leave. I can almost guarantee that these tenants never paid their last months rent, if not more.

I've had a tenant sat on the front steps of my property with a knife telling me to fuck off out of 'their' building .., guess what the police didn't want to know as it wasn't considered serious enough and they suggested I get my agent to speak to said tenant.

I've never made a profit, after mortgage, insurance etc, anything left is generally spent on the property itself. It's a listed building which was converted into flats 20 years ago, so nothing is cheap or easy. I'm not looking to make a profit out of the tenants, so long as the building pays for itself.

I've had letting agents not pass on rent to me, saying the tenants were in arrears, problems with their housing benefit being paid etc etc ... it was only after two years of virtually no rent from five flats, I'd had enough. Most of the tenants paid in cash and guess what, most of it wasn't passed to me. Luckily some of the tenants had kept their receipts and miraculously the agents suddenly found the missing money.

Several years I've made a loss and we've had to find the money somehow to keep the property going ... if there are housing benefit issues, or tenants refusing to pay, I can't say to my mortgage provider, sorry not this month.

I can't logistically manage the flats myself but the agent I have now is amazing and has a brilliant relationship with her tenants.

You see ....

Good and bad landlords
Good and bad tenants
Good and bad agents

In my last-but-one rental, the letting agency booked the check-out inspection a WEEK before the end of the tenancy because apparently that was the only time they could do it. They didn't seem to understand that this wasn't suitable since a) I would still be living in the property, b) all my belongings and debris will still be in the property, and c) their availability is not my fucking problem. I think I had a thread about it at the time.

I also remember one agent, during the inventory check at the start of the tenancy, telling me "we have to check the washing machine drawer because that's where we catch a lot of people - if there's limescale in the drawer when you leave it's about £50 for a replacement." Presented to me as jaunty, helpful advice.

I do think some checks are necessary though for the avoidance of further dispute. Some take it too far, but there are good landlords and bad landlords, just as there are good tenants and bad tenants.

When I was renting I got burgled. The cads pinched all the exposed pipework among other things which made one heck of a mess on the floor as they hadn't thought to turn off the water first.

I was a young woman living alone and it made me very nervous. The landlord said I could either have a burglar alarm put in or replacement carpets. I opted for the burglar alarm and we told the letting agents about the break in.

When I got my end of tenancy inspection they charged me for water damage to the carpet. I phoned up straight away to dispute it and got told that the disputed charges had already been handed over. I did not have the money or the energy to take them to court and would not have even known where to start!

Just on the"fees shouldn't be charged to tenants"...the immediate direct consequence will be rents going up to cover the landlords cost.

As a ll I resent the amount charged by agents to tenants for all this and will either find an agent who charges the same as it would cost me, or do it myself. There are costs to referencing/ checkin inventories etc but I don't want agents ripping us both off. As a landlord I think I should pay for references (although possibly by having tenants pay then refund when they pass to avoid timewasters). I'm happy to pay for checkin inventory, Teants pay for checkout. I understand fair wear and tear. And I would like my mortgage provider to allow me to rent to benefits claimants...

Petra, I don't mind that - I think it would be fairer if rents went up but tenants paid no fees to let. I think that's a better principle.

I agree with Mary, if I'm flat hunting id rather see x per week than y per week and find out there is £400 fees on top.

It is scammy, but don't let the Landlord fleece you if you're confident that they're taking the piss. Be polite, be reasonable, but tell them no. And take it to the Deposit Protection lot.

Ok so, nothing in my tenancy about deposit protection (not even mentioned, let alone a specific scheme stated or any info about us being able to access the info) and none of the other people I live with have details either.

I checked the online websites to see if any records match up, they don't.

I'm not sure whether to ask the landlady directly for the details/info on the deposit protection?

I assume our house is an HMO? Not sure what the legal requirements are. We each have our own room and share living room, kitchen and bathroom/toilet.

We have had some issues with the landlady, due to unforeseen circumstances we were unable to renew the lease for next year (after initially saying we would) and when we informed her of this (around Easter) she got very angry and was very rude to us.

I'm just concerned that she'll be unfair towards us when we move out and try to keep our deposits.

I don't think there's any difference as long as the landlord doesn't live there! Still has to be an AST and still has to be in deposit protection! You are entitled to 3 times the deposit back if it isn't in a scheme...

Just on the"fees shouldn't be charged to tenants"...the immediate direct consequence will be rents going up to cover the landlords cost.

It will if the market can bear it. Not otherwise.

In answer to the OP, I don't think an end of tenancy inspection is a bad idea in itself but equally, do your own when you move in. Document everything, with photos, and email to the LL/agency. Plenty of LLs are happy enough to charge you to return to a pristine state when it looked nothing like that in the first place. Focus particularly on any stains, damp etc.

Do use tenancy deposit scheme challenge processes too. They have teeth.

