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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think pinning a child down is absolutely unacceptable?

118 replies

LottieG100 · 02/06/2017 23:50

My DD is 10 and sees her dad every other weekend and some extra during holidays. I have wondered about mild SN in the past - one of the reasons being because she can get very hysterical very quickly over minor things. She hates being enclosed, any slight injury or pain and bodily related things like being ill, having her hair or nails cut.

Bearing this in mind; her toe nails have a fungal infection. She can't bare to look at them and getting samples to send for analysis was extremely difficult. Because of the infection, they grow very slowly yet her dad is insisting on cutting them every time she sees him. I'm not exaggerating when I say that she is horrifically upset over having her nails cut. She panics and screams like she's being murdered.

She's come back from his several times now saying he has forced her to let him cut her nails. I've asked how he can force her (knowing how difficult it is to persuade her) and she's said she gets as upset as she does at home but he pins her down and does it anyway. He later laughs about it. I've pointed out to her that she would be absolutely livid about being pinned down if I were to do it and that she'd tell me so and that no one has a right to do something to her body that she doesn't want them to. I've told her she needs to stand up to him and say it's unacceptable but she said she's worried he won't see her anymore if she does. I said that she can't carry on letting him hurt and upset her on that basis but she then clams up.

Having tackled him, he thinks she needs to get over it and is being ridiculous to get in such a state about it all. He doesn't see anything wrong in what he's doing. AIBU to think pinning a child down is absolutely wrong and to take matters out of her hands and tell him that if it happens again then contact will be restricted until he takes matters to court?

OP posts:
Squishedstrawberry4 · 03/06/2017 08:20

Personally I'd just pay for a podiatrist once every two months.

Original poster
LottieG100 · 03/06/2017 08:30

Step in how, Rose? She would absolutely kick off if I stopped her seeing him because she would be worried about his anger. If I speak to him it fuels his behaviour.

OP posts:
AnnieAnoniMouse · 03/06/2017 08:33

I'd stop the visits.

He's a nasty, bullying, bastard & your DD isn't able to stand up for herself.

He's been nasty in other ways, but this pinning her down to scare & mock her is frightening. The nails are not the point here, they clearly don't need cutting, he's just trying to prove a point.

I'd take the decision out of DD's hands, I'd bear the brunt of her anger/upset at not seeing him.

You know how he was with you, you left him, you can't let this grow & grow with DD.

hesterton · 03/06/2017 08:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Crunchymum · 03/06/2017 08:42

In your situation OP, it is completely unacceptable for you ex to be pinning your DD down.

I'd be sending him written instructions that he is not to touch her nails or you will be seeking to reduce contact.

I am sadly in the camp who have had to pin down their kids. Usually for medicine. Worst was quite recently when both DP and I had to "restrain" our very poorly 4 year old to have a cannula fitted. He was so ill but so petrified that he managed to find the energy to scream and thrash and actually be quite difficult for 2 adults (plus a Dr and a nurse) to cannulise.

We didn't find it funny, in fact I still find the memory saddening.

Same child had to use a spacer when he was about 13m and would become hysterical upon seeing it, we tried everything but all that worked was one of us holding him still and the other administering it whilst both trying comfort him. Thankfully the spacer wasn't needed long term.

EatTheChocolateTeapot · 03/06/2017 08:51

I am sorry that you both are in this situation, it sounds like he is abusing her. Make sure she knows it is not her fault, nothing she does or doesnt't do causes that, the problem comes from him, not her.
Is there someone she could speak to? Perhaps at school? That could may be help her to have support from another adult.
Could you also have a diagnostic for her SN? Are you thinking of Asperger's?

Ktown · 03/06/2017 08:58

It's tricky but she needs her toe nails cutting at some point.
Can you work on her anxieties? If you just stop cutting her nails because she screams it won't her her long term at all. This is all part of growing up.

DawnOfTheMombie · 03/06/2017 09:01

YABVeryU to expect your 10 year old to stop it! What awful things to say to your daughter, you are laying the blame for the abuse on HER! Angry

AnnieAnoniMouse · 03/06/2017 09:07

Jesus klone (and some others) RTFT or at the very least the OP's posts. Her DD does not need her nails cutting in the few hours she's with her Dad. They have been cut before she goes.

This is NOT about her needing her nails cut. It's about him exerting control over her, the way he did with her Mum. He's a controlling, nasty, bullying bastard.

Why's for the love of God, are people still banging on about her nails?

LittleBooInABox · 03/06/2017 09:11

Sometimes kids have to have things done they don't want. Cutting nails is one of them. My DS was pinned down by two hospital staff to sedate him. When it becomes in their best interests then I see no issue.

It's a hard one. But to me it's tough love. Her toenails needed cutting espically if their infected.

