Telling my Tory voting mother that she should pay for my daughter to go to university.

[sociallyacceptable]

My DD is very bright and could go to university if she doesn't arse about trying to be cool like I did. She is now 12.
My mum often talks about what she might do at university when she is older. I have been considering discouraging her from going because of the cost, we cannot afford to fund it ourselves unfortunately and she will have huge debt. It's kind of light hearted but I feel like telling my Tory voting mother that she should pay for her to go as she is not interested in voting to change this.

[BarbaraofSeville]

So how is she supposed to save for buying her own home, for holidays, for having a family when she starts at minus forty thousand?!!

Because it's a totally separate issue, more like a graduate tax and she doesn't have to pay it back before she can have these things. Honestly, the ignorance on how student finance works is staggering.

The 'debt' could be eleventy million pounds for all that it matters. Unless she becomes a very high earner, say over £50k pa, she won't pay all of it back anyway and anything remaining will be written off after 30 years.

Most people will pay 9% of their salary over £21k for 30 years and any years where she earns less than £21k for any reason (eg being a SAHP, or PT worker, or out of work) she will pay back precisely nothing. Even on £21-31k, the payments are quite small, under £100 pm.

[LiviaDrusillaAugusta]

And your DD could do a degree as a mature student later on down the line

[Firesuit]

Only skimmed the thread, so hope I'm the first person to point this out...

If going to university makes economic sense, the debt will be a price worth paying. But if it doesn't make economic sense, it would be better for the taxpayer to fund it, as then it doesn't matter if that money is wasted?

[neonrainbow]

Here's a revolutionary idea. Don't go to university and study history if you don't know what job you might get at the end of it. It's not rocket science.

[ChardonnaysPrettySister]

No, wasting someone else's money always makes more sense.

[sexcauldron]

I worked out from my recent payslip that if I paid the same amount every month until it was gone it would take 160 years, and this doesn't factor in the interest they slap on top. My debt actually went up by 2k. It's almost as if it's Monopoly money and it's not really there, I don't consider it debt. It's another line on the deductions of my payslip alongside tax and national insurance, that's all.

[KittyVonCatsington]

Fantastic Post OTheHugeManatee

[sociallyacceptable]

Here's a revolutionary idea. Don't go to university and study history if you don't know what job you might get at the end of it. It's not rocket science.

It's a shame that only kids from wealthy families can study these type of subjects though isn't it?

[hackmum]

Firesuit: "If going to university makes economic sense, the debt will be a price worth paying. But if it doesn't make economic sense, it would be better for the taxpayer to fund it, as then it doesn't matter if that money is wasted?"

On the contrary: as the situation currently stands, if you don't earn enough to pay back the loan, you don't have to pay it back. So the system of tuition fee loans positively encourages people to go to university even when it doesn't make economic sense.

[ephemeralfairy]

This is possibly beside the point but it's not just fee costs that put off those from poorer backgrounds, but living expenses. Yes you get a loan but depending on where you are in the country the loan will pay your rent and little else.
If they don't have significant parental contribution students are then in the position of having to find a part time job that pays enough to cover bills/travel/food/text books etc etc etc before they even think about having any fun. Oh, and they also have to work hard and get a good enough degree to justify all the debt.
Your DM may not realise this. Mine certainly doesn't. Maybe ask her in all seriousness if she would be prepared to find your DDs living expenses at uni if she's so keen on her going??

[TheGoodEnoughWife]

Hopefully with a degree earning potential is increased and so paying back that money is not such an issue.

If your brothers child has studied history, got a big debt but can't now find a job what was the point? And why would it be okay to do a degree that others are funding (if it were 'free') for you not to be able to get a job at the end of it? Why should other people pay in order for a person to do a degree that doesn't help them?

Either way - if it helps you get a better, higher paid job, and as such you can afford to pay the fees back or it doesn't help you then why should others pay for you to do that while they are working and paying tax?

[SuperBeagle]

It's a shame that only kids from wealthy families can study these type of subjects though isn't it?