I have been in touch with my university housing advice service and am going to call them tomorrow to see what if anything I/my housemates need to do.

Assuming she doesn't dispute the deposit, should we argue the fact that she didn't protect our deposits?

Most certainly yes! She had a legal obligation to do so.

Sounds like an HMO.

Unprotected deposit means you can sue her for up to three times its value. No defence.

Speak to your uni housing people. And all info on gov.UK . you will probably be quite interested to see what should be done legally.

Just on the"fees shouldn't be charged to tenants"...the immediate direct consequence will be rents going up to cover the landlords cost.

no, it wouldn't. The immediate and direct consequences would be a reduction in fees. If LL had to pay the fees, no agent could charge 90 quid to print a document, as the LL would either do it himself, or find an agent who could do it for less. You couldn't get fees entirely divorced from prices because LL can shop around.

LLs will no doubt try and pass the costs on to tenants. But they will have a huge hand in forcing fees down, and they could only pass the fees on if the market can bear it.

unfortunately agents can and do charge £90 for emailing a document, and most agents in an area charge the same. My (national) agent appears to have flat fees for things such as tenancy renewal, so a London landlord pays about 2 days rent and I pay 2 weeks for the same thing.

When fees are outlawed to tenants, I will no doubt end up paying double. Unlikely to accept a six month tenancy then, although that's not really an issue with a break clause.

putting up the rent enough to cover the fee is also unlikely, again not-London so there are market forces.

The thing is that if the LL pays the fees, they have a lot of control over what those fees are. We all know the power of shopping around, or deciding to do without. if EAs are really charging 90 quid for 1 quid worth of work, the market will sort it out if we remove this perversion.

Err op... the inventory protects YOU as much as the landlord, it was not implemented by landlords nor is it controlled by landlords. and landlords have to pay for the check in inventory.

Inventories at the start and end of a tenancy, protect you from an unscrupulous landlord illegally witholding your deposit for imaginary damages.

As you probably know, by law your deposit is held in a Secure scheme that cannot be touched by a landlord, inventories have to be done by an independent company (not the landlord) and any dispute is decided by an independent body to protect YOU.

You are merely expected to leave the property in the condition, you found it to get all your deposit back......YABU

Also to those of you saying the deposit is not released without the landlords approval you are wrong......the reason it became compulsory to hold deposits in an approved scheme is to prevent unfair deductions to tenants deposits.
should the tenant not agree to the deductions then the Deposit scheme adjudicators look at the evidence and decide and their decision is FINAL

The landlord has no say in their decision. Fact

So much demonisation of landlords. We got the keys back to our rental house earlier this week. We rented it out in perfect condition. Garden perfect, every room painted, spotlessly clean, new oven, new carpets throughout. Tenants assured us it would be in perfect condition when we did the inspection.

Carpets filthy. Chewing gum and oil walked in. Garden is a jungle and huge piles of crap left in the garden along with broken furniture. Windows have never been washed. We are selling it. Enough is enough.

I am a student and this has happen to me. During summer I was paying half rent so had to vacate the house. We then got a shitty email saying the house was a tip, worst he had ever seen. There may have been a few crumbs and a few bits under the cupboards but we had not moved out and still leaving there. It was immaculate as I had to clean it all myself because my flat mates pissed off and left me to scrub the flat .
Just left properly and I am terrifed I won't get any of my depsoit back. Starting my MA and need all the money I can get.
I took loads of picture before I left but still worried as I have a funny feeling our deposit didn't go in the scheme.
Land lords can be nasty about the deposit, not all but if they think your vunrable or could be taken for a ride easy the nasty ones will take advantage.

There's good and bad on both sides to be fair.

I sold my house because I'd had enough of disrespectful tenants.

One tenant who I had let off two months rent so he could pay off debts , left his room filthy.

Another tenant who I'd given a buggy and baby clothes to shafted me for 4 months rent. I'd even offered him a smaller room for free .

Another tenant had a drug problem and didn't pay rent.

Another one mixed cement on the carpet.

The rents I took covered the mortgage with about £150 spare which I had to put by for repairs. I certainly wasn't rolling in it!

You did get the benefit of other people working to pay your mortgage though, so it's not all bad.

Anyway have heard from agency that they are proposing to deduct a cleaning fee. As I suspected. The house is perfectly clean. (Bar those three crumbs). The fuckers. Honestly, fucking cunts. The hallway roof leaks. There's a massive patch of damp between the kitchen and bathroom due to a pipe leaking. They have known about both of these things for two fucking years and now they want me to fork out £350 to clean a clean house. After making me homeless. Fuck. Right. Off. I've been out grafting for all the money these cunts have been raking in from me for a long time. They've had plenty of money from me.

Yanbu especially as I always have to clean the flat when I move in as it's disgusting from previous tenant despite letting agency sending their special cleaners round