AnnieAnoniMouse · 03/06/2017 09:14

Lottie. She is your DAUGHTER, it's your job to protect her. That's the bottom line. You left because of how he is, how do you expect her to protect herself? She can't. YOU can. Yes she'll kick off, but so what? Letting her take whatever he dishes out because she's desperate for his love & scared o f his anger isn't acceptable. He's pinning her down & terrifying her, you have to stop this. It's no different than if he was hitting her or locking her in a cupboard under the stairs. It's abuse for his own gratification.

Abuse, for his gratification. Think about that.

Then pull up your Big Girl Pants & tell him she isn't going there any more.

Protect your little girl.

Mummyoflittledragon · 03/06/2017 09:14

Pinning down and idiot baby and her not wanting to upset him. Definitely controlling and nasty behaviour. Do whatever you can to get back control of the situation even if that it stopping her seeing him and going to court. Maybe cancel the next visitation and see how she feels after that. Once she's been away from him for a while, she may decide she doesn't want to see him.

youarenotkiddingme · 03/06/2017 09:16

I was going to say you're over reacting and sometimes you need to do something for good of child. I've pinned down autistic ds for a haircut before!

But something is not right here. She sounds too permissive to him - and it's clear the nails don't actually need cutting. He sounds like he loves the control over her.

I'd be worried more about he sensitivities being emotional damage from emotional abuse than some SN.

Is there someone at her school you trust? Could you discuss this with them?

WhatToDoAboutThis2017 · 03/06/2017 09:18

Ffs people are spectacularly missing the point here. You don't just cut fungal nails; it doesn't work like that.

He doesn't need to cut them. How many times does it need to be said before people start hearing it?

AnnieAnoniMouse · 03/06/2017 09:19

Fuck sake. Read the fucking thread.

She will let me cut them with persuasion

They don't need doing when she goes there. It is a power trip thing for him

I cut her nails a day or two before she goes. They absolutely do not need doing. She clearly says he has forced her and pinned her down despite her explaining I've already done them and her screaming and crying for him not to

I don't think he actually is cutting them, WorraLiberty. Like you say - there's nothing left to cut. I think he just enjoys enforcing his power over her

....and several more in the same vein

Just STOP excusing the behaviour of this utter bastard. FGS.

Newtssuitcase · 03/06/2017 09:31

I had to sit on DS2 to get antibiotics into him when he was a toddler. It was literally the only way.

Newtssuitcase · 03/06/2017 09:32

But clearly if they don' actually need cutting then thats a different matter.

kaytee87 · 03/06/2017 09:39

he forced her to share his bed when she didn't want to.

^ this is what you should be concentrating on, absolutely not acceptable. What reason did he have for this?

Lynnm63 · 03/06/2017 09:46

He's a cunt. Can you have supervised contact? If he pulled this shit there he'd hopefully be prosecuted. I've never had to deal with contact so I apologise if I've misunderstood this from other threads on here.
If it were me I'd stop contact, note all of this down and let him go to court.

FuzzyPillow · 03/06/2017 09:48

YABU and NU....

Of course it is acceptable in some circumstances.One of my friends poor dds had cancer. She had to be pinned down and have tubes put up her nose, cannulas inserted, blood taken, etc etc etc.Not pleasant but the result if you didnt would be her death.

^ This. Of course they sometimes have to be pinned down for essential medical treatment.

However, YANBU if the father is cutting the nails unnecessarily frequently. I think it could help to give him a written document explaining the treatment regimen recommended by the doctor, so he stops any unnecessary cutting.

FuzzyPillow · 03/06/2017 09:49

Oh what, I see now there is more to this thread!! I apologise, I hardly ever post without RTFT, how silly of me!!

FuzzyPillow · 03/06/2017 09:53

Gosh, having RTFT there are some massive red flags here OP. some of the behaviour is very disturbing and needs to change for her sake. Flowers

Ktown · 03/06/2017 09:57

Oh dear I just read your other posts.
He is an idiot and the toe nails are the least of it.

RoseTico · 03/06/2017 10:23

She would absolutely kick off if I stopped her seeing him because she would be worried about his anger.

Anger resulting from fear, a very natural reaction. But then when time passes and she isn't having to be his passive little toy she'll start to relax. It's not right for a child to have to find ways to manage their abusive father.

Is there a court order? If not, stop contact. It will give her breathing space for a few months even if he pursues court right away. You'll likely get legal aid, and hopefully the court will agree that he should have supervised contact for a while.

Lostinaseaofbubbles · 03/06/2017 10:34

Get medical advice on the nails and ask them to write a note you can give to the father to say that she is following a course of treatment during which the nails shouldn't be cut.

On the initial subject though, sometimes it's just medically necessary. When DS1 was sick he really didn't want bloods taken and we tried to do it as kindly as possible, but in reality it was a nurse over one shoulder trying to distract him, a nurse over the other shoulder taking the bloods and me holding him against me as firmly as I could... oh, and antibiotics, that's always a joy!