No. Anyone can study it. It has equally dire job prospects for everyone, regardless of background.

Don't be intentionally obtuse. You're making your mother look better with every post.

[Treesinbloom]

Agree not to do history, but to do a degree that will be useful in getting a well-paid job.

I paid off my student debt and had bought my flat, gotten married and had a baby by the time I was 30. I chose a degree and masters which would lead to a well-paid job. So did DH.

[ChardonnaysPrettySister]

It's a shame that only kids from wealthy families can study these type of subjects though isn't it?

They will have just the same job prospects after they graduate.Why do you assume they are happy to sit on their arse doing nothing?

[Zaphodsotherhead]

I earn around £9,500 a year and four of my kids have recently graduated. Yes, they all have student debt, but three of them are currently earning very well (one is traveling). If you think I helped them out, on my salary (I'm single), you're deluded(!

[BandeauSally]

you have a terrible attitude OP. Real chip on your shoulder due to your own ignorance of the facts. Glad your daughter has her grandmother to encourage her.

[sysysysref]

That's ridiculous. You pay after you graduate and it's an investment in her future. I strongly disagree with remvong tuition fees for everyone, if she wants to go to university she should go and deal with the debt later. it's not compulsary to go to university so it should not be fully funded by the tax payer. If she wants to keep debt down she can go to university locally and live at home.

[BarbaraofSeville]

Here's a revolutionary idea. Don't go to university and study history if you don't know what job you might get at the end of it. It's not rocket science

Indeed, you'd have a much better chance of getting a decently paid job if you did study rocket science, as in astrophysics, some sort of engineering, or whatever it would be.

It's ironic that some degrees where the student is just doing it for interest, because their parents want them to, because they want to continue being a student and have the university experience and they don't end up in a graduate job, will be those where the student doesn't actually pay back their student loan and therefore the cost of their education is borne by the taxpayer anyway.

Wheras if someone does something useful like engineering or medicine, they will also repay most or all of their student loans.

[Firesuit]

Students should pay fees so that they have an incentive to evaluate the value of what they are getting. The universities should have more of an incentive to consider the quality of what they offer though. They should be required to refund the government the cost of any student loans written off.

[mynotsoperfectlife]

Excellent post Manatee

[Whileweareonthesubject]

When dc1 went, they had to get loans and a grant. They were also awarded a bursary by the university, based on the level of grant awarded. It was a large campus university in a smallish town, so like another poster, not enough part time jobs to go round. We gave a small amount of money for food ( basically the amount we would have spent on their food/electricity etc had the been at home and they got temporary jobs during the summer break. Not easy, but doable. Loans etc were brought in after dcs were already at school and we were on low income, so no real opportunity for us to save. If I was having children now, I'd take out an Insurance or savings plan specifically to help cover costs of further education.

[sociallyacceptable]

Anyway I've got the point and thanks for the advice as it has changed my opinion somewhat.
I did not go to university and perhaps did not fully understand the repayment of debt. I still don't know how she would fund living/ rent etc. I will look into this before I vent at my mother like a petulant child.
I will not be encouraging her to take anything other than vocational subjects.

[ChinaRose]

I don't know a single person who stresses about their student debt. I wouldn't dare ask my mum to cover university fees for any of my kids. All this talk about only wealthy kids can study certain subjects? It's all in your head!!! Let your daughter be a 12 year old for gods sake, she might decide to become a hairdresser by the time she is 16.

[prettywhiteguitar]

The new loans going out will have to be paid back once you are earning £17,000 or has no one noticed this ?

£18,000 a year is minimum wage

It's not 21k anymore

[KittyVonCatsington]

Good for you, OP-glad you feel a little better about the possibility of Uni.

I still don't know how she would fund living/ rent etc

Again, there are systems in place for this so don't worry (although in 6 years time it may be different so I wouldn't waste your time researching it too much right now-just don't discount encouraging your daughter in following the path she chooses)