Panic attack in a quiet train carriage (long)

[Otismakessix]

My 17 year old autistic child (relevant) was travelling on a train from York to London yesterday morning. DS had missed an earlier train which his friends were on (day out to Camden Market with planned) but he was determined to go anyway. He doesn't usually travel to somewhere new unaccompanied by they were waiting for him at Kings Cross.

Sensibly DS had noise cancelling headphones as he suffers from sensory problems. He also had a sketch book to distract himself.

Now here is the thing.

DS is a punk. He is tiny, 5' 2" and a size 26 waist I mention this so I don't drip feed. He has a small red Mohawk and was wearing long lace up boots, combat trousers and a patch jacket. He has lots of piercings but he still looks about twelve without makeup because he is really petite. He is also trans but hasn't yet begun hormones ( I mention this because I think it is relevant).

DS began to have a panic attack. He suffers from anxiety especially if plans change, and of course he had missed the earlier train and was now on his own. DS was sitting in the quiet carriage because the noise in the normal carriages can be overwhelming.

DS said he began to hyperventilate and he was tapping his hand on his leg as he tried to regain control. He also muttered to himself to "get a grip".

With this a woman in her late 40s (my age) tapped him on the shoulder and said "Excuse me, this is the quiet carriage, can you do that somewhere else?. My DS, in shock, replied that it wasn't the best time to tell him to move and burst into tears. With that, she turned away and actively put her back to DS for the rest of the journey.

AIBU to expect this woman to have a little patience and compassion? DS had been panicking for only a minute. It would be clear to anyone around that DS was having an anxiety attack. He looks young for his age despite the punk gear and at that moment certainly wouldn't have looked threatening.

AIBU to ask that if you aren't going to help someone who is clearly distressed you could at least give the person the time and space to compose themselves.

I am also very annoyed that she tapped him on the shoulder to get his attention. Touching him would have distressed him even more.

Do you think that his attire and the fact that his gender can be construed as ambiguous at the moment may have contributed to her attitude?

DS is used to people pointing and gawping when he walks by. We have had long discussions over the years and DS is adamant that it doesn't bother him, and he is happier expressing himself this way. He loves the music and the clothing and is very aware of any negative connotations associated with them. DS is extremely bright, creative and intelligent and struggles daily having an ASD but he is the least judgemental person I know.

I was bought up to consider other people's feelings. Is this attitude old fashioned and largely irrelevant?

I

it isnt unreasonable, however i am afraid its a minority belief.

I genuinely think you may be over thinking it. I would assume that the woman would have just seen a 'kid' tapping and muttering and thought it just an annoyance, rather than realise fully what was going on.

Hope your ds is ok now.

From what you've posted it's hard to say.

Maybe she was a nice woman with no experience of anxiety who wanted some quiet and didn't understand what was happening?

If he had noise cancelling headphones on, I don't think touching him was unreasonable, and I feel like I should point out that my friend who has autism has no issue with being touched so you can't expect people to know that would upset him.

Maybe she was a judgemental cow and wanted him out of the quiet carriage.

You're never going to know, but I would disregard her and concentrate on your DS in this situation. He was brave to go on his own and he handled his panic attack very well.

In the nicest possible way, you're expecting the general public to have a basic understanding of autism and act accordingly, but that isn't realistic as lots of people will have no experience with it at all, and even those that do will understand that what helps one person wouldn't necessarily help another.

Of course knowing all you know about your DS YANBU however the woman didn't know the circumstances (and we don't know hers) and therefore her reaction was not U either.

I think you have expectations of compassion that aren't realistic and you are likely to be disappointed with others if this is your threshold. Sure it would have been nice of the lady to have considered that your DS could have a valid reason for behaving that way but there are many reasons why she could have done what she did (including her own troubles)

YABU. He handled himself really well it seems, and the woman was pretty reasonable about it. Unless he's going to wear a sign saying "I'm autistic and these are the things I need..." then I dont see how anyone can guess his needs. It's an invisible disability isn't it? And if anyone is wearing headphones then tapping them gently to get their attention is pretty reasonable. Would he have heard her if she'd whispered in his ear? Presumably if she's raised her voice to get his attention that might not have gone down well either.

Hi op

I'm so sorry your DS has had a bad experience but agree with others that you've possibly gone into protective mum mode and I say that as a mum to a similar severely sensory defensive DD

Praise him because, to cope and use the skills he did was just awesome

I would think you would want your son to be treated the same as everyone else. And the woman did just that, surely. YABU.

I'm sorry your poor lad had that experience but it does sound like he actually managed it well.
What the woman might have seen is a young boy being noisy in the quiet carriage. He could have been listening to music as far as she knew (thinking headphones not noise cancelling) and that annoyed her. She then may have turned her back to avoid further embarrassment for your son once she realised she had upset him.

I think you are BU. She didn't know he was having a panic attack or that he has ASD. He was tapping and muttering in the quiet carriage, she was understandably irritated. She probably thought he was tapping to music, or high on drugs or seeking attention. Unfortunately people do judge on appearance, they shouldn't but they do.

The woman didn't know you DS's backstory. You don't know her backstory. Maybe she has had terrible news, or is feeling very vulnerable and just really really needed some quiet at that moment. Maybe repetitive tapping is a trigger for her? Who knows, but she may be busy fighting her own battles. Compassion should extend to all.

He was making noise in the quiet carriage. She asked him to stop or go elsewhere. She doesn't know any if the rest of what you posted as relevant.

I thought you were going to say he was attacked.

I think you are expecting her to be able to read a lot into the situation that can´t be expected of stranger. Yes, it was unfortunate that she came over to him, but she couldn´t have known why he was making a noise.

She wasn't to know your son was autistic. A person wearing headphones tapping along and talking can seem like someone listening to music in the quiet carriage. So YABU

I'm autistic and have just starting travelling and gallivanting and pushing myself out of my comfort zone, and I can have similar problems as described by OP, so I've ordered myself some communication cards from Stickman Communications, like this one.

The thing with the cards is you can just leave the appropriate one visible in such a situation. I've also got an app called 'emergency chat' which can be great if verbal communication becomes too hard.

Given that I regularly see people talking loudly in the quiet carriage, I think this woman jumped in rather quickly to tell him off. Hope your DS is feeling OK now and won't be put off travelling independently again.

It would be clear to anyone around that DS was having an anxiety attack.

No, it wouldn't. I've never seen one. I wouldn't have had a clue.

I am also very annoyed that she tapped him on the shoulder to get his attention. Touching him would have distressed him even more.

She did not know this and it's not something most people would think of.

Do you think that his attire and the fact that his gender can be construed as ambiguous at the moment may have contributed to her attitude?

Not from what you've written. I think you are wayyyyyyy overthinking it. The only thing I see she did wrong was in turning her back when your son burst into tears but otherwise no.

I am sorry your son was upset by this woman's actions, but in all honesty I don't know how you expect her to respond to an unknown person muttering, tapping and with headphones in the quiet carriage. I think most of us would reasonably have assumed you'dr DS was responding to music in a way that would be irritating in a quiet carriage.

your DS did very well in getting the train to meet up with his friends and with his response to her, though I doubt if she understood what he meant. I wonder if he has ever thought of printing some small cards to hand to people if he is in a stressful situation to say something like

My name is X, I am autistic. I sometimes get very anxious .When I am anxious I tap my leg and speak to myself to calm myself down. Thankyou for your forbearance.

Do you think that his attire and the fact that his gender can be construed as ambiguous at the moment may have contributed to her attitude?

Generally yes dress and gender can affect peoples attitudes, people are mean and judge one another on appearances far too often. I dress quite similar to your son and have several trans friends and when out together people do point judge and can be very unnecessarily unkind.

In this case though I think maybe as others have said with no experience of panic attacks or MH herself she may not have realised that your son was panicking and thought he was just making noise in the quiet carriage. As for the turning her back on him she may well have been mortified when she realised he was upset and turned away to hide her embarrassment, or she may have been concerned of retaliation so turned her back to avoid confrontation. Please don't misunderstand me here, I'm not saying your son would confront her at all but again people make judgements without knowing you and although I understand he is generally not an intimidating person some people find piercings or punk clothes make them unreasonably nervous of the person.

I was bought up to consider other people's feelings. Is this attitude old fashioned and largely irrelevant?

Old fashioned yes, but an attitude that I think is more wanted and needed now than ever before, he is a credit to you for having this attitude himself and amazing for having managed the train journey alone despite his panic attack. I hope this incident doesn't knock his confidence more and that he had a good day when he got to his friends. He sounds wonderful.

If I hadn't learned about anxiety/panic attacks from MN, I would not know they existed. I have no experience, either directly or indirectly, of these in real life - and would certainly not have thought that a train journey would cause such things.

Thus, it would never have occurred to be that someone who I just perceived as annoying would be anything other than that.

Sorry for the experiences OP,

I am sorry he had a horrible experience and hope he's ok now.

I can also see the woman's perception of the situation.

None of us were there, so it's hard to say who was unreasonable there.

I hope it's not put him off trying travelling on his own again?

Do u think she perhaps thought he was Making a phone call? If she heard him talking and saw he had headphones on? She gave him space when she realised she had misjudged the situation and upset him. Allstate well that ends well.

Given he was wearing headphones, tapping, and muttering.. I think it's quite possible she thought he was singling along to music and it's okay to not find that acceptable in a train carriage.

From the outside I don't think it looked like a panic attack from your description

What Pacific said.